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Hoodies, hats banned from shops

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posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:16 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
And this bit about “fashion” is weak. You know that. Okay some kids are shy and like to wear baggy clothes, but lets not confuse them with those that try INTENTIONALLY to look like a menace. There is a difference and you know it.


and what of these people that want to intentionally look menacing? That is your own perception. I can meet you at a point here, and agree that people wear them to appear less approachable. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. Some people don't want to be bothered, and putting on sunglasses, a hoodie or hat are all ways of doing this.

I don't think the "bit about fashion" is weak either, because one of the many influences on fashion trends and culture are social movements. I promise you that in the near future, more and more face obstructing apparel will become popular. They have been making hoodies with facemasks built into them now for a while, designs included:





menacing? hell yes. intentional? hell yes. illegal? no.

Another example of the growing trend would be all of the Guy Fawkes masks being used for Anonymous protests. That has also spurred lots of fashion trends to be adopted in the near future.

I agree that private property owners are free to ban such clothing. I also realize that private property is being swallowed up by large, government funded corporations every more as the days go on.



Your anger is rather obvious. Seriously.


Again, your perception has clouded reality. Perhaps you are slightly sensitive, and not used to someone passionate about what they believe in.

p.s. thanks for inspiring these long posts, I rarely get to show off my avatar this much.


p.p.s. notice the long hair, wide brim hat and baggy cloak. Perhaps I'm partial.


[edit on 5-9-2008 by scientist]




posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:27 PM
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Originally posted by scientist
and what of these people that want to intentionally look menacing? That is your own perception. I can meet you at a point here, and agree that people wear them to appear less approachable. I don't think there is anything wrong with that. Some people don't want to be bothered, and putting on sunglasses, a hoodie or hat are all ways of doing this.


Be bothered? Strangers trying to make conversation in line with them perhaps? Fine then wear offensive t-shirts, cover yourself in tattoos, wear leather, heavy biker boots, shave your head (in fact please do).

But if you choose to wear the apparel of the criminal element, if you choose to dress yourself in a way that imitates criminals and has a practical use in hiding weapons and avoiding identification during criminal pursuits, then expect to be treated as such.

People have a choice. If they choose to look like dangerous thugs and they are treated like dangerous thugs then it seems quite fair to me! You think freedom only applies to fashion? Apparently store owners have freedom too! They have the freedom to bar those that choose to look like criminals.

Hey, the more that I think on this, the more I realize you are trying to infringe on the rights and freedoms of decent store owners!

[edit on 5-9-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:32 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
But if you choose to wear the apparel of the criminal element, if you choose to dress yourself in a way that imitates criminals and has a practical use in hiding weapons and avoiding identification during criminal pursuits, then expect to be treated as such.

See this is total BS.

Criminals wear orange jumpsuits and are kept in prison, that's how they dress.

People not in jail, are free to dress however they prefer to.

You're assuming that teenagers wearing hoodies and hats are criminals. Damn, I remember being told about judging a book by its cover a long time ago...



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
if you choose to wear the apparel of the criminal element


and again, here is where we differ. You say that the clothes make the criminal. I say that the criminal makes the criminal. The clothes make someone who wanted to wear those clothes, for whatever personal reason they might have.

Stop being so myopic. There's no need for it.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:41 PM
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You got sucked up in the the matrix glitch there (first post on a new page invisible).

Well I will say if the fashion trend becomes black leather hoods, or hockey masks, or executioner hoods, I may change my views.

Until then, I will treat those that look like criminals as potential criminals, and I will SUPPORT the right of decent store owners to forbid such attire on their premise. Notice the word RIGHT? Yeah.

Though hey, on the upside I have seen some young kids in stores and such that DRESSED like criminals but obviously were not, and I just laughed. From now on I do believe I will start lecturing them instead, after 5 minutes of being embarrassed in line by that "strange woman" they will surely be FAR more careful about their fashion in the future. : )



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:46 PM
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reply to post by tezzajw
 


Banks have the same dress code. Again it is not about saying everyone that wears one is a criminal. It is about sorting the criminals out and allowing room for those who are going to make the private property owner money.

Those who really want to shop there will abide by the rules set in place. Those who do not agree with it or the criminals that don’t want to show their “faces” so to speak will not go there. The owner may at first lose some business from s few customers but will pick it up in those that is lost before due to the criminal types hanging out.

All in all they may not break out and gain more money but they just might stop losing money which one can think of as a gain.

Plain and simple if you do not like the owner’s rules don’t go there. If you really like the place abide by the rules. Either that or you can bring the government in on it and let them decide what people should be wearing.

Raist



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:50 PM
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And actually I should probably mention, in my locale the look of baggy pants and hoods is typically very "genuine".

It is not a fashion statement adopted from other cultures, it was INVENTED by the lowest element in THIS culture. And honestly, it is rather rare to see those "not of that culture" sporting the look, despite their age.


[edit on 5-9-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 09:52 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
From now on I do believe I will start lecturing them instead, after 5 minutes of being embarrassed in line by that "strange woman" they will surely be FAR more careful about their fashion in the future. : )


I can personally attest that lecturing (in the context you are implying) has never solved, or swayed me on an issue, ever. To the contrary, it simply evokes resistance, which can either lead to a loss in rapport - or for some, it creates rebellion.

Neither seem to be positive outcomes, so how about you leave them be, since you are so adamant about them leaving you be? Can't you maintain mutual respect? If not, then I now formally introduce you to the root cause of the issue at hand.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:01 PM
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Originally posted by scientist
Neither seem to be positive outcomes, so how about you leave them be, since you are so adamant about them leaving you be? Can't you maintain mutual respect? If not, then I now formally introduce you to the root cause of the issue at hand.


As stated, where I live the look is typically very very genuine. I have only seen a very few non-black kids wearing that attire. So really here it is not an issue. It is common but one does not question the authenticity, especially if the hood is up.

But if I should see white/asian/hispanic kids wearing it, decent kids that aspire to look like thugs, yeah I do believe I will say something. Apparently someone needs too.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:07 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
But if I should see white/asian/hispanic kids wearing it, decent kids that aspire to look like thugs, yeah I do believe I will say something. Apparently someone needs too.

I'd like to see what you wear down the street. How well would you react to someone giving you a lecture on your dress sense?

You probably dress as offensively to them, as they do to you.

Remember this, the biggest criminals of all wear suits, collars and ties. How often do you lecture them?



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:32 PM
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Originally posted by tezzajw
You probably dress as offensively to them, as they do to you.


As state it is cultural. Hoodies pulled down are cause for concern here, real concern.

On the otherhand many would be offended by very short hair, and regular jeans and a confederate flag on a car. Just as "unconventional" yet to me it is a sign of safety, of not worrying that they will pull an unregistered firearm and start shooting the place up.

There is a difference between "unconventional" and "un-pc" and "criminal".

Tezzajw so what is your story? You are full of opinions, where do they originate?

[edit on 5-9-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:36 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
Tezzajw so what is your story? You are full of opinions, where do they originate?

I'm human and I think - that's why I have opinions.

Trust me, if there was any way that I could buy a ticket off this rock, then I'd be doing so. Hell, I might even wear a hoodie and steal myself a ticket instead... Better yet, I'll wear a suit, tie and collar and hack my way into the ticket box office and not only steal the ticket, but all of their takings too. They can be wired into my fake account.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:40 PM
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Originally posted by tezzajw
Trust me, if there was any way that I could buy a ticket off this rock, then I'd be doing so.


LOL. No worries, we all get off this rock eventually. One way or another. In the meantime we can annoy eachother online. : )



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:41 PM
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When I strut around nude people find it offensive. What a load of ass.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:44 PM
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Originally posted by Dulcimer
When I strut around nude people find it offensive. What a load of ass.

Dulcimer, the least you could do is put a hoodie on! Hahaha! Then again, maybe half the population would object to that!

You know how fragile some people are when it comes to fashion!

What gets me is when people walk around in bikinis at beach towns without anyone blinking an eye... yet, try and walk around town in your underware. Same difference? Not to the prissy prudes.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:48 PM
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Good point. I should be able to walk around in my underwear free of any concern.

The world would be better naked.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:50 PM
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Originally posted by tezzajw
What gets me is when people walk around in bikinis at beach towns without anyone blinking an eye... yet, try and walk around town in your underware. Same difference? Not to the prissy prudes.


Yeah real nudity is not like the stuff you see in the movies. There is a reason Yahweh forbid it. Really there is.

Though I see your point; I would definitelly choose a world of hoodies over the alternative.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
Though I see your point; I would definitelly choose a world of hoodies over the alternative.

People are far too uptight, that's the problem. Instead of worrying what they're doing, they're more interested in seeing what other people are doing...

Whatever - Dulcimer, I'm buying a ticket to your planet.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 11:05 PM
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Originally posted by tezzajw
People are far too uptight, that's the problem. Instead of worrying what they're doing, they're more interested in seeing what other people are doing...


Society has standards. Get it? And you think the standards are set by the police or the government. No. Standards should be set by decent people, then we would not NEED the police or government to set such basic rules.

Though I do not want to see nudity accepted in western society, in third world countries where starvation is common, who cares. In societies where food is plentiful nudity is really really not something that needs to become mainstream. Humans do not have fur. Clothes are cheap. Society is already stessful enough.

And if you argue that point, you are just trying to be difficult for the sake of it. If you honestly want to push this issue I ask you to imagine standing in line at the grocery store and looking at the naked bodies of those in front of you.



posted on Sep, 5 2008 @ 11:17 PM
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Originally posted by Sonya610
Standards should be set by decent people, then we would not NEED the police or government to set such basic rules.

Give me a break, Pris (your avatar, not your attitude).

Decent people don't know what good clothes are!
'Decent' people in this thread object to hoodies being worn by teens!

If you set standards, then accept the fact that beyond two standard deviations of your normalised population, that 5% of people will still dress however they like.



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