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Measles is back, and it's because your kids aren't vaccinated

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posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:32 PM
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reply to post by ThroatYogurt
 


I agree, although I do think it's not just vaccines.

At the core of the problem, if people wake up to this reality, we will find elitist inspired population control philosophies being implemented on a near global level through compartmentalized and hierarchical control structures and secret societies that transcend national governments.

So here, as always, we have the wake up meme.




posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by realshanti

Originally posted by TruthTellist
Lies only an American would believe; "Vaccines work, you can trust us - we're from the Government and here to help"

Vaccination is not IMMUNIZATION.

But don't listen to me, I'm a doctor.... I work for The Man....


Finally - thank you....my brother was a doc as well and he was the one who told me that there are NO long term scientific studies of any group from the time vaccines are given to adult hood and beyond - NONE - ZERO - ZILCH - but its proven science? While I 'm glad it seems to work for many folks - to say there are no harmful side effects is absolute rubbish because there are no studies to back up that claim...a short term study on links to autism does not cut it -


Hey, I'll bite.

What is the difference between Vaccination and Immunization?

Second, is that true? That there are not ANY long term studies on vaccines?

(My personal opinion is that the polio vaccine was the last true and real vaccine to come out.)



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:35 PM
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Originally posted by Fromabove
They put poison in the stuff they inject into you. Look what they did to all those black men in the south when they gave them all VD just so they could watch how they all died and spread it around.


Just where is the proof in this??



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:37 PM
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Originally posted by gizmohd

Originally posted by Fromabove
They put poison in the stuff they inject into you. Look what they did to all those black men in the south when they gave them all VD just so they could watch how they all died and spread it around.


Just where is the proof in this??


That's a joke right? Look up Tuskeegee Experiment (spelling may be off).



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:39 PM
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american, yes that is my point...that you misread her point. She was comparing giving someone a vaccine to giving someone a cocktail of drugs that you dont know what is really in it. Then you went on to say "oh, a nurse should check the date, dosage, storage" yada yada. That doesnt address the fact that she meant none of these things...she meant the combination of junk in vaccines has unproven and maltested effects. Such as the new Guardasil vaccine (one less!) for HPV which is already responsible for 16 deaths i believe, thousands of hospitalizations, and which has only been tested on young girls, for no longer than 5 years, for a cancer which is supposed to effect women in their 30's.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:41 PM
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oh, but to add to my above post, those 16 girls are definitely protected from HPV now.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 09:54 PM
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Originally posted by pexx421
american, yes that is my point...that you misread her point. She was comparing giving someone a vaccine to giving someone a cocktail of drugs that you dont know what is really in it. Then you went on to say "oh, a nurse should check the date, dosage, storage" yada yada. That doesnt address the fact that she meant none of these things...she meant the combination of junk in vaccines has unproven and maltested effects.



Here's what she wrote:


As a nurse I was trained to never let another person draw up a medication and then expect me to either give it or accept responsibility for what was in that syringe that I didn't personally draw out of the vial myself. Yet that is exactly what getting vaccines entails. No thanks.


I admit that I didn't understand her point - that's why I posted what I did. How is getting vaccinated "exactly" like accepting a prepared syringe from someone else and giving it to a patient?

I did not actually say a nurse should check expiration dates etc (although they should, are trained to, and I suspect any nurses on here will agree with this). I said that it is a good idea for a patient or patient's parent to ask the nurse if he or she has.

Now, since the OP was about measles vaccination and whether new outbreaks of measles are related to parents refusing to have their kids vaccinated, may I suggest that we move our discussion of our relative abilities as far as reading comprehension goes into u2u's and the discussion of Gardasil, the Tuskegee Experiment, etc. elsewhere in the forums?



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:02 PM
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as for ours, yes, but as to guardasil, tuskeegee, etc, i think these all add to the argument that there is not necessarily any validity to the idea that taking vaccines gives protection, and that the reason for the outbreak of measles is due to parents opting out. In order to even show some correllation, they would have to show the percentage of parents in those affected areas that opted out, and compare it with other areas with similar outbreaks, and show parents there were opting out in similar amounts.
SOOOooo....how many amish communities have come down with measles? Are there larger outbreaks among jehova's witness, or christian scientists?? If not, there is no validity to this argument.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:03 PM
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once again, back to the amish...i also think there are few outbreaks of mumps, rubella, smallpox, etc, and they forego all these as well. So how does this reflect upon the vaccines ridding the world of disease paradigm??



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:07 PM
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reply to post by sir_chancealot
 


No one was given syphilis during the Tuskegee Experiment.

The details of the study are covered here.

Tuskegee Study of Untreated Syphilis in the Negro Male



[edit on 2008/8/24 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:17 PM
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Originally posted by Lasheic

I don't care what people "believe" about the subject, or what they think they know. I care about what is accurate, what can be tested, measured, verified, and confirmed to be accurate. The studies in the peer reviewed literature are done by professionals under strict controls and have not only withstood the scrutiny of their peers, but have been confirmed by other independent experiments and studies.

What you think is common sense can often be very wrong. Much of it is based on misconceptions, urban legends, and old folk knowledge has has since proven to be untrue.

I'd rather not trust my child's fate to the kangaroo court of common (non)sense and "popular experience" (when in truth, the vast -VAST- majority of vaccine recipients show absolutely no side-effects and those who do often cannot be conclusively linked to the vaccine)


How about a kangaroo court of medical associations being funded by pharmaceutical companies. How about those pharma companies being able to put pressure on peer reviews and those actually conducting the science. Grants would NEVER be refused for those disagreeing with the big pharma line right?

Oh wait, those people must be above corruption, or political pressure to save their gig, right?

I wish I could live in your "perfect world" where everyone is above all the lies and greed.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:21 PM
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reply to post by pexx421
 


The trouble with using the Amish as a control group is that they also have very limited contact with people outside their community, therefore limited exposure to pathogens that are not already present in the community.

I'm going to link this again because there's really a lot of good solid numbers in it, and I think it's a good idea to read what you're arguing against. Here's the CDC report on measles outbreaks in the U.S. in January through April of this year. Note that the numbers are not very impressive (at least not yet): 64 confirmed cases in that time, with 63 of those affecting unvaccinated people and at least 54 of them associated with importation from another country.

www.cdc.gov...

Please note, I think the pharmaceutic industry is a disgrace. I just think we should be able to use science to fight against them rather than spreading panic among people who aren't interested enough to do their own research.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:22 PM
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My wife had our first child 3 weeks ago ... little boy ... nice and healthy ...

Do we vaccinate??

That is the big question.

So I jumped online ... I have spent about 10 hours so far looking for arguments for and against.

Plenty of arguments for vaccination ... everywhere you look ...

The arguments against?? ... besides a few blogs and posts in forums which I would never use as a basis for a decision that will effect my child ... apart from these opinions, I could find NOTHING in the way of well presented, well backed up arguments against vaccination.

... And there must be some, surely!

Does any of you know a link to arguments against vaccination that are considered to be legitimate?



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:28 PM
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Originally posted by Horza

Does any of you know a link to arguments against vaccination that are considered to be legitimate?


try safeminds.org... to start.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:34 PM
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I found the following 10+ minutes read very interesting.
If this chronology is factual then that would verify how worthless vaccines are.
Again, this could be BS. Nevertheless interesting.
Hall Of Shame. A Selective Chronology of Medicine



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:41 PM
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to the above, vaccinetruth.org may have some info for you, i think i checked out something there a while ago.
As to our discussion though, the best way to avoid, and to treat illnesses is through natural medicine, and good health practices. Its NOT by injecting dangerous and unproven toxins into our bodies. Now, dont get me wrong, i DO actually approve of certain ones, ones that have high success rate, against mostly lethal diseases, and low risk of side effects, such as hep. But i see no reason for dangerous additives as it only saves the pharm industry cents on each vaccine. I see no reason for massive amounts of vaccines when naturally acquired immunity through exposure is more effective, and has no possible toxic side effects for your immune system. I see no reason for use of medicine of ANY kind that has so much bias and emotion involved in its funding and use. There is no way that the research behind vaccines (and indeed many of our meds) is unbiased, this has been proven time and again, and until our FDA can get conflicts of interest out of its ruling body, i personally will not trust anything i hear from a doctor just because a doctor said it. I will do my own research on both sides, and measure the risk vs. the gain. There is NO REASON for annual flu shots. Flu kills very few people, mostly the elderly or the immunosuppressed. Same with chicken pocks and other tame or rare diseases. You can prevent or minimize most of these with proper diet and nutrition (not to be confused with the Standard American Diet or SAD) and use of herbs or supplements when necessary.
Problem with this is that most americans dont want to take the time to invest in educating themselves about their health, they just want someone to spoonfeed them knowledge (often faulty or profit driven) and give them a magic pill. So...this being the case, if you are one of those who cant be bothered to maintain a healthy lifestyle, or to educate yourself about health then take the doctors orders and deal with the consequences. But i can tell you this....after working in the medical field for 8 years now, i know that the road of western medicine is one that ends in heart disease, Diabetes, MRSA, arthritis, depression, obesity, and a whole bag of pills.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:47 PM
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Originally posted by sir_chancealot
Hey, I'll bite.

What is the difference between Vaccination and Immunization?

Second, is that true? That there are not ANY long term studies on vaccines?

(My personal opinion is that the polio vaccine was the last true and real vaccine to come out.)


The answer to your second question is - Yes its true - there are NO long term safety studies on vaccines -

www.whale.to...

The difference between immunization and vaccination - not sure of the medical difference but for me it boils down to this:

I had the measles and now I am 100% rock solid immune - will never have it again...

Those who are vaccinated have a good shot at not getting the disease but they are not 100% immune...

Otherwise why would it be such a big deal that a few un-vaccinated people got the measles - if vaccinations meant 100% immunization no one would give a rats a$$ about the 63 kids that contracted the disease because they were not vaccinated...

Vaccination does not "eradicate" anything - just lowers your chances of getting a certain diseases.

one last thought and this is not science just irony - We have "controlled" (cough) certain disease,s some very deadly, only to have the the most deadly plague on the planet attacking what? The immune system itself and that of course is Aids..If I were a philosopher I could have a friggin hay day with that...






[edit on 24-8-2008 by realshanti]



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:55 PM
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hmm...i dont know if i would call AIDS the most deadly plague.... it hasnt killed nearly as many people as bubose or yellow fever. Actually, in the US, the rate of infection has never really grown much from its original amounts, and we have roughly a 10000 a year mortality from AIDS, and as i stated earlier, that puts it slightly ahead of aspirin and tylenols 7000 annually and yet you dont see a war on nsaids.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 10:59 PM
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um.....I had the measles in the 1970's. I wasn't near death or anything. I was out of school for a week. I am fine.

Is this just one big scare tactic? This use to be a normal course of events when I was a kid. You got the measles....you stay at home....your body fights it off....you go on with life.

What the hell is the big deal ???????????????????

[edit on 24-8-2008 by wdkirk]



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 11:03 PM
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Originally posted by realshanti
Those who are vaccinated have a good shot at not getting the disease but they are not 100% immune...

Otherwise why would it be such a big deal that a few un-vaccinated people got the measles - if vaccinations meant 100% immunization no one would give a rats a$$ about the 63 kids that contracted the disease because they were not vaccinated...


Well, their families might.

And then there's the children between the age of 6 months (around when they lose the immunity they got from their mother) and one year (when they are eligible for vaccination).

Edit to say my point more straightforwardly:
If an 8-month old is taken to the emergency room for some unrelated issue, and is exposed there to measles from the kid in the next chair who was eligible for vaccination but unvaccinated, that 8-month old and their family will probably care.

[edit on 24-8-2008 by americandingbat]



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