PARA: Untersberg - The Mystery Mountain

reply to post by Vanitas

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Vanitas,

Gutted.

Gutted, gutted, gutted! Gutted for you, and for the thread!

I know EXACTLY how you must have felt - the same sort of thing has happened to me, more than once. Except these were one and two week holidays, taken over by people who prefer to lie on a beach rather than get out and explore. Valuable lesson learned, though. Skyfloating (and you) have it right - either go alone or go with someone who is of the same mind.

Climbing the Kehlstein? Do you mean from the bus stop at the tunnel, or from the bottom!!? Either way, it's madness! I went up there last August, and took the elevator route - after all, surely half the point is to ride in the same elevator that Hitler and so many others used (tip - if you go in the elevator, try to stand exactly in the centre - That's where Adolf used to stand, as he was afraid of heights and lightning strikes). I got to the top, and found that the cloud cover was such that i couldn't see anything from the top. €15 down the drain in terms of a good photo!!

Unfortunately, at that time, i was totally unaware of the whole Untersberg thing, and so my only interest was tring to recreate, in photo form, the view of the mountain from the big picture window in the Berghof - also difficult due to the number of trees on the Berghof site. I had to settle for stealing some brick debris, an original piece of the driveway wall (removed personally by me - yeah....sue me!) and nabbing a photo of my big black A6 Hire car parked in Hitler's driveway (simple things amuse simple minds!).

As a consolation, why not try what i have been doing - view the Untersberg in Google Maps, in 3D. Lot less energy expended, and you can smoke while you do it!!! (I also appreciated the consolation cigarette you had)

[edit on 21-8-2009 by BlueOrb]

Thank you, Blue Orb!
And I mean it.




Let me guess: Sharm al-Sheyk, on the Red Sea?
Oh no, sorry: that happened to ME...
There was Mount Sinai, there was St. Catherine's... but who needs them if you can lie by the hotel pool all day?
(I didn't mind, I preferred going up there alone - or in the company of total strangers - anyway.)





You would think, wouldn't you!




Who are you? The twin I never had?!

That's EXACTLY what I did.
I didn't know that about Hitler, but I thought: if I were him, I would probably stand right here (and I suspect a gentleman who was also in the elevator had the same idea ).


And how I envy your entire Obersalzberg trip...!
Right now, I can't bear the mention of it, but before this trip - and I am sure, pretty soon again - I would have LOVED to go rummaging around the remains of the Berghof! (Even though I would have much preferred to see the site as it once was.)

I have just noticed I am starting to almost enjoy reminiscing about this trip, regardless all the frustration. I am sure your message has a lot to do with it.

And of course, we can always say: next year at the Untersberg. ;-)











[edit on 21-8-2009 by Vanitas]

reply to post by Vanitas

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......I was the "gentleman" wanting to stand in the middle of the elevator!

Nah...not really! I only found that out afterwards too, so missed my chance. At least you had that "pleasure" on your trip.

And so you haven't heard from your cousin? Sure she isn't in Egypt!
You know how that will end....pregnant, married to a sea captain and disappearing somewhere in Germany, never to be heard of again!

I plan to go back there and explore for a few days as soon as i can - this time planning my trip and sites to visit around what i have learned from this thread and from you guys on it.

The mountain, of course, but also Hallthurm, Koenigssee, the churches and yes, back to Obersalzburg for old times sake! I think a few days there, armed with a bit more background knowledge will be a nice break. Unfortunately, i am stuck in the Middle east for the time being, and the earliest i will probably be back to Europe will be November/December, when the Kehlstein Pass is, i believe, closed due to the weather, and generally, it will be cold, snowy, and not like an August day at all.

I'll give everyone the heads up on here, in case anyone is in the area too. I'm sure too, that someone on here will probably be going a lot sooner than me.

Today I sped the highway nearby because I had business in Salzburg, Austria. Because of all the stuff surrounding this thread I just had to at least leave the highway once and come close to the mountain. I did not have the time to explore so I sat on a bench at an open field, not a person around and simply meditated on the whole mystique surrounding the place for about 30 minutes. And that mountain certainly has that "special something" about it. You can stare at so many mountains and wont feel the difference, but with this one you do.

It just stands there surrounded by flat plains, whereas all the mountains behind it are chains of mountains connected to others. This one is the "odd man out". The entire area is stunningly beautiful. The green looks rich, the trees quaint, and the mountain itself is profound. Maybe thats why its the only mountain in Europe that the Dalai Lama specifically pointed out.

I promised to return at another date to dedicate myself to the mountain only.

You missed out on the nightwalk to Mt. Sinai? Shame on you. Thats even more awesome than Untersberg. And the beach is so much more enjoyable the next day.

reply to post by Vanitas

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Thats fantastic.You can pan round and actually take control of the camera.Really enjoyed getting a live look at the subject were discussing! One large star for you my friend!

So, now you understand why blondie wouldn't budge, no matter how insidiously you tried to displace her...

I can't wait about to read your - or anyone else's - experience, when you go!
It really is something special.

Do let us know before you go!




[edit on 28-8-2009 by Vanitas]

Do I sound like someone who would miss THAT..?

No way!
Besides, I HAD to walk by night, in order to see the sunrise (which was supposed to be the highlight of the trip - and it was, of course, but just the walk alone was mind blowing.)


P.S. Oh, I just realised I was probably misleading in that earlier post: it wasn't ME who opted for the pool - it was someone else that I usually spent a lot of time with... well, until the subject of Sinai - or ANY kind of foot work, actually - came up...



[edit on 28-8-2009 by Vanitas]

reply to post by dooleysleftleg

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Thanks! Now that's what I call a friend.

I am so glad you enjoyed it.
(Be sure to flush the cache from time to time, or just close and reopen the browser window, because I've noticed that it starts to lag and just stops after a while - especially if it's a really loooong while. ;-)






[edit on 28-8-2009 by Vanitas]

reply to post by Skyfloating

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Yes, it does have a special aura about it.

Do you - or anyone else - happen to know what else (if anything) the Dalai Lama said about it?
I find his remark ("heart chakra of Europe" etc.) really interesting, but I would like to know more about the specific context of his statement.

reply to post by Vanitas

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Keep your fingers well and truly crossed!

I have emailed the Dalai Lama regarding this, and hope to get some sort of response asap.

No really......I really did!!!!

How bizarre does that sound? "I've just emailed the Dalai Lama......"

Anyway, hopefully he will be able to shed some light on this for us all here - i cannot find anything on the net apart from the "Heart Chakra of Europe" and "Sleeping Giant" quote. I bet he's got quite a lot to say about it - hopefully i have caught him (or his office) on a good day, and flattered him enough to get a response!

Watch this space!

The context was a visit of his to Austria. It was quoted in newspapers but he really did not say much else on it. All he did was specifically select to mention that mountain.

Whoa - way to go, Blue Orb!

My fingers well and truly crossed - all twenty of them!
And I wouldn't be too surprised if you do get an answer.

Could you please share or link more about this?

reply to post by BlueOrb

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So apparently your email did not get any reply at all? Its probably some office-assistant sitting there having no idea what you`re talking about.

reply to post by Skyfloating

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I have to look for it, I read it on a book I have about UFOs.

reply to post by Skyfloating

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No reply yet. Been over a week now.

Hard to guess if he's the sort of bloke who get hundreds and hundreds of emails from the general public. I suspect so, especially with the whole China vs Tibet thing going on.

I haven't lost all hope, but am not holding my breath.

Just for the record, here's what i sent:

"Your Holiness,

Forgive me for the intrusion of emailing you, but I would like to ask you about a comment that I believe you made regarding the Untersberg mountain in Germany. I believe you may have made this remark in 1992, during a visit to the area.

To explain a little, I am part of a discussion group on the internet regarding this mountain specifically – It’s history as a community focal point, it’s physical properties as a geomagnetic anomaly, and it’s enduring attraction as a natural phenomenon that many believe plays an important role in many respects.

I have read on the internet that you described the Untersberg as the “Heart Chakra of Europe” and a “Sleeping Giant”. Myself and other participants in the discussion are intrigued as to what exactly you meant by these remarks, and in what context. Obviously, you have some personal knowledge of the history of this place, and can relate it’s “function”, as it were, to the mountains in the Himalayas and in other parts of the world, in terms of the earth itself, and the evolution of its people throughout thousands of years.

It would be an honour if you could find the time to expand (just a little) on these remarks, and I, and many others, would welcome your further thoughts and clarification. I thank you most deeply in anticipation.

On a final, personal note, I would like to commend you on your stance throughout the years of dispute with China in your home country. I wish you success in your journey to protect the independence of Tibet, which I am sure is one of the “special” places on this planet. It is my hope that one day I may visit, and experience your country for myself.


Kind Regards"


I thought it was succinct, flattering, and with just the right amount of grovelling.

i think you hold a good theory as to why those people on that mountain may have seen things or why time anomalies were present, the only problem i see with your post and my conflicting thoughts are this. if DMT is what causes you to see what you see in dreams then, from my current understanding, i believe that what you see through dmt trips could be real or for lack of better terms not a trip or illusion. from my resources i have heard that through dreaming you can astral project, now wether that is true or not im not sure, but im starting to lean towards the thought that dreams can be a direct path to astral projecting, which i know for a fact are real based on my experiences (APing that is), and there are tests that can be done to prove its authenticity. But if im right about the connection between dreaming,dmt, and astral projecting then wow! how amazing would that be? I believe i will find the answer to my questions one day from personal trials, as i plan to become as good as robert bruce is in astral projecting, its like each passing day i become more obsessed with spirituality! =)

This is a bit of a "work in progress", but i thought i'd put it up and see what you think.

I was given a "hint" about something from someone who has researched a LOT about this area. In fact, he has a very good website that we have used in this forum already (Alpenfestung.net). I emailed him to congratulate him on the website and to chase up some info that was due to be added some time ago. The query was regarding the mention of a "Berg-Berghof-Berg" line. He hinted to draw a line from the Untersberg to the Berghof. This i duly did, in Google earth. Where to start on the Untersberg, i thought, and so i chose the Mittagsscharte (the V shaped dip in the ridge). So i line that up with the Berghof site, and then contuniued it further....and it lines us perfectly with the summit of the Hoher Goll mountain behind. Coincidence? You could argue, that Haus Wachenfeld, that later became the Berghof, was already there before Hitler even visited Obersalzburg, but then again he chose this house on purpose. He is even quoted as saying something like "it is no coincidence that i have my house here". (I can find this quote if necessary). Anyway, that issue aside, i then considered whether there could possibly be any other relevance to the location of the Berghof, or other buildings in the area. So i drew a line from the Kehlstein Haus (Eagle's Nest) to the Berghof, and carried that further too. I was a little amazed when i saw that it also created a line from the Kehlstein Haus, throiugh the Berghof, to the site of the 2nd Isaias Temple, at the foot of the Untersberg. See link to picture.


Another coincidence? Maybe. I'm just putting it out there for comment. But bear this in mind....the Isais revelations, made to the Knights Templar, were, it is said, delivered at the site of the second temple (already discussed in this thread). It is said they included information regarding the Holy Grail. The Cathars allegedly kept the Holy Grail at Montsegur, France, a mountain fortress perched on top of a ridge. Much like the Kehlstein Haus . In fact, very alike:



The case for the location of the Kehlstein Haus being less of a coincidence is greater, since it was built specifically as a present for Hitler, by Martin Bormann on behalf of the Nazi Party. Again, as we have already discussed, it was an amazing feat of engineering, and a lot of work to make the road to the tunnel (just one turn over 6km). Could it be that they went to all that trouble because it HAD to be in that location? (i am intrigued as to why the length of the tunnel leading to the elevator, and the elevator shaft itself are EXACLTY the same length - i think 407ft. What is this significance? Or is a a coincidence?

We know that the Occult played a role in various quarters of Nazism. So was "Alignment" important to them too? Berhof aligned between two mountains, and between the "new Montsegur" (my words!) and the Isaias Temple?

I personally think there are more aligment issues, or specifically placement issues to be researched in regard to the Nazi buildings in this area, and i think that they are linked to earth anomalies, magnestism, gravity, or whatever.

Like i said, it's in progress, but i think more will be revealed.

(PS: Thanks to Michael for the "hint". Gruss!)

[edit on 27-9-2009 by BlueOrb]

[edit on 27-9-2009 by BlueOrb]

I've always suspected that much myself.
(I've never had DMT - or any type of "hard" drug - but I did experience what could be called a "trip" while under the influence of another substance.)

I am highlighting this part of your post simply because I believe it's an important point to make. The term "hallucination" sounds so dauntingly "scientific" - but the reality is, it's simply a descriptive term for a series of reported perceptual phenomena, the causes of which vary and are far from being definitively established.


And BlueOrb: give it time.
I know a person who also wrote to him once, and a few months later he received a thoughtful reply.
As you said, he probably gets millions of email messages!