New ex-Christian who is lost in his own freedom and uncertainty.

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posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 07:33 AM
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I have to say Good Wolf, your on your journey home young man. I`m going on 53 this month, and it`s been a long journey for me (in understanding what we are really here for). I was not raised with the church, but have read the bible myself. I believe in a creator, and that all of us are just a part of that force, being or what ever you may want to call it. That force is both male and female in nature, or ying and yang, good and bad. We are a balance of all aspects. That is what the soul is in nature. That is why we have all aspects of this in our world around us each and every day. We were given at the time of our creation, free will, to grow spiritually as fast and in any way we choose. I have had many argue with me, that God gave us free will, but then say that God restircts us in that free will, which is totally illogical no matter how you look at it. It would then become limited will, not free will. So that in itself tells me that the teachings they want me to believe are wrong.

I was asked why I thought that. My responce was, how could a good and loving creator (or God) tell us one thing (free will), then tell us another (limited will). Their responce was, well, God can do that, he can do anything he wants. I said oh, God can lie to us then? If God is perfect, God can not lie. Well, they didn`t have a comeback to that. I have found many things the bible speaks of that are contradictory in nature. Many tell me that it is the living word of God, and was written by God. I ask, how can God do that if God is spirit in nature? They say, God gave the word through man to write down. Ok then, so man wrote it down. Man can make mistakes, man can take things and misinterpret them by not fully understanding them (understanding that man in those days did not have the education we have today). Man changes things to better fit his own understanding of them.

I have read that there are many parts of the bible that are left out, or missing. If so, why? Are they missing for a reason? Were they left out for a reason? If so, why? Plain and simple reasoning and gut feeling tells me why. It is a control factor, a church control factor in simpler terms. Why would the church want to control us? Well, let`s look at it in this way. If we were to fully think for ourselves, and do some very deep soul searching on our own (without the churches involvement), we would soon understand the true purpose of our being (who we are, and why we are here). That means that we would no longer need the church to guide us. Now, what would happen if that were to come to pass? The church would lose both power and money. They would lose the hold they have had on humanity sinse the church was formed. We would no longer need to turn to them for guidance. As you have done Good Wolf.

We are all one, yet seperate. I believe God, after our creation, allowed us to explore all that is, including love, hate, good, evil, life and death, all aspects of physical being, without the creators interference (the free will part of it). Now, when I talk of being one, I mean of one mind with god, all of us together in spirit. Now, when I talk of seperate, I mean, we are using the free will to learn all the aspects I stated above, as individuals, or seperate from one another. It would be amazing, if you were to take all of the things we have experienced as human beings, from the first time we stepped on this world, until this very day, just the thought of all these things would blow your mind. The thing we are running into, is the fact that we have become so immursed in this physical world, and thinking of ourselves as seperate beings, we have forgotten our true roots. We are all of one mind and being with God. We so much want to think of ourselves as individuals, that we are forgetting that we are not.

God does not judge us for this, we do. We judge ourselves, it is all part of the learning experience. God loves and trusts us enough(sinse we are a part of God) to do the right thing in the end. And what is the right thing in the end? That we grow spirituallty, back to the one, at our own pace. We are children who were given the time to explore far from home(god), and that as we explore, the journey takes us from our start and leads us back home (God).

There is nothing to fear in all of this Good Wolf. We create our own fears, demons and hell while we are here. So don`t be afraid to explore on your own. Don`t be afraid to go deep inside to find God, he is there. That is why we have the saying, seek and you will find, knock on that door deep inside of you, God will answer.





[edit on 1-9-2008 by FiatLux]




posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 07:38 AM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


Before I get into a big long thing with you, can I ask this question? What exactly do you think God is? It would probably be good to know what it is that you don't believe in. I ask this because what I think God is is probably not what you think God is/is not.

Because I know what I think God is and because what I think God is, I know to exist; I not only believe in God, but I know for a fact that God exists.

If you can, explain what it is You think God is / is not.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 08:09 AM
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reply to post by FiatLux
 


I like you. Have a star.

I said previously that I had a mind for science and philosophy and I tended to over think everything. This started when I was 4 when my mum introduced me to the cosmos with a book on space. I was nine when I decided everything was one big domino set. Everything that is happening is a great cascade of reactions. I was 14 we i learnt that I subscribed to the Determinism philosophy. I don't believe there is free will this problematic to the god concept, especially the christian god; if there is no free will then many are predestined to go to hell and god would know what was going to happen, in fact since he designed the cosmos, he willingly must have made people just to send them to hell.

Even without christianity it shows he doesnt care much for humanity.

If he does exist, then this is the god I believe in.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 08:15 AM
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Originally posted by bruxfain
reply to post by Good Wolf
 


Before I get into a big long thing with you, can I ask this question? What exactly do you think God is? It would probably be good to know what it is that you don't believe in. I ask this because what I think God is is probably not what you think God is/is not.

Because I know what I think God is and because what I think God is, I know to exist; I not only believe in God, but I know for a fact that God exists.

If you can, explain what it is You think God is / is not.


The privious post I had a stab at that. you I dont know that I can tell you what I dont believe. I just dont believe that god is the god of the bible; forgiving yet merciless, close yet distant, constant yet changing his mind or the kind or guy who would produce such a flawed and problematic autobiography.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 08:42 AM
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Well put Good Wolf. Who, or what is God? Just look at everything that is around you, look up at the sky at night, the living energies that are in and around everything that is, the ground we walk on, everything we know, see and feel is a part of God. Some try and preceive God within the mind, and that`s as far as it goes, with no understanding as to how big God truly is. Now, if you were to expand that thought, so it would encompass all that there is, all thoughts, all space, all time(from start to finish)and all realities and all dimensions put together, that my friend, is God.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 08:53 AM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


What I believe is that all humanity is connected; a single macro-biological entity. In other words, We are One. Noone is by design apart from this entity, in other words noone is a separate creation all to themselves; except by freely choosing to be.

The head, that is to say the mind, of this entity is the King. The King is also the "first man", existing in the material world as a human, who is born, lives for a time and then dies, and is replaced by a Son, but who as energy never dies; for the Son, in time, becomes the Father. This fully formed entity, complete with the King and his Wife, at the energetic level is God. At least the God to which the Christian Bible is referring and to whom all that exists in this world is properly attributed. IMHO. Without the King, his Wife and his Son, you have a headless body, separated from God, which is inevitably scattered.

Because I know that there is a King, who has a Wife, Son and lives free, I know that a sovereign God exists in this world. That's what I believe. I comfortable with it and don't suffer from uncertainty in life.

As far as not being able to measure or observe, and therefore confirm the existence of, Christ or God I give the following reason. There exist people, institutions, etc. that are powerful and have a vested interest in people not being able to see what is completely obvious. And they are responsible for all the confusion and darkness.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 09:07 AM
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Something comes to my mind that you brought up Good Wolf, about a loving God. I see you thinking in these terms also. How can God hate some of those that he/she created? God is perfect. We are taking our preception of love and hate, then we put it with God, saying to ourselves, well, God must hate us then. No, we at times hate ourselves, just like we love ourselves. God being perfect, only loves. As I said before, God does not judge us, we judge ourselves. We have only been taught over time, that God will judge you in the end, no, we will do that. We as seperate beings, have created hate, and use it as part of the learning process we go through. It helps us to grow and understand ourselves, just as love does.

[edit on 1-9-2008 by FiatLux]



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 11:56 AM
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Or perhaps we think too highly of ourselves when in reality we could just be lemmings in the eyes of the Gods.

It would explain why God or the Gods have allowed such inhumane deeds to be done against us. Perhaps there is something missing that most of us are just not getting?

Do I see a God that can be loving? Yes, but do I also see a God who is emotionally unavailable a lot of the time? Yes, and do I see the religions of the world "speaking" for God and are often mistranslating? Yes!

So the question may actually be; "What is it that we are not understanding regarding the Gods or heavenly congress?" Have we been presented with the wrong template of understanding worlds (spiritual or otherwise) beyond us?



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by MatrixProphet
Or perhaps we think too highly of ourselves when in reality we could just be lemmings in the eyes of the Gods.

It would explain why God or the Gods have allowed such inhumane deeds to be done against us. Perhaps there is something missing that most of us are just not getting?

Do I see a God that can be loving? Yes, but do I also see a God who is emotionally unavailable a lot of the time? Yes, and do I see the religions of the world "speaking" for God and are often mistranslating? Yes!

So the question may actually be; "What is it that we are not understanding regarding the Gods or heavenly congress?" Have we been presented with the wrong template of understanding worlds (spiritual or otherwise) beyond us?


I have to ask, MP. What inhumane deeds have been done to YOU? If they are too personal to share I understand.

Or are you being empathetic and saying that when inhumane deeds happen to others you feel it as well?

I had an experience a few years ago that led to me to accept that everything that happens to us is of our own doing. We freely choose for it to happen. Sometimes as a result of a trick or lack of knowledge but either way we bring it on ourselves.

When I look at the news, which regularly reports the inhumanity of man towards man. I can't shake the feeling that I don't actually know why those people are suffering in such a ridiculous fashion. Even in the story of Jesus it reveals that Jesus knowingly and willingly brought his end upon himself. He probably didn't know all the details of how it would go down, but he certainly did not expect to be crowned King and restored by his persecutors.

I would like to suggest that everyone you see or hear of dieing horribly probably agreed to it. People starving and wasting away from disease chose it. People who choose and seek life receive it. So, if there is something you are missing, it is the notion that people are choosing their own inhuman destruction. It just hurts to see it when it happens.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 01:00 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
Well when it first started, I would be thinking about something mundane like videos games or cornflakes etc. when before I knew it, my line of thinking had gone completely off and was going on about moral/logic meaningful ideas. For years now Ive walked everyday for a few hours, and as the voice became more concise, it would only occur on my walks.

If I were to take a transcript of the voice(s) in my head, while the only voice was mine, It was like dual identities in a single person complete with questioning, answering, contrast and even disagreement.

I was never told to do anything as an imperative- the messages were in the general form of speeches which I thought was really strange. If it(I?) said you should, it meant "one should"

But I'll give you an example of one of the messages. To paraphrase;
"To get peace with Jason, you need to make him know that no matter what he throws at you, or how offensive he gets, you will need to be a doormat and give him what he wants with an apology. Eventualy he'll give you a chance to express your self, and he will recognise something he likes in you."

I acted on this, and would you know it, it worked and now we are close as, because he trusts me.


The reason I ask is that the last time I knew someone who had god suddenly begin to talk to him, he turned out to be a raging schizophrenic. No joke. And he was right around your age. It doesn't sound like the same circumstances because 'god' was commanding this guy to do certain things, and the voice of 'god' was definitely not his voice.

If you ever start to hear voices that are not your own, please see a doctor immediately. Other than that, good luck on your quest.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 01:34 PM
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reply to post by sc2099
 


So, what your saying is, that because someone may have a voice inside of them, talking about morals and meaningful things, they are to be written off and just medicated? Why, because no one believes or understands them? I could see that if the person was running around in circles and screaming gibberish. Tell me you`re thought on this. Why wouldn`t God talk to someone like that?



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 01:47 PM
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Hey Good Wolf, about 10 years ago at the age of 35, I gave up the notion of "God" and became an ex-catholic. At first it felt pretty weird and it took a bit of time to get used to the idea. I remember holding my breath for the first 60 seconds just in case I was wrong and got struck by lightning which of course, didn't happen.


Now.. if there ain't no "God" or "Heaven"... then there ain't no "Devil" or "Hell". Which was a relief because it sounded like a particularly nasty place and I reckon we all are better off without it.

I like you am a philosopher and we are "lovers of wisdom" as the word means. So as a hobby, I started my own investigation and study on other cultures (ancient and modern) and their religions, philosophy and thought. Now, I love asking heaps of questions and over the years I must say.. I have not received any final answers. BUT! I did discover much wisdom and practical advice from many sources which is making me a more stable and compassionate person to myself, the environment and others. Also I have come a long way to removing any fears I might have had about death and such. Plus I didn't have to join any of them to do so. Wonderful!

OK now here is a piece of advice I got from a book of Zen. It was for people who where going out to seek a zen master for themselves. It said "If your looking for a zen master be careful because some of them talk absolute rubbish."

So from one philosopher to another I say to you this.. enjoy your journey of discovery
But be wise and use your own good judgement because there are a lot of people out there that talk absolute rubbish as well! Cheers!



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 01:55 PM
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Hi new here, found you while researching my own sites egyptiology and alien theory. I wanted to say congrats for becoming a non christian. Also that i have seen a vision of "Mary". Do not laugh it was during a Reiki master attunement. Since then she appears as bald and obviously from a world not here. I am completely devoted to debunking bible as a race of spacemen and have linked fact history and science.
Also i believe in many of the Marian mysteries of a feminine presence converting all to Jesus and his way of love and peace. My own area is crystal skulls as they are connected to places Mary has show herself to the masses accompnaied by rainbows. Don1t even get me started on colour!
Anyway hi brilliant read here and Kabbalah and emanation is all i can say. We are the lowest form of alien species in the family of 13.

Love and Light
Aradia



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 02:12 PM
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I have so been where you are. When my parents went through a divorce, I couldn't see how the God I was raised to believe in could ever allow our family to be demolished. Where was he when I needed him most? After that I went the direct opposite way. Everything I was taught not to do, I did with a passion. If God did exist, I purposely spit in his face. Everything I was taught to do meant nothing to me anymore. In my mind, if God did exist, he was an irresponsible and uncaring God. Why would I want to go to a heaven where he was IF he was real anyway? And if he is not real, neither is heaven, I was so hopeless that I went on a determined self destruction path. After all, if heaven doesn't exist, then why do I continue on in this miserable world any way?

After having my second abortion from a one-nightstand who happened to be a "Christian" yet didn't give a rat's behind about whether I had one or not, I was seriously suicidal. While I was in my dark bedroom physically recovering from my hopeless deed, My grandmother, who didn't have a clue brought me a glass of orange juice and said "here, this will give you strength." She might as well have been an angel. She saved my life. Her unconditional love was so amazing. She never asked me what was wrong. She only nurtured me.

For the first time in my life, I truly felt the love of God. Through her, He loved me so deeply. That was the beginning of my truce with God. Certainly I have been through so many other major things since then, but not without hope.

Several years later, I set out to know the truth. God had shown me that the church I grew up in gave me such a distorted view of Him that the "god" I believed in really wasn't real. He started showing Himself to me in so many amazing ways and even science confirms it all if your heart is open to find it.

Now, I am so close to Him(Him being all 3 in one) and how peaceful it is, I cannot speak the words. I only pray, Good Wolf, that the TRUE God, Yahweh Hasheem (Hebrew original name for God) would reveal Himself to you in such a way that you cannot deny His amazing existence.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by Anonymous ATS
 


That's what happened to me, and I know without a doubt that God exists and is a just, caring, and yes, loving God.

What is wrong with us having free will and God already knowing what choices we will make? God transcends time and space. He saw the end from the beginning, and everything in between. If we are to be damned, it is our choices that will damn us, not God.

I'm still waiting to hear where the stuff that went bang came from, and how it got there to go bang in the first place.

[edit on 1-9-2008 by Icarus Rising]



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 04:32 PM
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Originally posted by Icarus Rising
What is wrong with us having free will and God already knwoing what choices we will make? God transcends time and space. He saw the end from the beginning, and everything in between. If we are to be damned, it is our choices that will damn us, not God.


Absolutley nothing is wrong with that. Oh, except for the Hell and eternal torment part. I'll ask you a similar question. What is wrong with someone locking a kid in a room with a shotgun? That kid has freewill, so it's his choice if he blows his brains out or not. This is why it is up to those with more knowledge to look after those without. If God exists, then why did he create us fallible and then send us to Hell for being fallible? Also, why would he judge us for making us fallible? He's the one that made us fallible, not us.


Originally posted by Icarus Rising
I'm still waiting to hear where the stuff that went bang came from, and how it got there to go bang in the first place.


And you will be waiting a long time, because science has not progressed that far. The problem with the human mind is that it feels insecure when it does not have the answers. Because of this, it creates answers such as "God did it". I could ask you similar questions about your God, but I'm sure you would say that just because you can't answer them does not mean that he doesn't exist, so why do you ask questions of us when we are still learning? You use logic when trying to disprove atheist, yet when it comes to God, you throw logic out the _

Also, even if what you say is correct, and there is a creator, why not any other deity? Because you live in your society, you chose God, but if you had been born in China, you would be praising Buddha right now. Is God racist? It seems he would be, as according to Christians, 99% of the Chinese population were only born in this world to die and suffer eternity in Hell. Yep, there's a loving God alright.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 04:40 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 

1. Yes there is some higher intelligence or greater plan which some may like to call god, but it is a part of us and we of it. Suggest you read "Questions from Earth, Answers from Heaven" by Char Margolis and "Soul on the Street" by William Roache who has played Kenneth Barlow in Coronation Street since the Soapie began in 1960.
2. Yes there is an afterlife or rather a return to the real world. This one is only a communal dream. Gary Schwartz of Arizona University has found sufficient evidence in his scientifically controlled experiments - read his book "The Afterlife Experiments"

Christianity is full of negative energy. Look at its history and what it is still doing - In 2006 two Catholic Priests - one in Toledo, one in Melbourne - conducted Satanic rites and killed people. Worshipping a cross of death should be a giveaway. But it carries a thin veneer of goodness to hide its rotten interior. Remember the joke circulating last year on the net about the Devil and the Rich man who died and had to choose upon Heaven and Hell - punch line 'Yesterday we campaigned, Today you voted'. Luke 14:26 does not mean 'love less'. Hate is translated directly from the greek word 'Miseo' meaning hate loathe or detest. A true god would have said what he/she meant, i.e. Agapa Ligotera - Love Less. Matthew 10:34/38 is another giveaway revealing the real identity of this cult. The rest of the Bible is full of evil and verses like Psalm 137:9 utterly revolting.

Do be careful of what you listen to. Space is full of thoughts and you could so easily pick up some very bad messages. i.e. George Bush and the voice that told him to invade Iraq. Whenever you meditate you must protect yourself. Meditation can be at any time, and not just when you sit down and relax and empty your mind of thought. You should call upon the White Light of Love and Divine Protection to shine down around you and form a protective shield around your whole being. Imagine it as being the most brilliant light possible, exceeding burning magnesium. John Edward tells how he once omitted his usual half hour of protective meditation and some force got hold of him in a cellar, lifted him off his feet and held him against a wall. These things can harm you.

If you want the truth about the origins of Iosa - Gaelic and Egyptian for Jesus - go to "Bible Origins in Egypt", and start with Solomon. The proof for the identity of this king is overwhelming. Check it out for yourself. Read the Jesus pages in Gerald Massey's "Ancient Egypt Light of the World" which is on the net, and look for the story of the Annunciation, Conception, Birth and Adoration. You will find a sketch of the gospel story taken from a wall of Solomon's temple built around 1350 BCE.

Once you are free of religious negativity you should be able to experience all kinds of proof of the afterlife. We are all psychic and it only depends upon whether a person can open their mind to it. My late wife Ede, passed away in May, 2007 and she called out to me one night shortly after the funeral. My daughter heard her the next night, and the following day I got a reading from the Victorian Spiritualist Union. Within ten minutes the medium asked me, "And Who is Edith". He knew nothing about me. I had never been there before. The rest of the message confirmed that it was indeed Ede.

Watch out for signs - usually coincidences, but you may get the 11.11/33 phenomena.

Once you feel that you have a good understanding of the spiritual world, talk to people. You will find that most have experienced the same things and are pleased to find somone to talk to about them. You can help so many people just by showing them that they have not lost their loved ones, and that life goes on.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 04:48 PM
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reply to post by Anonymous ATS
 

Yahweh comes from the Moon God Iah or Yah. W is the Egyptian plural letter, so Yahweh is plural. The god name in glyphs is Two Water Reeds - therefore duplicate - Y Y, but pronounced Yahweh. Genesis 1:26 says "in OUR image".
Hebrew is also in the Egyptian plural. Heper means Creation so Heprw is Creations. The glyph for Hpr is a SCARAB Beetle. It appears in a cartouche on King YmnTWTAnkh's golden shrine reading 'God of all Heprew'. Twt was also seen as the living Iosa - the Egyptian Ever coming Son of God. St.Ambrose referred to Jesus many times as "The Good SCARABaeus". Iosa is still the Gaelic word for Jesus - refer Read Many Versions of the Bible on Line, and click on 'Gaelic Gospel of Mark'.



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 05:43 PM
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reply to post by TruthParadox
 


People don't go to hell because they are fallible, they spend an eternity in hell because they willing choose to along with their mother. Sort of like you're doing. It won't be long before you kill someone, or yourself. Its not God you don't believe in, Its yourself. You doubt your own existence. You believe your lives are worthless and without a point. You think that at death there is nothing. In fact, you don't believe in anything at all. That must really suck.

You live in a world created not by people who believe in nothing but who believe in something. You have an identity, a name, a way of life. You eat food, sleep in shelter and freely voice your opinions no matter how ill informed they are. But that's what you hate the most because you know the source of all this benefit is not pagan, but from those who have strong faith and do believe in something whether they know what it is or not. Your everyday lives disprove your philosophy.

You made a comment concerning China. This is evidence of just how clueless you are; for Eve, Adam's wife, the woman spoken of in the Bible, is in fact a reference to Asia in general. If a picture existed of Eve you'd call her a Chinese woman. I don't expect you to actually know this because it makes you more comfortable to hate the very thing that created you and sustains you. The Bible and specifically God's love includes everyone, even those who do not wish to be included.

See, I know who you are; Lilith's kids. I know you were taught to hate this world and Adams kids because they are everything your mother told you that you are not, but what you want to be. According to the infinite generousity of the King you are allowed to live in his house and enjoy all it has to offer. While you are here however, the only thing you can come up with is attack the host. Another trait you share with your mother.

But I assure everyone of you that if hell is your fate YOU CHOSE IT FREELY by your actions alone. But I assure you that as this War concludes that Adam and Eves kids will be just fine.

[edit on 1-9-2008 by bruxfain]



posted on Sep, 1 2008 @ 06:15 PM
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Originally posted by sc2099
The reason I ask is that the last time I knew someone who had god suddenly begin to talk to him, he turned out to be a raging schizophrenic. No joke. And he was right around your age. It doesn't sound like the same circumstances because 'god' was commanding this guy to do certain things, and the voice of 'god' was definitely not his voice.

If you ever start to hear voices that are not your own, please see a doctor immediately. Other than that, good luck on your quest.


Like i said, It didn't issue any commands or imperatives.



Originally posted by Icarus Rising
What is wrong with us having free will and God already knwoing what choices we will make? God transcends time and space. He saw the end from the beginning, and everything in between. If we are to be damned, it is our choices that will damn us, not God.


Because if the creator of the universe knows everything that will happen then that means there is only one predestined plot. If that's true then there are people who go to hell without ever having a chance of salvation. So there can be no freewill, which in turn means that God, the one who set us up made many go to Hell. Where in the bible does it say that God knowingly set people up to go to hell? Nowhere, in fact it says its our fault. So if the christian god exists not only does he want to send people to hell, he wants to torment people before they even get there.



I'm still waiting to hear where the stuff that went bang came from, and how it got there to go bang in the first place.


lol, yea as if not having the answer proves that God exists. Let me introduce you to the Negative Proof fallacy.

[edit on 9/1/2008 by Good Wolf]





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