Absolutely Disgusting, page 5
Pages: <<  2    3    4    5    6  >>
ATS Members have flagged this thread 9 times


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 07:26 PM by cautiouslypessimistic
reply to post by Gorman91


Dancing dancing but no actual thoughts there....



Seriously, argue your point or don't. But don't state something as fact and then try semantics when you realize your words are contradicting themselves.


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 08:25 PM by DelMar
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


...the police are taught to protect themselves first, citizens second.


Sounds like common sense to protect yourself first, how could a police officer be efficient in helping other if he/she is injured.

They are taught that if they shoot, ALWAYS shoot to kill.


Again, if there is a need to shoot, they must protect themselves. Yes, there are cases of officers in unjustified shootings, and they should be punished, however, if shooting is justified, why go for the leg?

They are taught that silence is an act of aggression.

They are taught that words are to be considered assault on an officer.


So you're saying no matter how you approach an officer, silent or bitching, you're screwed?

This country's law enforcement system is a joke.


What country do you consider to be the model for a good law enforcement system?

Del


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 08:44 PM by cautiouslypessimistic
Originally posted by DelMar
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic




Sounds like common sense to protect yourself first, how could a police officer be efficient in helping other if he/she is injured.


Again, if there is a need to shoot, they must protect themselves. Yes, there are cases of officers in unjustified shootings, and they should be punished, however, if shooting is justified, why go for the leg?





So you're saying no matter how you approach an officer, silent or bitching, you're screwed?



What country do you consider to be the model for a good law enforcement system?

Del



1)s, a police officer should have a right to protect themselves. But, let's remember the motto here: "To protect and serve". If an officer's first thought is to protect themselves before the civillians around, how is this following in the job description.

2)I understand an officer in imminent danger of their life must shoot to kill. But lets take this for example:
www.tigardtimes.com...

There was no imminent danger, the mother asked the cops not to shoot, yet the fired over 50 bullets at the kid. Is this justified?

3)Study your laws. Swaering at a cop is assault. Silence when spoken to by a cop is considered an act of aggression. So yes, unless you respond exactly as the officer wants, you can be charged either way.

I dont know what country has a better model. Does that mean we should take the road of apathy?



reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 09:23 PM by DelMar
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


1. We could debate numerous situations where "protect themselves" could mean numerous things. However, I agree that the citizens are who the police are to serve.

2. Tragic story indeed. The officers should be put through the legal system and punished if found guilty, not an argument from me on that one. You said officers are taught to shoot to kill as if it were a bad idea. I simply stated that, if appropriate, they should. This story is obviously not that type of case.

3. I didn't say swearing at a cop wasn't an arrestable offense. Also, I fail to see how silence when spoken to by a cop is considered aggression, it is a right that you have. Cops aren't judges and can't hold you in contmept for not answering questions. Can they arrest you for withholding information, likely, but they can't force you to talk. I think you're stretching it a bit by saying unless you answer exactly as they want, trouble ensues.

Not suggesting we take the road to apathy, just wanting to know if you had an ideal country in mind.

Del


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 09:27 PM by cautiouslypessimistic
Originally posted by DelMar
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


1. We could debate numerous situations where "protect themselves" could mean numerous things. However, I agree that the citizens are who the police are to serve.

2. Tragic story indeed. The officers should be put through the legal system and punished if found guilty, not an argument from me on that one. You said officers are taught to shoot to kill as if it were a bad idea. I simply stated that, if appropriate, they should. This story is obviously not that type of case.

3. I didn't say swearing at a cop wasn't an arrestable offense. Also, I fail to see how silence when spoken to by a cop is considered aggression, it is a right that you have. Cops aren't judges and can't hold you in contmept for not answering questions. Can they arrest you for withholding information, likely, but they can't force you to talk. I think you're stretching it a bit by saying unless you answer exactly as they want, trouble ensues.

Not suggesting we take the road to apathy, just wanting to know if you had an ideal country in mind.

Del


If an officer asks you a direct question, and you say nothing, he can take it as an act of aggression and arrest you for disturbing the peace. Now, if he asks you a question and you say: "I choose not to answer that", you are perfectly within your rights.

Just like I wrote about swearing at a cop before. You swear at 'em, it's assault. You say "In my opinion, you are an......" and then swear, it's not.


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 09:30 PM by gibbs1189
Originally posted by dalan.
reply to post by Death_Kron


I agree, I can take care of my self without the help of an Officer.

Cops are an all-together waste of time.

But that is my opinion.


I would LOVE to see you take care of your self if we had no law enforcement what so ever, and just so people know, State police are not Federal officers, there for they are not part of the federal government.

The news and media are the only reason that more and more stories are coming out, very little has changed as far as how many incidents actually occur, just how many are brought to the public's attention.

I really hate it when people think that because a small percentage of the police populace abuse their power, they assume that every single officer is corrupt, when that is not the case. And yes, so you all know I'm going to college right now to get a degree in criminal justice, and I plan on going into the police academy in a few years.

As for you death kron, I dont wish anything bad on you because you dont respect police, but if you ever have to experience the pain, and anger of being a victim of a crime, say someone breaks into your home and steals all of your valuables, but you never report it, only to find out later that the police caught the guy and you still cant get your things back because you think the police are useless and never reported the crime, I think you may start to change your mind. If not, I dont care, your opinion is yours to believe, no matter how ignorant it may seem. To me at least.


reply posted on 27-8-2008 @ 09:38 PM by DelMar
reply to post by cautiouslypessimistic


I would definitely have to see some case law on the claim that you can be arrested for disturbing the peace if you fail to answer a question. Also be interested to see examples of people getting away with verbally assaulting an officer because they prefaced their statement with "In my opinion".

I'm not saying you're right or wrong, just would have to see actual cases that back that up before I buy it.

Del


reply posted on 28-8-2008 @ 02:04 AM by Death_Kron
Originally posted by gibbs1189
Originally posted by dalan.
reply to post by Death_Kron


I agree, I can take care of my self without the help of an Officer.

Cops are an all-together waste of time.

But that is my opinion.


I would LOVE to see you take care of your self if we had no law enforcement what so ever, and just so people know, State police are not Federal officers, there for they are not part of the federal government.

The news and media are the only reason that more and more stories are coming out, very little has changed as far as how many incidents actually occur, just how many are brought to the public's attention.

I really hate it when people think that because a small percentage of the police populace abuse their power, they assume that every single officer is corrupt, when that is not the case. And yes, so you all know I'm going to college right now to get a degree in criminal justice, and I plan on going into the police academy in a few years.

As for you death kron, I dont wish anything bad on you because you dont respect police, but if you ever have to experience the pain, and anger of being a victim of a crime, say someone breaks into your home and steals all of your valuables, but you never report it, only to find out later that the police caught the guy and you still cant get your things back because you think the police are useless and never reported the crime, I think you may start to change your mind. If not, I dont care, your opinion is yours to believe, no matter how ignorant it may seem. To me at least.


I never actually said I do not respect the police, I never said that at all. I understand perfectly that the majority of police officers are in fact good people who do wish to go about their jobs effectively and protect the innocent.

After speaking and dealing with a number of police officers in my life, I can say that some of them are yes, in fact very nice people and good at their job others however have simply wanted to arrest someone regardless of how minor their crime (urinating in a public place, not very nice but not exactly murder is it?)

I suppose as someone has already said, police officers are human beings and just like any other human beings in life there are the good & the bad. However, I think theres a big difference being a bad car salesman and selling a bad deal compared to being a bad police officer and physically assaulting an innocent member of the public.


[edit on 28/8/08 by Death_Kron]



reply posted on 28-8-2008 @ 02:06 AM by BlackOps719
Originally posted by fleabit
Do you realize how many thousands of law enforcement officers are in the United States? You do realize that the few stories that are "brutal" are sensationalized and broadcast because it's 'good media' right?

How many "good deed" cop stories do you hear about? Not many eh? Why not? They don't sell as well as brutal stories. Disasters, strife, conflict.. those well. Papers and news stations realize this.

It's kinda funny.... the media rather responsible for the lack of serious interest in UFOs by the scientific community and much of the public. We recognize this. Yet we are blind to the fact that they do the same with the police. They are vicious and brutal killing machines! Um.. or not really.

Bad cops.. yup, they exist. Just like bad waiters, bad politicians, bad garbage disposal specialists, bad hairdresses, and bad bartenders. There are thousands of good cop deeds.. pity they are never talked about, never see the light of day. It's all about the horrible brutality.




Maybe you are right. It is true that you rarely ever hear stories any more about cops who do something positive or good for someone.

I have stated before that I do not hate cops, I support any police man or anyone else who does such a tough job yet still keeps their sense of professionalism and actually tries to do things right.

What people are getting fed up with is the short fuse mentallity and the attack dog approach that some of these officers take with unarmed Americans. Granted some people deserve to catch a beating here and there, but smacking a woman in the chest or face with a tactical baton and knocking her to the ground is messed up.

I watched that video from the Denver protest today and it sickened me. Even if she was obnoxious and even breaking the law, she was still a female and still unarmed. Cops who beat people to a pulp and go beyond the law should be locked up. Im sure these instances are rare compaired to all of the normal interactions police have with people on a daily basis, but the beating and tazing seems to be on the rise and all over the news.

Police want respect, yet people are not going to respect an unreasonable and angry individual barking orders. The approach has a great deal to do with the outcome. Yes there are good cops, but there are also cops who plant drugs and guns, cops who steal from crime scenes, cops who extort money from other criminals and cops who are just flat out violent psychopaths.

And until these types are reprimanded and removed from the streets police will always get a bad rap as enemy of the people.

[edit on 8/28/08 by BlackOps719]


reply posted on 28-8-2008 @ 03:28 AM by Death_Kron
Just thought I would add this link that I'v just found on the internet,

news.bbc.co.uk...

Okay, according to the article the boy had been drinking Vodka and threatening people with a fence, however when has a 30 year old ever felt "intimidated" by a 12 year old boy???

Absolutely ridiculous.

Not only did the officer assault the boy but also lied to his superiors initially and said he had fallen over!!! Now, I'm not condoning underage drinking or violence but still isn't this slightly excessive, not to mention ILLEGAL.


reply posted on 28-8-2008 @ 03:37 AM by Justice11
Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by dave420


Americans are not lesser beings. We are of all people. So calling us dumb is essentially calling yourself dumb.


As to brutality, it's nothing new. The world is just smaller now and so more is seen. The fear of being caught should refrain many of them.

Sometimes, Big brother watching you is a good thing.

[edit on 27-8-2008 by Gorman91]

Indeed.Keeps people more honest in their actions.Ive never had any trouble with police officers.Then again i dont break the law.
Pages: <<  2    3    4    5    6  >>    ^^TOP^^



Did Carl Sagan know something?
  Posted 18 days ago with 276 member flags
Earthly coincidences...or not.
  Posted 14 days ago with 122 member flags
Was this the real reason why Megaupload was closed down?
  Posted 19 days ago with 96 member flags
The Mysterious Death of Marilyn Monroe
  Posted 16 days ago with 85 member flags
Denver Airport Allows Camera Crew in Underground Facility
  Posted 16 days ago with 83 member flags