New ex-Christian who is lost in his own freedom and uncertainty.

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posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 07:14 PM
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Originally posted by Tattoo1377
Good Wolf, I encourage you to Apostatise from whatever church or cathedral you have been involved with, in writing. This will not only give you a sense of confidence, it will prevent the church from using you in the statistics. This lessens the influence of the church. And yes, I have apostacised in writing as well.


What do you mean? cos this sounds like a good idea. I had to go and hunt down the meaning of the word apostatise.




posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 07:25 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


I mean, to send a letter to whatever institution baptised you, with a written statement nullifying anything their certificate of baptism said, along with witness signatures, and notarised if possible.

Peace Bro!



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 08:00 PM
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reply to post by Tattoo1377
 


Well in my OP, I link to this site, but it's not the church that baptised me, I havn't been a member of the church that baptised me for ages.

I supposed I could do two, one for the baptism and one for um.. volinary-disownment.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 08:04 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


I starred you. I was not able to get to computer for I have had company. I would like to contribute more to this very good thread as I have more time.

You are a smart, humble young person. I admire your conviction and questioning.

The advice I would give is this: do not throw the baby out with the bath water! Because religion does not work for you, do not throw the concept of God out. It is just that; he does not fit our religious concept that we have been taught. It does not mean therefore that he does not have his own personality.

I have had to recover from hopeless states of mind. It required a higher power to overcome unbelievable challenges. That would include many addictions and spiritual bankruptcy. I personally have had too many examples of times where I had divine intervention. Too many to count. More than once - he saved my life.

That being said, I consider myself a spiritual scientist. Meaning; you cannot have science without a God, nor God without science. The two go together. If I leave the fanatical rule oriented, prejudiced God out of the picture, it leaves new paths to explore.

I believe it is a cop-out to deny the existence of God and rather narcissistic. Just because we don't agree with him or even understand him, does not translate to his non-existence. What it means is; we have the opportunity to get to know a very abstract being and one that does not enjoy being pigeon holed! Do we? Religion pigeon holes him (and that includes atheism), we have the choice to not go with the masses.

Is there an afterlife? Who knows! Go with your gut. But know that if you choose a spiritual path, you will have many questions and many changes. Letting go of the "fairy dust" is hard. All religions including eastern, use or believe in; fairy dust. Take what you want, and leave the rest, until you have a clear idea of what seems right to you.

You do not have to decide today!

Your friend, Matrix



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 08:25 PM
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Hi GW,

I've been where you have. My brother is your age, and going through the same thing.

I won't try to set your path for you--the first, and most important thing you have to learn is that nothing that anyone tells you, and nothing that you read, is going to make things suddenly "click" for you.

"God" for lack of a better term will listen to you and come to you--it helps to be sincere in wanting to meet Him.

Another thing to keep in mind is that you don't have to discount organized religions completely. Sometimes they can offer a legitimate aid in furthering your spiritual path, so long as you don't get so attatched to them that you lose your ability to think for yourself.

Remember to keep a truly open mind, and try hard not to be the type of "ex Christian" whose viewpoint is wrapped up in discounting the Bible or being diametrically opposed to what it says.

WElcome to the journey, it is long and hard, but worth it in the end!

[edit on 31-8-2008 by asmeone2]



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 08:39 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Well then this probably isnt the best time to bring this up.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


According to the anti-Christ bible God is the devil and Satan is the Lord.

There is a hint that Satan is not the wicked one in the bible. Notice in Revelation 13 Who made war "with" the saints? "With" is not "against".

The anti-Christ bible explains a lot. And there is life and paradise after being here. There is death and hell for just the devil and the betrayors.

The battle been won since thing are eternal. Nothing you can do to get into death and hell if you aren't the betrayor seen before being born as to something you'd do against the Lord.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:15 PM
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I don't know this anti-christ bible that you speak of but are you refering to this:

copy pasted from a doc om my computer

Now here comes an even more shocking Bible realization: the name "Lucifer" (another name for Satan) means light bearer, or morning star. On the very last page of the Bible Jesus reveals himself and provides the amazing kicker ending of the entire "Holy" Bible: I am the root and offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.-Revelation 22:16 And the very last words of Jesus in the Bible, makes it the greatest and longest-lived lie of all time (something only a devil would say): Surely, I come quickly.-Revelation 22:20 Perhaps the reader will now understand why some Satanist cults use the same Bible as the Christians. Note: The idea of the name Lucifer as synonymous with Satan goes back for centuries. In Isaiah 14:12, St. Jerome, translated the Hebrew word for "morning star" into the Latin term "Lucifer" (light bearer), a name commonly ascribed to Satan by Christians, and represents the fallen star, an ancient symbol for the fallen or evil one. In the NRSV Bible version, Isaiah 14:12 describes the fallen as "O Day Star, son of Dawn!" The Day Star, or morning star actually refers to the planet Venus, although, of course, the ancients did not know about planets. Venus always appears low on the horizon and the ancients thought of it as a star fallen from heaven (fallen angel). Venus also appears as the brightest "star" in the sky, thus the reference to the "bright and morning star" in Rev. 22:16. Although the Isaiah verse describes the fallen king of Babylon, Christians have, for centuries, ascribed Satan as taking many forms (for example the serpent). Thus, a conclusion, based on Christian beliefs of Satan, and the belief in the "inerrancy" of the Bible, one must conclude that Jesus has revealed himself as Satan!


Is that what you mean? More here

That's an incredibly controversial look at Jesus



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:20 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


One thing to keep in mind is that there is a difference between the text of a religion, and the way that man mistranslates/misinterpretes/exploits it.

I do not put that much stock in the Revelations prophecies, or any of the biblibal ones really, since they are so vague, but I'm not going to rule out the fact that they might describe some kind of future events. (Most cultures have their version of TEOTW, it isn't unique to Christianity, and fascinating to study that in a comparative light.)

What I really object to is the people who expect it to play out in a Left-Behind type of fasion, or see the prophecies of Revelation in *every* current event.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:34 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 




"God loves you Jesus died for your sins... blah blah blah" I know all that! What new material can you bring to the table to justify swallowing all that bollocks?!


In order to do that I will need to know what you consider to be the "contradictions and inconsistencies" of the Bible.

On the other hand, it may not do any good, as your heart could be the stony or weed choked ground referred to by Christ in the parable of the sower.

I am willing to give it a try, though. God deserves my best effort.



James 5

19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him;

20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:34 PM
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reply to post by Icarus Rising
 


Since I have no reason to believe that Jesus Christ even existed, why would any quoting of Jesus mean anything to me?

You cannot prove to me that the bible is true by using scripture when the validity of the scripture is in question?

It's like trying to explain the meaning of a word and using said word in the meaning.


Its a fallacy.

[edit on 8/31/2008 by Good Wolf]



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:43 PM
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Originally posted by Mabus
reply to post by Good Wolf
 

According to the anti-Christ bible God is the devil and Satan is the Lord.

There is a hint that Satan is not the wicked one in the bible. Notice in Revelation 13 Who made war "with" the saints? "With" is not "against".

Well, there were those such as the Cathars who believed that the Old Testament God was the devil himself (citing John 8:44 or similar), but it usually didn't extend to the NT


[edit on 31-8-2008 by Eleleth]



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 09:48 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


As you wish. Just remember, God isn't the one turning His back. He will always be right there next to you.

Pick up a dictionary sometime and read the definition of just about any word. Then read the definitions of the words used to define said word. Repeat this process, and before long you will be back to the original word you sought to define. Most definitions end up being circular. Man's logic is ultimately no different.



Luke 9

62 And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God.


[edit on 31-8-2008 by Icarus Rising]



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:02 PM
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reply to post by Icarus Rising
 


Look. Your not contributing anything to this thread. If you wanna post, go back to the OP and don't base you arguments on fallacies.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:05 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by Icarus Rising
 


Look. Your not contributing anything to this thread. If you wanna post, go back to the OP and don't base you arguments on fallacies.


Hey GW, please, be a little bit more respectful to people--they don't deserve to be vilified just because they do follow a religion. Assuming that someone who follows a particular path only because they are blind,or that they're going to have a cathartic moment when you say they beleive in a fallacy, has the opposite effect of making you look more enlightened.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:09 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


When I say fallacy, I dont mean the belief I mean the argument they use to justify. This is what I'm talking about.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:20 PM
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Good Wolf-
Hang in there man, you will hear this kind of stuff from theists, from now on (not to mention family and friends)...
It gets easier to sluff this propaganda off, as time goes on.
You must understand, that if you have been raised in a christian home, your Neurons have their synaptic paths programmed for a certain destination. This process can be reversed!
I suggest meditation, daily...
This will help dissolve the old neural paths AND create new ones!
Meditate on infinity, on logic, on the fact you are matter that is aware of it's existence..
Life is.. Matter being aware of it's own existence..



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:39 PM
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reply to post by Tattoo1377
 


Your a breath of fresh air.



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:48 PM
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reply to post by Good Wolf
 


This thread is not worthy of further contribution. Typical Atheist/Gnostic drivel. Set pre-conditions and build a box with them, then climb inside and close the lid behind you. Discount the very information you need to make an informed decision.

Answer me this. Where did the stuff that went bang in the Big Bang come from? How did it get there?

Do yourself a favor and read "Classic Christianity".

Peace. Out.

[edit on 31-8-2008 by Icarus Rising]



posted on Aug, 31 2008 @ 10:49 PM
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Originally posted by Good Wolf
I'm desperately looking for the answer to two questions:

1) Does a God(s) exist? and,
2) Is there an afterlife?


[edit on 8/31/2008 by Good Wolf]


1. I don't know but I doubt it.
2. See # 1.

If anybody tells you they do know, rest assured, it's only an opinion. I've been an atheist for 55 years, but I can't say "there's no God". The universe is too vast for me to know everything in it. If there is anything out there that cares about humans, it's never made its presence known to me or to anyone I know, so I find just no reason to believe. I've also read the bible ( wanted to see what I didn't believe in), but that experience just left me wondering how anybody could believe it.

Now, about that voice in your head.....I have a sneaking suspicion it sounded like you.





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