Russia Fails to Remove Troops

Russia Fails to Remove Troops

www.telegraph.co.uk

The Russians may have left Gori, but they were clearly determined not to surrender their stranglehold on the city.
Western politicians, including David Miliband, the Foreign Secretary, protested bitterly that this was not the withdrawal that Russia had promised, merely a partial pull-back.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Thoughts?

www.telegraph.co.uk
(visit the link for the full news article)

Ye its as almost as if they want a world war Mmmmm

[edit on 4/20/2008 by billyjoinedat2k8]

I find it ironic that the countries calling for Russian troop removal, are still in Iraq and Afghanistan. And some still have troops in Germany, Japan, S. Korea and other places around the globe.





[edit on 23-8-2008 by whaaa]

reply to post by whaaa


And not only that, those same countries demanded that Russia acts as the peacekeeping force in the disputed area but complain about them setting up checkpoints. It's like the whole thing was scripted by Monty Python.

Ok simply question - why should Russia bother to remove troops from Georgia?


Russia defeated Georgia militarily. Russian actions in the war are very much supported within Russia. U.S. and NATO gave their assurance that they will not get involved in Georgia militarily. If Russia withdraws all the way, Georgia is on the fast track to NATO. Russia has already been painted as the demon in the Western press, so it stands nothing to lose in the PR war.


Honestly - even a very slightly hard-line President would not rush with withdrawing troops from Georgia - if he were in Medvedev's shoes. If anything Russian gradual withdrawal is showing willingness on part of Russia to cooperate with the West, despite the fact that they won the war.

It wouldn't take much for Russia to topple Saakashvilli from power now. All they need to do is blow really hard, and Saaka's house of straws will fall down. I am sure a fair number of world leaders wouldn't hold back in Russia's place.





So Russia will take all the time it needs scouting Georgia for more made-in-the-USA war trophies. Maybe U.S. should just feed the hungry bear through Georgia - how many hummers and M-16's will it take to quench Russia's thirst? Maybe U.S. should donate a few abrams tanks, or even some old aircraft carrier to Georgia, so Russia can take it as a prize and go back home? Common - start the bidding. Do I hear 100 more Hummers and 2,000 assault rifles to have Russia go home?

The Russians were very close to doing the first graceful thing we've seen in geopolitics in a long time. The longer they stay, the less graceful. They won in absolutely destroyed the Georgians with barely any effort at all. I know they are upset and wary of the intentions of NATO and especially the U.S. in regards to the missile defense shield in Poland, but it is time for them to leave and let Georgia recover and go on their way.

All sources from both sides indicate that Russian troops are withdrawing everywhere except for Poti. Statements by the Russian military acknowledge that Russian forces remain in Poti, but state that this is only temporary. There are also news from the Russian sources in the last few days that Russian soldiers are digging entrenchments in Poti, and then leaving them. Why they are doing this is beyond me - physical exercise?

Russians will leave Poti last. There is no doubt more to the port city and its importance to Georgian military than we know.

reply to post by maloy


Do you think Russia will actually leave Georgia at all, Maloy? I thought they were 'staying'?

Russia says it will maintain military checkpoints within Georgian territory for good, despite a promise to complete a partial troop withdrawal by the end of the day.

A senior Russian official said they will build a permanent infrastructure in a ‘buffer zone’ close to the disputed breakaway region of South Ossetia.

(euronews.net)

Georgia buffer checkpoints "permanent" - Russia

By leave I mean retreat from Georgian towns like Senaki, Gori, and Poti and most of the undisputed Georgian territory. I am fairly certain Russia isn't planning to occupy them for long, if only because the local population would protest.

Certainly Russian troops aren't leaving S. Ossetia, and will likely establish outposts on the Georgian side of the SO border - like agreed in the peace accord. But I doubt the "outposts" will include actual Georgian towns like Poti.

I heard that Russian forces left Senaki, and largely left Gori. Why they are lingering in Poti I don't know. But if they were going to occupy Georgia for long why would they even agree to withdraw troops to start with? And why withdraw from Senaki and Gori?

Let's put the shoe on the other foot for a moment. Just for parallel let's consider Russia put in a missile defense shield in Cuba, Canada, and S. America.
Would that make us anxious? I believe so.

[edit on 8/23/2008 by jpm1602]

reply to post by maloy


Ah, you make some good points there.

I guess the question is: Why do the Russians remain in Poti?

From 23 August:

"Putting up permanent facilities and checkpoints are inconsistent with the (ceasefire) agreement," said White House spokesman Gordon Johndroe.

French President Nicolas Sarkozy "insisted it was important that Russian troops present at the Poti/Senaki area should withdraw as soon as possible," a French statement said.

(Source: AlertNet)

Maybe they haven't withdrawn from Senaki? I thought they had, too.

Well Poti is one of Georgia's main trade ports. But occupying it will hardly cripple the Georgian economy or ability to receive aid from abroad. Georgia still has Batumi and a number of small ports, plus many airfields.

Sure Poti is more important to Russia strategically than Senaki or Gori. But I really do not see why Russia would need it. They already have access to Georgia from the Black Sea at Sukhumi in Abkhazia. If they remain to occupy just Poti - it would be fairly difficult with surrounding region under Georgia's control - and would cause major tension with NATO.

Maybe Russia is just testing ground to see how NATO continues to react. Or maybe Russia is marveling at its small victory and wants to rub it in for Georgia. No one on these boards (and likely no civilians) really know why Russia is in Poti and what is going on there. So it is left to speculation. I speculate that Russia will withdraw from Poti in 1-2 weeks, if not sooner.

The Russian soldiers reportedly digging trenches there is awkward of course. Maybe they are looking for treasure? Or buried oil pipelines?

Time will tell what's really their objective such as cutting off oil supplies during the winter. Businesses pulling out of Russia might just be bought up by Russia's allies. I don't really see this area representing anything else than oil supply and missles. The Russians are letting relief supplies in so they don't have to pay for it. No doubt they will take what they want, especially if it's useful to them such as relief vodka.

Relief vodka? Well the U.S. just made the biggest mistake of all by bringing relief vodka to Georgia. They are clearly trying to bait Russia to attack the humanitarian aid convoy. This is an act of provokation. Russia will demand relief vodka be delived straight to their headquarters - for verifying and testing that it is no military aid to Georgia of course.


As for oil - Poti is not as crucial in the Caspian oil-export game. The main Trans Caspian pipelines lies far away from Poti. If Russia has thirst for oil, they would have invaded Georgia a week ago. This is not about oil.

The culling of the least of society. Like clubbing baby seals in Norwegia. Dispatched with great prejudice. Times like these make me proud to be human.

good to know that Russia is continuously humiliating West for its aggressive propanganda BS

What? Georgians shell Tskhinvali in South Ossetia killing numerous people; including twelve Russian peacekeepers and innocent citizens, and now they want Russia to leave?

Why the hell should they if they have no guarantee that South Ossetia (or their investments?) will be protected?

Originally posted by MacDonagh
Why the hell should they if they have no guarantee that South Ossetia (or their investments?) will be protected?

Not to worry - NATO and UN will come in and protect everyone. Like they did in Yugoslavia (hint - Srebrenica massacre).

Or better yet - maybe Georgia can "peacekeep" S. Ossetia. Georgia will send in 10,000 peacekeepers, with the entire contingent of artillery, tanks and GRAD rocker launchers. They'll make sure no one starts the fighting - err comes out alive - again.