Untersberg - The Mystery Mountain

I hope this works.....

This should be post number 1000 on this thread. I've selfishly stolen it for myself! Sorry!

I never thought i would still be here, discussing this, nearly 18 months after i first found the thread, and i think its a credit to the fantastic initial post by Skyfloating, and some great contributions that have led this thread to where it is today, and kept me thoroughly enthralled.

So thanks, Skyfloating. And everyone else too.

Especially the "muses" among you.........

[edit on 20-1-2010 by BlueOrb]

Congratulations to Post #1000 BLUE ORB

You have been the spine of this thread, keeping it together and having it progress.

_________________________________________________________

Your Orb Pictures (previous page):

I have no doubt that there is energy floating around everywhere. Maybe plasmic lifeforms manifesting visually as Orbs do exist. Considering that the "dust particle" was at the exactly same place, one has to wonder.

Thanks for sharing.

reply to post by BlueOrb


I agree: there is no way that is a dust particle.
(If it were, it would require a whole new set of studies into the behaviour of dust! )

And I would love to hear from other people on ATS, to see what they think about it.

(On a personal note... I can't wait to show this picture to certain people who thought CLIMBING the Kehlstein, instead of taking the elevator, was the "interesting" thing to do!
Apparently, you don't have to be blond to be dumb... )







[edit on 20-1-2010 by Vanitas]

I have no doubt that there is energy floating around everywhere. Maybe plasmic lifeforms manifesting visually as Orbs do exist. Considering that the "dust particle" was at the exactly same place, one has to wonder.

A question: are there any good existing studies about this particular (if surmised) form of plasmic energy manifestation?

Originally posted by Vanitas
A question: are there any good existing studies about this particular (if surmised) form of plasmic energy manifestation?

None that I know of...

This is probably one of the most interesting reads I've had in a while. I found out what to fill the day with now lol Googling the Mountain!

reply to post by Skyfloating


I thought so.
Thanks!


Oh, and Tantalus...

I found out what to fill the day with now lol Googling the Mountain!

More like a MONTH!
And Google won't find you much more than what has been published here - trust me.





[edit on 20-1-2010 by Vanitas]

Originally posted by Vanitas

A question: are there any good existing studies about this particular (if surmised) form of plasmic energy manifestation?

You can take a look at www.acviews.com...

This is the site of Klaus Heinemann, who is the guy i sent the Berghof and Kehlsteinhaus photos to, for comment, around the same time i joined the site.

Damn....I'm giving away far too much information recently.....

That is a very good site - very interesting!
(I like the man's "milestones", BTW...)

I find it strange how few people (I mean in general, not just here) are willing to discuss orbs that really ARE orbs - not dust particles, refraction effects, optical illusions and what not. There seems to be a ludicrous division into people who insist orbs are "spirits" and so called "debunkers" (what a word! ) who cannot accept that not all such phenomena are tricks of the eye/mind.

Go figure...

Damn....I'm giving away far too much information recently.....

That's just it: YOU are putting this information out there... hence your contribution is safe!
(Why isn't there an applauding smiley available...?! :-)





[edit on 21-1-2010 by Vanitas]

Been reading through this thread all day, coloring myself deeply intrigued. For some reason it got me in the mood to look up sleeper prophecies and what not, as usually we could all be counted as 'sleeper kings'. Anyway, I got a hit on 'The Seven Sleepers', pretty interesting stuff.

Summary of the sleepers pretty much goes like this, "A legend about tells of the falling asleep of seven young men in a cave, who wake up after a great deal of time has passed"

reply to post by Nebulous89


You know... funny you mention that (or not ), because I have been intrigued by those old folk tales - many nations have them, from Norway to Vietnam (mentioning just those that I remember) - for years now!
I mean, think about it: where did they come from?
What sort of experience would spawn folk stories like THAT (and so many of them!)?


P.S. I don't mean just sleeping kings - most of all, I mean all those tales about people falling asleep and then coming back to their villages, only to find out that 100 - or 300 - years have passed.





[edit on 21-1-2010 by Vanitas]

reply to post by BlueOrb


I've been thinking a bit about the Iron Gate/Cave myself, and a relative of mine who has some experience in speleology told me that caves do have the habit of "appearing"/"disappearing", seemingly out of nowhere. For example, there are certain caves that had been found (and duly marked on maps), only to get "lost" again. (Sorry, no concrete examples at this point, but I am sure they could be found - in speleological literature, if nowhere else )
It - literally - goes with the terrain. Nature has a way of working fast, "obfuscating" people with fast-growing vegetation, etc.

However I wonder... wouldn't the people of the area rather call it a "hole" or something?

These are no more than idle thoughts, of course - and let's not forget that human imagination is probably the fastest growing and most luxuriant of all natural "phenomena".

Anyway, how extensively has the mountain been explored in terms of speleology, geology, etc.?

(I know, I could google for it, but at this point I really prefer hearing from local experts like White Eagle - even if I have to wait... )



[edit on 22-1-2010 by Vanitas]

reply to post by Vanitas


In terms of exploration, i think over the years there has been a lot of exloring going on (remember the latest information regarding the lake 900m down?). There is also a book, published in the mid 70s.

neu.hoehlenverein-salzburg.at...

This site has the book - it's the first book in the series from this organisation, and i am told that it covers/concentrates on the Untersberg.

It's called Salzburger Hoehlenbuch Bd 1, by Walter Klappacher and Karl Mais.

It's also available on Amazon.de (search for "salzburger hohlen", who, annoyingly, for some reason, won't send it to Dubai, otherwise i would be writing now that i had just bought it (1 copy available on Amazon). The "Hoehlenverein" website has an order form, but it just completes the order form and then doesn't ask for payment or anything. I assume they must email you with payment details, or something. Unless you are in Dubai, of course, in which case they ignore you and you hear nothing! I first completed this weeks ago.

So good luck if you go ahead and buy it. If you do, can you please tell me what's in it!?

And regarding the "disappearing" caves, i can fully believe that they do "disappear". It was my first thought when i read about the "eisernen Tuer" that would "appear". My though was that there may have been trees or bushes near the opening. and that they would cover the cave entrance in, say, the spring and summer, but then in Winter, when the leaves disappeared, they would "reveal" the cave entrance.

Again, this may be a result of "storytelling", and chinese whispers, when information is passed from person to person, and at each stage takes a slightly different turn due to language used, the result being something like:

Vanitas to BlueOrb : "The cave known as the iron door is not visible all the time, sometimes there's foliage in front of it"

BlueOrb to Skyfloating: "You can only see the iron door cave sometimes"

Skyfloating to Forum: "There is an Iron door, that cannot generally be seen, but appears sometimes......."

Good luck with the book!

[edit on 22-1-2010 by BlueOrb]

reply to post by BlueOrb


Thank you - that's very interesting information!

I suppose I'll have to (re)open an account with Amazon...
This may be off-topic (or not), but I stopped doing business with them a few years ago, when their branches in France, Germany and the USA messed up big time with several of my orders (and the "international" - USA - branch actually stole my money, through one of their off-site "associates"). The only one I don't remember having major problems with was Amazon UK.

So I am not surprised - OK, I am, actually - that they would not ship to impossibly exotic and far-away Dubai...
(There be dragons!)

Just a passing remark before I go: if you or anyone is thinking of going there any time soon, perhaps the Spring equinox would be a good time to attempt an unveiling of... whatever it is there?







[edit on 23-1-2010 by Vanitas]

Another thing thast has been bothering me for some time now, is the lettering that apparently Lazarus Gitschner saw when he was inside the mountain. I think it was S.V.R.G.E.T.S.A.T.V.M, OR S.U.R.G.E.T.S.A.T.U.M, which when translated from Latin (assuming of course it is Latin), means "Arise satire", and thus, makes no sense at all.

I was watching a youtube video talking about the Untersberg Myths the other day, and it was described as "S.O.R.G.E.T.S.A.T.O.M.". (I will try and find it again and edit to include the link...).

It puts a slightly different spin on it, as SATOM is to sow, or plant (as in crops).

If you combine the two descriptions and play around a bit, you could get "SURG ET SATOM", WHICH WOULD BE "Rise and Sow". Sounds a bit like a mantra for the people living in the mountain, encouraging them in some kind of communal harvesting activity or other.

I'm certainly no expert (or even close) with Latin - I used an online translator - but if someone out there is a little more schooled in the language, maybe by playing around a little more (assuming the original tale of the letters may be slightly off the mark), something intersting could "arise".......or not, as the case may be.......

reply to post by BlueOrb


Certainly "to sow" (sero, satum, in Latin) makes - at least in appearance - much more sense than anything else. Even if the "sentence" is not grammatically correct, it wouldn't necessarily discredit this interpretation, because it's a well known fact that Latin - which was "corrupted" (in effect, dying out) even in Late Antiquity - endured many irregularities in later popular usage.

Only, it baffles me why would anyone write such an exhortation in such a place - especially considering that sowing (plants) was the natural activity of the local population?

Perhaps the "sowing" refers to something else?

Or is perhaps the "sentence" Latin only in appearance - to confuse uninvited eyes and throw them off the scent...?
Perhaps the initials stand for something else?
(V.I.T.R.I.O.L. is one such famous example.)

Anyway, very interesting!


P.S. For someone who is "no expert" in Latin you're doing very well.




[edit on 25-1-2010 by Vanitas]

reply to post by Vanitas



Just an afterthought, from one Latin non-expert to other non-experts:
assuming it is in Latin and that it means what it appears to mean (which I doubt)... shouldn't the translation read "arise TO sow"?

Sero

It may appear to be a negligible difference in meaning - but there is no such thing where riddles are concerned...


P.S. I forgot to include the other meanings of sero (found through the link above, obviously):

1. I sow, plant.
2. (of persons) I beget, bring forth, produce.
3. (figuratively) I found, establish; scatter, spread, disseminate; propagate; excite; cause, produce.






[edit on 25-1-2010 by Vanitas]

Originally posted by BlueOrbS.V.R.G.E.T.S.A.T.V.M, OR S.U.R.G.E.T.S.A.T.U.M,

you know there are a few different versions of this transcriptions from lazarus.
i think the original transcription is:

S. d. d. occo. x.
Satrnrop, 5. a. f. 5. l. d.
P. 6. m. 6. a. t. 5. q. o. t. m. 5. r. u. a t.
m. 519. r. l. v. e. p. 55. a. tt. tt. l. x. missm
ariu. a. o. u st g c x 5. l. 19. alto mvraco
mic r l y. pymi. l o p m i. v m l t. t g

you have to check this in the salzburg museum:
www.salzburgmuseum.at...
in the archive of this museum should exist the original handwriting of lazarus.
this strange signs are looking like a code.

the popular words surget satum and others are engineerd - maybe from church? because of the latin words, which than make sense from catholic understatement.

reply to post by white eagle


Oh, it's good to see you back, White Eagle!

Thank you very much for the data.
Do you know, have there been any attempts of interpretation published?
(I am asking because I googled for some of the terms of the "code", but the results mostly pointed back to ATS and to your forum.)