Palin Loves her Grandchild, Obama See His as Punishment

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posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:31 AM
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reply to post by jamie83
 



what do you think of the republicans calling the situation a "problem" i didnt hear them say it was a gift & sacred. Just that it was a "problem" and "all people have problems"

there we have it republicans think that babies are "problems"

this was live on sky news right now at the GOP convention.

[edit on 2-9-2008 by yeti101]




posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:33 AM
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reply to post by intrepid
 


Still...

Regardless of what he is discussing, he ascribes to the consequence of pregnacy the term "punished", as opposed to some other term like 'burden' or 'disadvantage'.



Originally posted by maybereal11
For f^&ks sake enough of this ugly crap and irrevelant BS.


Why is a truthful discussion of Obama's choice of words 'ugly crap'? And, why is it you get to decide irrelevancy for others?



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:33 AM
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Originally posted by yeti101
not evryone can afford to travel abroad for an abortion. Also your saying its ok that abortions are carried out in other countries just not your own?


What I think doesn't matter. This thread is about what the candidates think.

Gov. Palin stated that she believes her children, and her daughter's baby, are blessings from God. I agree.

Obama said that if his daughters made a mistake he wouldn't want them punished with a baby. I find that an abhorrent attitude, and indicative of a really messed up value system.

Think the logic through. How would they be punished? Would they be unable to attend college? Get a high paying job? Be a big-time lawyer and have a Mercedes?

The implication is that the punishment would be in terms of money. The implication is that somebody who thinks a baby is punishment loves money more than the child.

That isn't the type of person I would want in position of POTUS.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:36 AM
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Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by sos37
 


blame thats a good word. I'd put the blame on people like mccaine who block funding for safe sex education. Or the religous people who say using contraceptive is a sin.

and using a word like blame implies there should be punishment. Is the punishment the baby? you sound like you agree with obama



Personally, the only time I agree with the woman's right to an abortion is in cases of rape or if it endangers the life of the mother. I'm not a purist in the sense of pro-life because I don't believe a blanket rule covers it all.

On the flip side, I absolutely do not agree with late term or "partial birth" abortions. If a fetus can be delivered and it can survive at that time even though the deliver is very early, then to kill it is, without a doubt, murder.

Also, I don't remember McCain voting against any sex education funding bills that weren't loaded with pork barrel spending (add-ons by the Democrats) that made the bill(s) unfeasible. I agree that education is the most powerful weapon we have against teen and unwanted pregnancy.

Adoption is also another option that must not be overlooked! There are plenty of barren women in this country who would anything to be able to adopt a newborn.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:37 AM
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reply to post by jamie83
 



its a punishment if they dont want it.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:40 AM
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Originally posted by yeti101
what do you think of the republicans calling the situation a "problem"


I wonder if you compared the definition of 'problem' with the definition of 'punishment' whether you'd continue to make the point you just did.




[edit on 2-9-2008 by loam]



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:41 AM
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reply to post by dbates
 


Wow, I never insinuated anything about any one. So lets get that out of the way first. Second thing is, it was a simple question. This is a site filled with information. If I was mistaken, then just simply let me know that I am misinformed. Please don't misuse my quote as a judgment. I judge no one and I think everyone is entitled to their opinion. Now, with that being said, thank you for informing me correctly. You learn something new every day and today is no exception to that rule. Good day



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:43 AM
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Originally posted by yeti101
reply to post by jamie83
 



its a punishment if they dont want it.


Then, again, I argue (except in cases of rape) that if a woman absolutely does not want a baby, they should take up a life of abstinence or always practice safe sex (in other words, be responsible). Or consider adoption at the end of the pregnancy.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 11:55 AM
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why are you using Obamas hypothetical non-existant grandchildren as a political football? (and palins grandchild too in the context)?

hah , im just messing with you - just thought id point it out


carry on



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:04 PM
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Originally posted by yeti101

what do you think of the republicans calling the situation a "problem" i didnt hear them say it was a gift & sacred. Just that it was a "problem" and "all people have problems"

there we have it republicans think that babies are "problems"



Are you kidding? This is such a bogus comparison on so many levels.

1. What republicans are calling it has nothing to do with the candidates, Palin and Obama, or this thread. Palin thinks the kids are a blessing, Obama considers that his own grandchildren might be a punishment to his kids.

2. A problem is a challenge. It's something that is unexpected and causes a person to make adjustments to still reach their goals. A punishment implies that an outside force is giving a person pain as the direct result of their action.

This makes Obama's statement even worse. It implies he believes in God, which he does, and believes God is punishing kids for sinning by making them get pregnant.

How else could you explain a Christian like Obama thinking that a baby *might* even be a punishment?



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:13 PM
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Originally posted by jamie83
Gov. Palin stated that she believes her children, and her daughter's baby, are blessings from God. I agree.

Obama said that if his daughters made a mistake he wouldn't want them punished with a baby.


Or an STD.

And let's not forget that the father of Palin's baby is NOT in favor of having kids and might favor her having an abortion:
www.mtv.com...


I find that an abhorrent attitude, and indicative of a really messed up value system.


I find the same in a group of people who claim to value marriage and the family and self control, whose children seem to indicate (Bush daughters, Palin's daughter, etc) that they don't teach what they preach.


Think the logic through. How would they be punished? Would they be unable to attend college? Get a high paying job? Be a big-time lawyer and have a Mercedes?


Yes, yes, yes, yes, at higher risk of depression (because everyone's having fun and you're the only one with a baby and single women with toddlers aren't often invited to fun parties), higher risk of abuse of mother and child, higher risk of drugs and alcohol (depression), much lower income, lack of father role models for the baby, moving from relationship to relationship to find one that will take the child, grandparents raising child, etc...

Just talk to some of the people who have gone through this.

Yes, Palin's daughter may escape this because of who she is. But Palin's family is supposed to be a role model for the US and there are pictures proportedly showing Palin's daughter at drinking parties at age 15.

And if she and her family can't control her own child as well as I did mine (no underage sex, no drinking parties) or many another Democrat did... then how can we respect her as a public figure?

It's like Brittney Spears' mother writing about motherhood and the proper way to raise kids.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:17 PM
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I hate to speak for someone else, especially someone much smarter than me but-
I think what Obama was getting at is that people including his own children can make their lives much more difficult with an unplanned pregnancy. Education can certainly help prevent that.
Does anyone actually think that he or, his wife would look upon their grandchild as a punishment? I'd say that would be judging character very poorly to put it mildly.

Don't get too caught up in the words, listen to what the guy's saying.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by Byrd

And if she and her family can't control her own child as well as I did mine (no underage sex, no drinking parties) or many another Democrat did... then how can we respect her as a public figure?


It really is starting to become comical watching liberals and Dems reaction to this.

Now making sure your teenagers are abstinent is a criteria for being a good parent?

Wow....

Bill Clinton couldn't control himself from getting a BJ in the Oval Office and yet he is an exulted leader of the party, and you don't think Sarah Palin is qualified to be POTUS because her 17-year old, like 90% of the population, had sex?

Seriously, you'd be better off going back to how Obama is about a new kind of politics or something. Oh sorry, I forgot. He picked Washington insider and father of corporate lobbyist Joe Biden as his running mate. Better think of something else then.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Alxandro
I guess we must ignore a Freudian slip if Obama does it.
Yet when people on the right "slip up" there is hell to pay.


What slip up? He didn't slip up. The quote was taken out of context by the OP. In other words, not true. What Obama DID say is quite true. Educate the kids so that they aren't burdened by matters that they are incapable of handling.


That's my point exactly, people on the right are always taken out of context before the witch hunt begins.
Ok, it's no slip up, so he said what he feels but it's ok because it's Obama. He is saying babies are not only a burden and a mistake they are also punishment.

Why does Obama feel he has a right to speak for everyone? ...why should he get away with it?

Babies should not be treated as material objects. I can see making the mistake of buying a home or a car and saying I'm punished with the payments, but why apply this logic to a baby?

Is life so cheap to dems?

Another analogy is this: If we make the mistake of voting for a liberal, I don't want this country punished with Obama.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:36 PM
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I'm sure if Obama actually had a grandchild he wouldn't feel this way.

I remember my grandma telling me that when my mom got pregnant that she wanted her to get it aborted, (because she didn't like my dad), of course she doesn't feel that way today, she loves her 5 beautiful grandchildren and wouldn't change it if she could.

And I remember before I came out to my parents about being gay they would always talk about if one of their kids were like that they would disown them, and when I told them yeah they didn't like it, but they accepted me and still loved me.

I guess they just don't know what it's like untill it actually happens, could be the same situation for him, and probably is for alot of parents. But I guess that's up for everyone else to decide just my opinion.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by Alxandro
Another analogy is this: If we make the mistake of voting for a liberal, I don't want this country punished with Obama.


WOW.... I wish I could give you a WATS for this one line.


You hit the nail on the head with this one.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 12:57 PM
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Originally posted by Uniceft17
I'm sure if Obama actually had a grandchild he wouldn't feel this way.


Maybe, maybe not.

Truth is he doesn't seem to have ever been very involved in his own kids lives. Wonder if he was self-projecting when he made the "punishment" comment? I wonder if he believed his own kids were a punishment to him?

I wonder if anybody in the MSM would have the balls to ask him this question in the debates:

"Senator Obama, in light of your own comments about not wanting your daughters to be 'punished' with a baby, did you think your own daughters were sent as punishment to you? And if not, why? What differentiates babies sent as punishment from those that are not?"



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 01:17 PM
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Obamas view is indicitive of his feelings on the subject... Like many Americans he views having a child as a "hold back" for a woman.

I won't break his cajones for saying punishment, I hate pc word games

But it is what it IS

and that is: a statement as the majority of Americans and people in Western civilization feel, Women who have babies are LESS than the rest of us, career is more important, self indulgence is more imortant (me, me, me) Finance is more important, children are a burden and:

Raising children is not a Good aspiration for a woman

and this isn't Obama, it's Feminism that was hijacked away from actual Women, by men, lesbians, the media, the Un and Big Govt


We live on an agenda of population control and it has become since the 60's Public Opinion due to a barage of brainwashing

I disagree Vehemently on the subject, we are apying the price in our own, affluent, highly resource available societies for 3rd world nations that exercise ZERO birth control and in the end it mostly comes down to the UN because they can get a message out to the developed but not the undeveloped world via the media

and it makes us weak and it is NOT a satisfying life for most women to remain barren

Most of our problems, high taxes, social security failure, lack of competitive military man power even in these 2 very low key wars, lack of educated workers, even immigration feeling theatening to many of us

all boil down to )in america) lack of children being produced by 2nd-3rd generation Americans who speak the language and grow up capable of going on to college etc, etc

The elderly border out weighing youth, so of course taxes are high, the ability to fight a war is low, social security is in danger et al...

and our only growth is via immigration...so of course the culture is changing and we are slipping into becoming a 2nd world nation slowly but surely because our labor force is 1/5 3rd world fresh off the boat

and why? because popular culture says... having babies is an unworthy life, doesn't deserve financial support, makes you a looser...

and Like Obama... we say Baby in the same context as STD

and abort them like abortion is a shot of penecillian

and is this actually Good for America?

No our males are just shy of sexual predators because few have accountability to act like men if they get a girl pregnant, they know she will (take care of the problem) so sex is meaningless and Far from Femanism women are "B17@h3$ and hoes" Meat, no respect is given

and women, my personal experience has been that 3/4 reach their 30's and look at their careers and go OMG what a crap life this is, why did I want to work

and I went through that myself, The mothe rof my children reached 30 and woke up one dday and didn't want to work anymore and just be with her kids and be a mother (she got smart) it was unfulfilling

But men are not prepared to handle the finances alone and it is acceptable for others to raise your kids

and what does that get us?

State educated kids raised in after school centers plugged with Govt agenda as oppossed to parental teachings

And we Wonder WHY, we are dumbed down as a society and people believe what they are told?

Motherhood... should be the focus of feminism, the first run was being allowed to work... to not be slaves, to not be in a position where men could "Own" a woman via financial means

But what women asked for was not to be FORCED to work and live a mans life, only to have the option if the man was jerk or died and they needed too

What no woman wanted or enjoys is a world in which when she is a mother she is a piece of garbage who is "doing nothing with her life"

Obamas words reflect our culture which frankly in many ways is hardly still a step up from Islam in terms of women being treated as they deserve.

Women can work and have alot of sex ...YAY, but still are not respected and the value of what they give us...the whole of our population lol, the quality of our citizens was what we lost when we gave them some basic freedoms

we didn't fix anything we replaced one set of bad treatment with another...

Women are still treated as the lesser sex

Comparing a Child to an STD... this is a MALE thing, a major problem, because it is them that will bare the financial repsonsability and many men fear this (maybe rightly so give economic reality) but up in washington, 1,000 different things take financial precedence over... the money, tax cuts etc for women to NOT be financially burdened by having children

and it comes down to, culture, a set of beliefs pushed on this nation by the UN to curb population growth and for what purpose that actually aids America? None

Every child is a tax payer LOL, LOL eventually, the economics and growth are in favor of GROWTH!!!!

What si Growth? Ask China they know it's more workers, yeah you want to balance growth for sustainability

But this agenda, the babies are stds agenda is Negative Growth

Obama I cannot support largely on this issue... We NEED to make children or there will be no America, incentives should be given out, not negative remarks

North America has plenty of room and resources and... If OIL being the only resource we actually lack is an issue than... we will find another way, and we WILL, trains and planes get us across the country, subways can be built, nuclear plants can light our homes...

we'd be fine the Fopod and water and land are in abundance to a degree that is Amazing in America

The UN, wants our food for 3rd world nations, they want to tax our water for 3rd world nations

and they want us to believe having children makes our women whores...

so may the UN burn and die imho, it's a waste of American time

We are Europe Asia and Africas, food, source, war police, water supply... financial aid?

Anything else? Oh yeah we shouldn't have babies so people in Zimbabwe can have 11 at a time that we get to see on Tv covered in flies and fear irrationally that our families one extra kid will make us like that



Obama of course has more money slated for those places too!











[edit on 2-9-2008 by mopusvindictus]



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 01:20 PM
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reply to post by jamie83
 


Obama was never involved in his kids lives

Hillary was never involved in her kids lives

Palin is the only one... we have ever gotten who actually is a FAMILY oriented leader... Reagans daughter hated him

Greed and failure a system that destabilizes the family

NO Brave New World for me.



posted on Sep, 2 2008 @ 01:29 PM
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But you know lol... if you go as a woman and abort those babies, don't have kids, or wait until your old, Get a great career at walmart or actaully get a great career and pay of that 100G in student loans over your 20's and 30's instead of using it (that time and money) to have children...

have your one kid at 36 who is a little wierd because you body is a little worn out

Don't worry

because for 50 cents a day you can sponsor umpchucka and recieve a letter once a month....

[edit on 2-9-2008 by mopusvindictus]

[edit on 2-9-2008 by mopusvindictus]





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