Russia long-range missile test a success

reply to post by twisted_fate


ooooh I'm not saying they are wrong from a self preservation perspective.

But that's the long and short of it, the "fence" isn't just perimiter, those 20-30-40 missiles that the "shield" can possibly deflect is about what they are capable of fielding into Europe atm...

and until this, that's plenty enough of a deterent right?

Take out 30 European cities and you can walk right in... kiss Nato goodbye

This IS indeed insult to injury and Putin is acting in Russian best interests

But here is indeed a reason a shield that can knock out their few shielded missiles is scary to them... because it goes in place it's the final piece of MAD being a done deal

and they know it if no one else does

reply to post by wutone


Russia should fear China more than Us?

Niether of us could pull it off without the other.

They would be nuked into the dust, we can't possibly contain thwe territories we simply don't have the troops

It's an "I have the brains you got the looks lets make lots of money scenario"

except in this case it's "we have the tech you have the army lets make lots of money"

Would good woud a defeat of the region do the USA, we could never polulate and hold the territory all that detah for no gain and a huge vaccum in the whole region

and China can't stop Russian Nukes

and we can't land invade Russia we can barely hold Iraq

So we go in with smart bombs destabalize the region, bomb the crap out of everything, soften all the weapons systems

and when the time is right, Chinese troops occupy, they might even asume the role of peace keeper and never let on they were working with us in the first place

But Russia is a problem

because how can China expand into the huge desolate wasteland that is Kahzakhstan and Uzbekistan

China has 1.5 Billion people that want to make babies and Kahzakstan has like 18 Million goat hearders occupying one of the largest territories in the world and it's got oil too!

So until Russia is dealt with, China is all but screwed and just like the Mongols fought for them in a way before all was said and done...so do we right now

Further Islam is a Huge threat to China, it's a real thrat to them, in our culture we take multiculturalism seriously, the influx of Islam is coming at them from the west, much talk of "terrorism" from those regions as we do and it's mostly bs lol just like ours is...

the real threat is cultural and China takes this Deadly Seriously

Haha!
But here is the real question

When the reach Moscow and the US manpower is next to nada from all the breaking in...

Will they just keep going? Or not?

Now... Nostradamus is considered a fraud by some and when this war started in the middle east... every one goes way out of their ways to connect things

But, there is little mention in either the Bible or in Nostradamous about anything you could really say is "America" this has been commented on a whole lot, how America really deosn't seem to fit into any of it as the Real final war breaks out

so I give this one Quatrain, taken directly at face value to do with what you will

The year 1999, seventh month,
From the sky will come a great King of Terror.
To bring back to life the great King of the Mongols,
Before and after Mars to reign by good luck.

Every body jumped on BinLaden as the Great King of Terror and 1999 is kind of slightly off

But who is it that Comes from the Sky

Who Creates the Great King of Terror, ushers in the great King of the Mongols

America

We come from the skies, our war for the last 8 years paid for by China for Middle eastern Oil, we come from the skies we, wreck the Middle east, we occupy the old Mongolian territories, we softened them up, we are behind the War in Georgia to a degree

And that's when The King of The Mongols... of China will step in and walk through those lands with zero resistance, after we have softened them up enough

We usher in the Great King of Terror, from the skies with our airpower we have cleaned the path and can't hold it... they must occupy that Oil if we leave

China


Thing is though, Nostradamus predicts the Great King of Terror isn't stopped until

He reaches France


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[edit on 28-8-2008 by mopusvindictus]

[edit on 28-8-2008 by mopusvindictus]

[edit on 28-8-2008 by mopusvindictus]

Originally posted by twisted_fate

Originally posted by impending_pyrrhic_victory
FYI, the U.S. is aware of ANY and EVERY missile that is or will be launched (worldwide) a minimum of 2 hours ahead of time.

link?

someone else who seems to have alot of faith in American technology =/

being able to be aware of ANY and EVERY missile to be launched would mean having hundreds of satilites pointed at every square meter of the planet....not possible.

Russia has nuclear submarines, able to sneak right up to American coasts and launch its missiles and get the hell out of there before America would even decect them.

like I keep saying, there seems to be a few people here who are either blinded by patriotism or American propaganda...they seem to think America are invinicible for some reason =/

Oh NO, I don't think we are invincable or that we can win everything

I think China is going to win and they are utilizing us to get the job done

and for that, we will survive

We have the ability to stop the Russians, it's what our military has worked at since then end of ww2

and that's about all we have and by the time that's done we will be wasted, gone from the region and someone else will be finishing what we started

reply to post by mopusvindictus


And your technology and what your refrencing goes back to the 80's my friend

We can see every launch and do it with 5 satellites and we have our systems redundant, you need to get up to current super computer speeds

likewise, all through the 90's we upgraded our sonar and detection systems...

Russian subs can not sail right up to American shores undetected anymore

again as Condoleeza said "this is not 1969"

Perhaps we can set aside, for a moment, the objective events of the last few weeks and the escalation of the War of Words and deeds between the US and Russia. Perhaps we might be able to find more truth in this fable by Aesop than the rhetoric being bounced form West to East.

The Wolf and the Lamb

Wolf, meeting with a Lamb astray from the fold,
resolved not to lay violent hands on him, but to
find some plea to justify to the Lamb the Wolf's
right to eat him. He thus addressed him: "Sirrah,
last year you grossly insulted me." "Indeed,"
bleated the Lamb in a mournful tone of voice,
"I was not then born." Then said the Wolf, "You
feed in my pasture." "No, good sir," replied the
Lamb, "I have not yet tasted grass." Again said
the Wolf, "You drink of my well." "No," exclaimed
the Lamb, "I never yet drank water, for as yet
my mother's milk is both food and drink to me."
Upon which the Wolf seized him and ate him up,
saying, "Well! I won't remain supperless, even
though you refute every one of my imputations."

The tyrant will always find a pretext for his tyranny.

Now, who is the Wolf and who is the Lamb?

[edit on 28-8-2008 by Rotwang]

thebulletin.metapress.com...

If you look at the above document, this test was already planned - at least 11 test launches are expected in 2008.


Russia needs to conduct tests of the Topol-M as this will probably be its only ICBM after 2018-2020. All the SS25s are being dismantled. The SS18s have been reduced from 308 to 75 with the number possibly going down to just 40 by the end of 2008. The SS19 are nearly obscelent.

At the moment Russia has 54 Topol-M missiles carrying the same amount of warheads - Although the new RS24 set to be deployed next year is said to have MIRVS. What this means is a HUGE decrease in warhead numbers in the next few years. From over 1600 warheads on ICBMS to what? A few hundred?! Even if Russia invests more money in its arsenal its warheads will fall below those stipulated in the SORT treaty.

I would not worry about this test. Russia's Nuclear arsenal longterm is falling apart.. However this is when they could be at their most dangerous...

The Soviet Navy took a huge hit when the Warsaw pack broke away from Russia. If anyone remembers correctly a lot of countries was fighting over who should own some of the fleets and ports. The country not involved in the argument was Russia.

As to Russia developing a Stealth Missile that is some serious fiction. It takes a lot more then soft materials to make something stealth. Shape aka surface angle deflection of Radar, The exhaust pipe aka hiding the heat from the missile. Trying to hide a missile is like trying to hide a full moon.

Looks like russia is back on the map.

Cold war... round two.
*dingdingding*

Is it just me or does the topic of an all our nuclear war make you feel excited? I get warm fuzzies all over!

Originally posted by twisted_fate
Russia has nuclear submarines, able to sneak right up to American coasts and launch its missiles and get the hell out of there before America would even decect them.

Oh really? And your sources would be...? The US can indeed detect in real time virtually every ballistic missile launch, especially if ICBM's are concerned. That's 24/7 and anywhere on our beautiful 510,072,000 Km² of surface area.

Originally posted by twisted_fate
like I keep saying, there seems to be a few people here who are either blinded by patriotism or American propaganda...

And some perhaps by Hollywood movies? Yes, I too have seen the Hunt for Red October.

China will be populating the moon and Mars before they work with the US to take over Central Asia and the Middle East. That scenario has barely any hold even in a video game, so we wont even discuss its real world implication.

America has squandered its funds developing a military to conquer resources here on Earth. China will soon be working with India and probably Russia to furher develop their space agencies and travel plans.

You can take land, but that does not mean you will be able to secure the people in it in any productive time for it to become profitable.

As far as the missle tests, perhaps they are testing the propulsion systems in general, and not necessarily concerned about delivering a nuclear payload.

Originally posted by Interestinggg The Russians are proud of there little missile test. But in reality they have no clue exactly WHAT detection systems we have hahaha

Yes. Very funny!

But YOU do not know that the Russians have had their own laser defence system up and running for about 20 years.

Did you know this system was first built and tested out at Sary Shagan, Semi-Plesetsk and Dushanbe in the late 60s?

Do you not remember that the Russians tickled the space shuttle Challenger with this laser system?

Not so funny now, is it.

The latest test of the Topol is designed to show Russia's displeasure with what it sees as American double standards.

Firstly, NATO [America] invites former Warsaw Pact countries to join her ranks, thus almost surrounding the Rodina or Motherland.

Secondly that retard in the White House lectures the Russian Premier against the use of force to settle modern political issues - i.e the issue with the break-away states within Georgia.

This from a man who is hell bent on bringing Democracy to the Middle East, and is doing so from the barrel of a gun;

This from a man who needed to fix his own re-election in order to carry on his own warped crusade against the Muslim world.

No, it's not very funny.

reply to post by DYepes


Oh really now?

The enemy of my Enemy is my friend, the saudis hate us and work with us constantly, because the Rift with Iran is bigger and it's the Saudis who sell the most oil to China, just look at the Numbers

China wouldn't work with us why?

We never had a war with them, we weren't a colonial power when England was screwing with them a Century ago... They were an Ally for WW2

Play the game in your head and there is no other decision for China to make

The US is not a natural enemy, we could never invade China and we are NOT a threat to Chinese culture

again

The Enemy of my Enemy is my friend

Russia, is to the North, Russia has the capacity to blitz China via Nukes, Russia has an amost 3/4 of a century history of randomly invading any territory on their border they see fit...

Do the numbers

China has 10x the wealth involved in the USA as Russia and the Mideast combined, what they do have from the Mideast is the Oil they need and frankly, just as we did, why not just take it?

Russia Can threaten China

Islam is a Huge threat to China, they don't care about Communism vs Democracy to the level you think or we are led to believe...

China changes governments like hats to fit the times

China cares about One thing... Chinese culture, One China, Chinese Unity

Communisim, capitalism, fascism... these are all Methjods to the Chinese to use as they see fit!

But Chinese Culture to them is the highest culture ever to gidt the world, they teach in school, that the Chinese are different from the rest of man and developed from Peking Man and the rest of us from other types of early man...

China wishes to remain Chinese and will tolerate No religion on it's border if it feels it's cultural integrity is threatened

So you believe that China would never side with the USA?

Why Not? They have to in the end, who are they going to trust Russia? Islam? On their doorstep... a legitimate threat to Chinese Culture

Or the stupid Americans on the otherside of the Ocean that buy more of thier crap than the rest of the world put together?


Stop thinking like an American... Like Communism and Capitalism Matter, be Chinese... there is only one country china, there is only one people China, there is only one kingdom in Asia China

They know full well, in the long run there can be only One super power in Asia

and yeah they will USE America to make sure it's them

reply to post by fritz


The Russian Laser system was a gigantic laser beam, every one that tries to prop Russia tauts that thing and it was Gigantic and could barely take out a tank and never deployed a system of them...

Russia hasn't developed much of squat since the cold war ended, this is the largest technology gap there has ever been...

and I'm not puting down Russia... we have no hope of invading and securing them on the ground

But we are legitimately entering checkmate in terms of the Nuclear game and They Know it

If it wasn't so, they wouldn't be moving troops on the ground to counter us or threatening Poland

Russia is very dangerous now but the threat isn't Nuclear

What they would do and just might do...to counter US, is actually storm into Ukraine and Poland and force the whole thing conventional where they will whop alot of arse and we won't use nukes on European soil

Or smash us hard before we finsish things

I'm not taking sides, but Russia fell 18 years behind us this last generation and we have spent trillions and Trillions of dollars in that time.

Agression they have.

A brutal not politically corretc invasion oriented army they have.

A well trained and not very far behind airforce they have

A decent Navy by anyones standards but Americas they have

The ability to play a mean game of chess and the capacity to suprise us like they Just did in the most important aspect of war, strategy they have and by no means... is any of what I say, saying Russia hasn't figured this all out and could possibly turn the tables on us across the board and win if theres a war...

It's a Plan we have, noit a victory yet

But, peope trying to compare the technolgy or the state of Russian missile and defensive systems compared to the Apocolyptic nightmare of machines we have...

there's just no comparisson

They wouldn't care about a shield that can only harm a handful of missiles unless... I'm right and they know what we have backing our Cajones up.

They don't react like this when our men are nearby "closing in" because they know they can whop us on the ground...

They care about this for a reason, we are perciptously close to ending MAD

and why anyone doesn't get this and believes lol...the Bush administration when they deny that this is the case... is beyond me.

Putin is saying for years "This is a threat" Just ask yourselves why it's a threat and the answer is the only possible answer there is...

Our missile defenses are almost absolutely 100% complete, these are the last pieces not the first

and Russia and Putin are aware of this even if American and Europeans believe it's not the case

Russia has... a Fantastic spy system... Putin knows, we are close to end game

Originally posted by For(Home)Country
Is it just me or does the topic of an all our nuclear war make you feel excited? I get warm fuzzies all over!

Thanks, but I get cold pricklies all over.

Nuclear war, there is nothing I detest more.

I think what Russia is worried about is the fact that their Nuclear arsenal is shrinking year-on-year. Theres nothing they can do about it.

The amount of warheads that are being dismantled and are now past their service lives will not be replaced in anywhere near the same numbers in the future.

There are less then 60 new SS27s with hundreds of warheads to be dismantled in the next few years.

So the reduction in warheads coupled with the increase in the effectiveness of the West's ABM capabilities is obviously making 'the bear' nervous. However, I can't see how they can stop their nuclear arsenal falling below 1,500 warheads by 2018-2020..

Originally posted by mopusvindictus
reply to post by fritz

 

The Russian Laser system was a gigantic laser beam, every one that tries to prop Russia tauts that thing and it was Gigantic and could barely take out a tank and never deployed a system of them...

Russia hasn't developed much of squat since the cold war ended, this is the largest technology gap there has ever been...

and I'm not puting down Russia... we have no hope of invading and securing them on the ground

But we are legitimately entering checkmate in terms of the Nuclear game and They Know it

If it wasn't so, they wouldn't be moving troops on the ground to counter us or threatening Poland

Russia is very dangerous now but the threat isn't Nuclear

What they would do and just might do...to counter US, is actually storm into Ukraine and Poland and force the whole thing conventional where they will whop alot of arse and we won't use nukes on European soil

Or smash us hard before we finsish things

I'm not taking sides, but Russia fell 18 years behind us this last generation and we have spent trillions and Trillions of dollars in that time.

Agression they have.

A brutal not politically corretc invasion oriented army they have.

A well trained and not very far behind airforce they have

A decent Navy by anyones standards but Americas they have

The ability to play a mean game of chess and the capacity to suprise us like they Just did in the most important aspect of war, strategy they have and by no means... is any of what I say, saying Russia hasn't figured this all out and could possibly turn the tables on us across the board and win if theres a war...

It's a Plan we have, noit a victory yet

But, peope trying to compare the technolgy or the state of Russian missile and defensive systems compared to the Apocolyptic nightmare of machines we have...

there's just no comparisson

They wouldn't care about a shield that can only harm a handful of missiles unless... I'm right and they know what we have backing our Cajones up.

They don't react like this when our men are nearby "closing in" because they know they can whop us on the ground...

They care about this for a reason, we are perciptously close to ending MAD

and why anyone doesn't get this and believes lol...the Bush administration when they deny that this is the case... is beyond me.

Putin is saying for years "This is a threat" Just ask yourselves why it's a threat and the answer is the only possible answer there is...

Our missile defenses are almost absolutely 100% complete, these are the last pieces not the first

and Russia and Putin are aware of this even if American and Europeans believe it's not the case

Russia has... a Fantastic spy system... Putin knows, we are close to end game

The Russian Laser system was a gigantic laser beam, every one that tries to prop Russia tauts that thing and it was Gigantic and could barely take out a tank and never deployed a system of them... Russia hasn't developed much of squat since the cold war ended, this is the largest technology gap there has ever been... and I'm not puting down Russia... we have no hope of invading and securing them on the ground

read this :

MOSCOW (RIA Novosti) - Russia started developing tactical laser weapons before the United States and has several prototypes of high-precision combat chemical lasers in its arsenal, a defense industry source said on Tuesday. The Boeing Company said recently it had test-fired a high-energy chemical laser fitted aboard a C-130H aircraft for the first time. The successful ground tests, "a key milestone for the Advanced Tactical Laser Advanced Concept Technology Demonstration program," took place on May 13 at the Kirtland Air Force Base, New Mexico. Commenting on the announcement, the Russian expert said: "We tested a similar system back in 1972. Even then our ‘laser cannon was capable of hitting targets with high precision." "We have moved far ahead since then, and the U.S. has to keep pace with our research and development," he added.
www.mnweekly.ru...

the russians were also reported to have used the infrared laser in the 1969 sino-soviet war

Although infrared weapon technology is not widely discussed in the West, the Soviet infrared beam weapon is nothing new and was already used during a Soviet dispute with China in 1969 to destroy "a wall" at the Ussuri River, which separates Manchuria from Russia's Far East, according to the physicist.
----
There are indications, according to the physicist, that such a weapon was used when the KAL plane was shot down over Kamchatka (Soviet Union) in September 1983. In the early 90s, this technology returned to scientific discussions in the West and the technology itself appears to have been transferred from the Soviet Union.
www.serendipity.li...

the above source is from a A former East German physicist who studied Soviet infrared technology and plasmoids during the 60s and 70s, and who was directly involved in a demonstration of a Soviet laser beam weapon in 1991 for the U.S. Air Force in Weimar (DDR)

in fact , the tech for THEL was obtained by sceintists of USSR , who emgrated to USA and israel

and yes , the claims of use of DEW for the downing of KAL 007 in 1983 in kamchatka peninsula are verifed by the book psychotronic Golgotha , which has some brief discussion on various soviet directed energy weapon applications , but is mainly concerned with its mind control applications

you could order the book ,psychotronic Golgotha , though it is available in Russian language
mindjustice.org...

and more , This is from american father of hydrogen Bomb,Edward Teller

Radar and Laser Beams The Soviet radar station in Krasnoyarsk has been completed. That radar will show how our missiles approach. The information can be handed out to the SA-12s, which will make a good defense after retaliatory missiles have reentered the atmosphere. We are approaching the point where mutually assured destruction is not only a terrible idea, but it won't even work. We are allowing our forces of retaliation to become obsolete. The Soviets have worked for at least 10 years on lasers -- high intensity lasers which can be directed so accurately that in 1000 miles, the spread of the beam will be no more than five feet. We have seen at least one published deployment of such lasers in the Soviet Union on the military test site of Shari Shagan on the shores of Lake Baikal. I suspect that this is not the only one. We act as though the ABM Treaty were a reality.
www.commonwealthclub.org...

Edward Teller was supposed to be talking about the nuclear laser
on soviet nuclear lasers for ASAT and potential anti-ICBM purpose
(USA has no counterpart of it till now )

The USSR's high-energy laser program, which dates from the mid-1960s, is much larger than the US effort. They have built over a half dozen major R&D facilities and test ranges, and they have over 10,000 scientists and engineers associated with laser development. They are developing chemical lasers and have continued to work on other high-energy lasers having potential weapons applications - the gas dynamic laser and the electric discharge laser. They are also pursuing related laser weapon technologies, such as efficient electrical power sources, and are pursuing capabilities to produce high-quality optical components. They have developed a rocket-driven magnetohydrodynamic (MHD) generator which produces 15 megawatts of short-term electric power - a device that has no counterpart in the West. The scope of the USSR's military capabilities would depend on its success in developing advanced weapons, including laser weapons for ballistic missile defense.
www.fas.org...

reply to post by mopusvindictus



by the way, if you talk about HAARP. blah blah , then read this :

The Sura Ionospheric Heating Facility, located near the small town of Vasilsursk about 100 km eastward from Nizhniy Novgorod in Russia, is a laboratory for ionosphere research. Sura is capable of radiating about 190 MW, effective radiated power (ERP) on short waves. This facility is operated by the radiophysical research institute NIRFI in Nizhny Novgorod. The Sura facility was commissioned in 1981. Using this facility, Russian researchers achieved extremely interesting results regarding the ionosphere behavior and discovered the effect of generation of low-frequency emission at the modulation of ionosphere current[1]. At the beginning, Soviet Defense Department mostly footed the bill. The American HAARP ionospheric heater is similar to the Sura facility. The HAARP project began in 1993.
en.wikipedia.org...

HAARP is similiar to Soviet Sura , which has been operational since 1981, while HAARP began operating in 1993 ....

and many russian conspiracy theorists on xakep,sovietempire,communist.ru state that, that HAARP is a ripoff of the Sura facility and is based on stolen soviet tech ...

Read this , what a russian politican Vladmir Zhirinosky said :

The Americans promptly unearthed the controversial interview by Vladimir Zhirinovsky in which he threatened to unleash floods all over the United States when “our scientists slightly change the earth's gravitational field.”
english.pravda.ru...

American meteorologist Scott Stevens has recently brought accusations against Russia

Mr. Stevens claims that Russian military specialists were behind the fury of Hurricane Katrina that devastated New Orleans. According to him, Russia has built secret equipment for causing a detrimental impact on the weather way back in the Soviet era
english.pravda.ru...

[edit on 29-8-2008 by manson_322]

[edit on 29-8-2008 by manson_322]