Why Ghosts are not Real

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posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:14 PM
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reply to post by Soulstone
 


Hello Soulstone! I wish I had the answers you seek.. However what I came up with at one time was this thread here..


Paranormal beliefs linked to brain chemistry?
Check out this link here and take some time to think about the many ways of seeing this issue.

Truthfully we just dont have the answers.. Energy surrounds us at all times.
I have my own feelings and belifes about ghosts.. But I shall keep them to myself at this point.. I only know what Ive seen, and what Ive felt in my time on this earth.. And the truth is always stranger than fiction!




posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:14 PM
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I've had a ghost touch my foot twice, sit next to me as I slept and a few other things. Also once during a vacation a ghost walked up the stairs to the room I was staying in, over the noisy wooden floor right next to my bed and moved my watch then went back the way it came. Why it did that is unknown and kind of weird but there was nothing there I could see.

I think that ghosts might be footprints of our existence and only occur on a few occasions when the conditions are just right. Sometime these footprints will be non intelligent and repetitive while others seem intelligent and unique. I am sure that someday people will figure out the mystery.



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:16 PM
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What do you mean by footprints ...are you talking about the essence of a person that lingers behind ?



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:19 PM
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reply to post by DraconianKing
 


I agree with your second paragraph. They may very well be some type of residual energy, like footprints.

Look into: TULPAS

www.davisanddavis.org...

www.mystae.com...



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:23 PM
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reply to post by Soulstone
 


Or they might be figments of everyone's imagination - without evidence, it's entirely conjecture at this point


This discussion is like trying to figure out Bigfoot's favourite football team. No-one can say anything with any certainty, as we're discussing an entirely-unknown quantity.



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:29 PM
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reply to post by dave420
 


So then I am "irrational" for having a personal experience that altered my perception of reality?

you said "You are embracing ignorance, not denying it. You are assuming truths based on intrinsically-flawed experiences."

By whos standards? Yours? You have already said that what you preceive can not always be reality. So what makes your preception real and mine flawed to the point of ignorance.

I am sorry I can not offer you "proof that would convince me". All I can offer you is my perception of reality which you have already judged flawed and ignorant and with that judgement already handed down my testimony would be irrelevant.



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:31 PM
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how come every in ghost sighting the ghost is always wearing clothes? Never got that one.



posted on Aug, 28 2008 @ 11:43 PM
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Not making light of this post ..

But Drock ..I know some men who dont believe in anything (my hubby)that would surely believe if they were all naked lol .....



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 02:04 AM
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Energy never goes away..It just moves elsewhere. A human life is an energy source. So when the light goes out I guess it just is gone?

I used to not believe until I met my wife that is well known in this area for seeing things many can not. Since knowing her I have witnessed things I just knew couldn't happen. But even my denial wasn't enough..Because they did happen.

It's said people want ghosts to be so they can shore up their beliefs. Or is it that people want them not to exist so that those beliefs are strengthened...hmmmm



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 02:31 AM
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reply to post by jwstarry
 


If it didn't make sense for it to alter your perception, then yes - that is irrational. It could easily be explained by natural phenomena, ones you might not understand. Again, another reason why you shouldn't trust your senses in such a way - you don't have all the answers, and to think your senses are perfect and that you do have the answers is arrogant:



ar·ro·gant –adjective
Making claims or pretensions to superior importance or rights; overbearingly assuming


You are indeed overbearingly assumptive if you think your experiences are the be-all and end-all of reality. Which you must, if you trust them so much to alter your perspective of the world.

I'm not talking about my perception, but logic; rationality. It is well-known that our senses get easily confused. That's how optical illusions work, and how the little experiment I talked about earlier in this very thread works. That is obvious to anyone. Therefor it is irrational to trust the senses to be accurate, which is what you are doing.

I haven't judged anything - logic has judged you, and logic says there's a distinct possibility that you are wrong. And as long as you are not 100% correct, assuming you are 100% is obviously irrational.

I'm sorry if you don't understand this. It's not my perception vs. yours, but your perception vs. logic. Logic won.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 03:07 AM
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The problem with controlling the "experiment" is one would need to go to the ghost. Not the other way around. This has been done for years. I don't know if that would qualify as a controlled experiment(s). In those experiments there have been countless evp that appeared to answer the questioner, objects that moved, personal experiences (touching etc.). One could hear the evp tapes and see video and there have been cases of more then one person or group over several years at places. I've read about these experiments for years but never believed them being I wasn't there so it could be faked.

All that was until I met my wife. In the years I've known her I've seen countless times things I can in no way explain. Seen them. heard them, caught them on video and audio tape. Seems she is some kind of magnet for such activity. I've seen her answer questions she could not know the answers to. I mean things about me or my family. From people that are not with us anymore. I have not had any real contact with my family for years before I met her due to things that have nothing to do with this thread but suffice to say no one (alive) could have told her.

We don't keep these tapes being I don't invest a lot of money in it and I no longer have a video cam. It was a lot of fun some years back but it's just part of daily life now and I really don't fool with it anymore. But I know it happened then...I know it does now.

I don't believe it to be irrational to believe what I've seen and put on tape. Many people have done it. Why is none of it logical? LoL! I chalk it up to denial...A very illogical and irrational action of it's own.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 03:21 AM
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i have had a number of experiences,my auntie died a few years back and just afterwards i saw her standing in my bedroom doorway while i was laying in bed.
her hair was down(loose and natural)and she was dreseed in a white robe.
a few months after that she appeared in my dream and pulled along side me at the traffic lights in another car,she gave me a phone number and drove off.
i want to believe but these experiences could be manipulated by our brain,i dont think people relise how powerfull our brain is.
how come people who have died that are close to us never appear on regular basis (why not) and especially when we need them.
another thing and it might off topic,our brain is the control centre for our body,when we die the brain dies aswell.there is evidence of that because its rots in a coffin.
how can there be anything after death when the intelligent part of our body dies or is there another body part that is more powerful.
sorry for the blabber but im knew here



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 03:40 AM
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I feel that with the advent of more portable electronic measurement equipment there will be the possibility of more measurable evidence of ghosts. There just isn't the financial interest backing such research.

Look at the electronic monitoring equipment used in hospitals to monitor our state of health. Once there are no longer any electrical energy or signals in which to be measured then we're officially determined to be dead.This we can prove and is a medically accepted fact.

Place a probe from an oscilloscope on your finger tip and you can measure your energy.

This energy or our soul as the bible would call it is what I feel is what we could call a ghost and being electromagnetic in nature exists in our atmosphere with all other electromagnetic energy once it has left the body.

Bear with me...

As with radio and gravity waves we can't see this energy but we know it exists but didn't understand how to prove this phenomenon until we discovered how to tune into their specific frequency and energy spectrum.

My feelings are that the energy spectrum associated with ghosts or the spiritual realm in itself are yet to be discovered.

Due to the natural minute nature of this energy it will require very sensitive instrumentation to measure and discern from the background noise and pollution created by our powered devices similar to that of RFI (Radio Frequency Interference).

Once this is achieved, similar to tuning into a radio station, will allow us to tune into this energy and better understand this phenomenon and will scientifically prove the existence of ghosts or spiritual energy for those that require such proof.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 04:00 AM
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i believe the standard causes for having dead spirits haunt this world is for them to die a sudden death or an emotional death. This certainly apples to the poor souls in the twin towers and on the planes. And ghosts stay around because sometimes they do not know they are dead. If I were a ghost and saw a giant pile of rubble where my office just was, I think I would figure out my demise and wish to move on past this world.

I believe that could be why victims of giant disasters like 9/11 do not haunt this world. They can see the evidence of their deaths, and can accept it. Just my opinion.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 04:15 AM
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reply to post by DrumJunkie
 


Because none of that constitutes actual evidence, just anecdotes. Evidence has to meet certain criteria before it is acceptable. You have to pin-down exactly what is causing these phenomena - if there is any doubt, it's not evidence. It sounds harsh, but it's the basis for every single scientific innovation human kind has witnessed in the last 1,000 years.

EVPs, videos, objects moving, all that can be explained away quite rationally. And as long as a rational explanation suffices, ignoring it is intrinsically irrational. One must err on the side of caution when trying to understand something, as it's far better to be half-way down the right path than all the way down the wrong one.

Learning and study isn't easy. And for good reason.

reply to post by nh_ee
 


There are some issues with what you propose. If human kind, or indeed electronics, or anything else in this world, can interact with ghosts, then science would have seen this 'energy spectrum', or at least the effects of it. As it is, there is no yearning chasm in our understanding of energy that human beings (or even EVP tape recorders) can sense. Since a ghost must be able to somehow interact with us for us to 'know' they are there, this should be but a mere formality.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 04:22 AM
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Photos, Videos, EVPs, personal accounts.. all evidence even if you don't accept them, Dave. What you are looking for is scientific explanation, and no, we don't have that.. that's why It's still paranormal and not the simply normal. Photos, videos, audio recordings and witness testimony are all valid evidence in court, I'm not sure why they wouldn't be here. There is no proof that a photo of a cloudy figure is a dead human being's energy or whatever but it is what people would call a ghost. Anyone seriously studying the topic would observe this evidence.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 04:38 AM
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This is a very controversial topic, it's been my experience that only people who have had personal ghostly encounters are the only people who take the paranormal seriously. Shoot, I might still be a skeptic had I not had a few experiences of my own.

They are real, no question.



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 04:53 AM
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I cant prove to you that they are real except for the countless,endless amounts of 1st hand stories out there and my family's own experiences, you cant prove to me that they are'nt real. So pointless thread really!

Oh and I do believe there is definitely a link between the paranormal and buildings made of natural stone, due to magnetic properties in this natural stone. Maybe this enables paranormal energy to form or else causing this energy to be trapped inside.

[edit on 29-8-2008 by kcfusion]

[edit on 29-8-2008 by kcfusion]



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 05:16 AM
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reply to post by dave420
 


Well...Being the area I live in is pretty sparsely populated area. In fact you wont see another living soul within eye shot of my house I can pretty much rule out someone else making these noises. No huge electrical towers, no swamp gas, radio/cell phone towers within miles of my property. Just the Mrs and me and a few cats..And I don't think any of my little feline friends speaks English. So being I can see the Mrs and I know where I am I can pretty much know what is not making these things happen. I don't drink,smoke pot or take other drugs so that rules out those sources of brain merriment. Just her. me and a tape recorder. Now I know I'm not at some lab in the big ol' city cause that will make it better but time and again I've seen and heard these things happen. Just what am I missing except a closed mind that refuses to admit this exists therefor opening a can of worms to a whole slew of new questions?

See, I have noticed that those that deny any type of supreme being exists will also deny the paranormal. Because no God means no soul that means no paranormal.

You know..I'm a God fearing man but I can still see evolution and how it has worked over time. I really believe that there is room for God in a world sterilized by science. I can't put God in a lab either but don't need to. but I also don't need to hit myself with a hammer to prove it will hurt. I just took my dad's word for it. you see he seen this guy do it once..Damn near killed him. But I really can't prove that.


Dang I need to proof read more


[edit on 8/29/2008 by DrumJunkie]



posted on Aug, 29 2008 @ 05:22 AM
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reply to post by DraconianKing
 


I think you hit it right on the head. It's a mystery. And like many things in this crazy world we are in some things are a mystery until they are figured out. Science once the world was flat and there was no way to prove otherwise. Sure am glad that telescope guy..Gallon of Oleo?...was not killed before that pesky little science factoid was resolved





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