Economy in Recession? More Liberal Lies?, page 3
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reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 09:17 PM by mybigunit
reply to post by jetxnet





The only recession in America is with regard to Housing scandals and high Gas prices.


and then you go on to say


America is only 300 million people. As the American middle class shrinks, there will be even less of those 300 million consumers.


Hmm if the only recession is the housing scandels and the high gas why is the middle class shrinking like it is?

The answer we are being robbed. Big government spending by the 2 party crime family has bankrupted our country. We have high inflation, a worthless dollar, wages going down not up, and a 10 trillion dollar debt with a 400 billion dollar interest payment due. Considering that the last government income was 2 trillion that means 20% of the tax dollars I pay to the government goes to big bankers. Oh and not to mention 5 trillion of the debt came directly from George W Bush. So keep believing there is a difference between the two parties and vote in McCain or Obama for that matter. I will say this at least Obama is going to raise taxes and make you pay up front instead of this put it on the charge card and pay big bankers big interest like Bush has been doing and like McCain will do.



reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 09:18 PM by mybigunit
reply to post by mental modulator



Actually its over 31 thousand dollars. You a little short.

www.brillig.com...



[edit on 31-8-2008 by mybigunit]


reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 09:26 PM by mental modulator
Originally posted by jetxnet

Hey listen no doubt about it China has had a great run. But when America quits consuming you will start to see their factories close in mass. When that happens you will start to see their working class collapse. With Chinas rising inflation making costs go up you will start to see factories come back to America also. Just a fact in fact you are starting to see it now


I wish that were the case, but other countries are starting to consume more of China's products than American products.

America is only 300 million people. As the American middle class shrinks, there will be even less of those 300 million consumers.

China has over 1 Billion people. As they gain a middle class, most of those consumers will be buying Chinese.

China is becoming self-sustained.

[edit on 31-8-2008 by jetxnet]


your about 40 million off POP ulation wise.


YOU see as the middle class shrinks we will become like Mexico...

The companies will make all the choices and your voice will become smaller and smaller...

The politicians, like in MEXICO will appeal to your pride and hormones and wave the flag in your face, while the pick pocket you and continue to lower the riches taxes.

As goes MEXICO will go USA... JOHNMCLAME!!! And GoddessSARAH!!!

Jetxnet and others on here don't seem to big on history,,, we are walking down the road of MEXICO, piss poor or A FIVE STORY MANSION thats all there will be.

As in Mexico the conservative are trying to conserve the powers that be and the status quo, which is to make money at any and all costs.


Mexico waited to long to change and now look at the place. Almighty anointed GoddesSarah!


reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 10:54 PM by mybigunit
reply to post by saturnine_sweet



Star for you ...someone sees the big picture. I think this op is just baiting to see how many flames he can get.


reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 10:54 PM by wutone
While technically the U.S. is not in a recession, the U.S. is experiencing the shock of several bubbles and will be effected adversely by a global recession.

#1 Housing Crisis

With the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act, banks were allowed to securitize loans. This created a moral hazard within the banking industry. Banks started lending to anyone because they can just sell off the debts. This increased housing prices which increased investor demand for these debts, which increased building activity, which increased the economy. Once the payments on homes became to high, the whole thing collapsed and shocked the economy.

#2 Credit Crunch

Because of the housing crash, investors stopped buying loans, not just for mortgages but for almost everything else as well. Banks had to go with their pre-repeal Glass-Steagall Act days by default. Loans are now hard to attain without investors buying debt and with the effects of non-securitized loans going bad, banks are sitting on their good loans trying to gain capital while avoiding any lending activity that can expose them even more than they already are. The lack of credit flowing through the economy will dry up capital that many businesses need to operate, hence there are a lot of businesses failing.

# 2 1/2 Credit crunch

Due to the housing crash, an ENORMOUS amount of money was lost by foreign investors. Global economic woes are spreading because of this and will probably affect the U.S. If Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac collapses without bailout, the Chinese economy will fail due to their huge investments into the U.S. The Chinese bought these investments to keep their currency where it is, not because they were nice but because it increases their exports. This is a wildcard and I have no clue what can possibly happen here.

#3 Oil prices.

Whether by terrorists, manufactured demand, or speculation, high oil prices increase inflation. This is nailing people directly with fuel prices and indirectly with other commodities increasing. The money from the high prices is also flowing to foreign countries. With the housing crash, those foreign countries are not investing as much in the U.S. so there is more vanishing capital.

#4 government spending.

The government is running up huge deficits which further decrease the value of the dollar. This increases the oil prices but does help with exports. Exports are what drove the economy in the plus side along with the stimulus package.

I was looking for a reason to disagree with Jamie on something and I guess I partially found it.

In all, the economic climate is dangerous. While we are not technically in a recession, the confidence in the economy is teetering and all it takes is one bad financial failure to set everything off. Confidence is everything, if that breaks, that's it. The current market losses around the world and the panic going on within the banking system tells exactly where the confidence level is. However, if the economy can break out of the credit crunch, then everything should be alright.

As for who is to blame, it goes to both parties. Bill Clinton signed the
Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act which repealed the Glass-Steagall Act and got the whole subprime mess started. The republicans are the ones that wrote that law in the first place.

Both parties are fond of increased spending, while the republicans are fond of borrowing to support the spending and the dems are fond of taxing the hell out of everything.

The Dems have a weak energy policy based on undeveloped technology while at the same time hindering proven energy technology because they believe that the Earth never had a climate cycle until man showed up.

TLDR version, the economy isn't rosy, the liberals aren't exactly lying but they are trying to cover their involvement.


reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 11:03 PM by mybigunit
reply to post by wutone



Heh you cant just "break" out of a credit crisis. The only way to get out of this mess is for mass bankruptcies to occur and for the housing values to go down at least another 30 to 50%. That is the only way this situation is going to be fixed. But the government is not allowing this to happen. Instead they are printing more and more money to prop up bad debt. It hasnt worked and it will not work this time. A crash needs to happen to fix this situation. It sucks but that is how it has to be.


reply posted on 31-8-2008 @ 11:31 PM by wutone
Originally posted by mybigunit
reply to
post by wutone



Heh you cant just "break" out of a credit crisis. The only way to get out of this mess is for mass bankruptcies to occur and for the housing values to go down at least another 30 to 50%. That is the only way this situation is going to be fixed. But the government is not allowing this to happen. Instead they are printing more and more money to prop up bad debt. It hasnt worked and it will not work this time. A crash needs to happen to fix this situation. It sucks but that is how it has to be.


It's not government, its governments. Almost every country with a fiat currency and a central bank is doing this. The subprime bubble and crash were the first dominoes to fall.

Money isn't being printed to prop up bad debt, it is printed to prop up the banking industry which runs the the printing in the first place.

It is entirely possible to break out of the credit crisis but the sacrifice would be much of the banking industry. IT CAN be contained be a new monetary policy.
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