Weapon Ban Author chosen as Obama VP

reply to post by TheHunted


You think that keeping American jobs on our soil is important. You think that driving down oil prices is as well. No fight with that, both important and valid concerns, which I agree with you on. These are important, to you, what have you done about it? Have you run for office? Lobbied members of Congress? Have you even made a phone call or sent an email to anyone expressing your concerns?

Owning a firearm is a right, afforded us in the US Constitution. Keeping jobs here, cheap energy? Dont see that anywhere in there. Could make the arguement that it is a matter of national security, but that could be tough. Our "leaders" are sworn to uphold that document we all hold so dear, not to pick and choose which portions of it they happen to agreewith.

I exercise my right to own a firearm, and I will defend that, as the rest of the Constituition for my entire life. No one will take my gun, my freedom of speech, my right to assemble.

As for the gas prices and keeping jobs here? I have boycotted, and encourage others to stay away from any company that sends US jobs overseas, sometimes this is impossible, but gotta start somewhere. Also, I purchased stock in major oil companies so I have voting rights, then donate all of my earnings from them to charity as to not profit from the abuse of their monopolies. Talking about fixing problems is one thing, its another to actually try to fix them.

Owning guns isnt about priorities as a people or a nation, it is about our basic rights and freedoms.

reply to post by salchanra


I will say this I practice what I preach..

All I here is a threat of civil war if firearms are banned. I do understand why gun owners would be upset, we have rights and we will protect those rights. Why aren't these very people as passionate about other American related problems? They are quiet and keep to themselves until they hear the words Gun Control. If you are going to be vocal about that why not other things that are affecting us?

Originally posted by TheHunted
reply to post by salchanra

 

I will say this I practice what I preach..

All I here is a threat of civil war if firearms are banned. I do understand why gun owners would be upset, we have rights and we will protect those rights. Why aren't these very people as passionate about other American related problems? They are quiet and keep to themselves until they hear the words Gun Control. If you are going to be vocal about that why not other things that are affecting us?

I think I will answer my own question. Americans only care about what directly affects them as individuals.

reply to post by TheHunted


Yes, you are correct. Americans, and I would guess humans in general only rise up when something directly affects them for the most part. For instance look at what Congress tried to do with taxes after the bridge collapse in Minnesota. Raise taxes, redo the infrastructure of our nation. Very reactionary. How many people wanted to address this concern 3 years prior? Thats the trouble with the world, no one has any vision anymore, we just react, usually badly, when something happens and not look down the road.

I think IMO this is why the OP alerted us to Biden being chosen as a VP candidate. The OP has also started a popular thread about Obama and banning semi-autos. The issue for me isnt so much that they want to take my guns, its about taking my freedom. If Obama/Biden had said they wanted to tweak the 1st ammendment and had a record of surpressing free speach, I would have the same disdain for them as their attacks of the 2nd. Any politician who tries to usurp our rights and freedoms will feel the wrath of our nation. Be in the 1st or the 2nd, most people dont understand that most of the others have been trounced allready, especially the 10th.

Biden wants to ban guns, as does Obama, hence the point of this thread, they are attacking the basic rights that have made this country great. No matter what your feelings on guns are, you need to ask yourself, where will they stop? What would be next? The "fairness" doctrine, quartering of troops in our homes, the abolishment of any religious symbol? Sure those are extreme cases, but once we lose one right, there is no telling where it will end.

I wont advise anyone on ATS how to vote this November, but I certainly will be voting for the individual who poses the least amount of risk to my fundamental rights afforded me by God and by the US Constitution.

Originally posted by salchanra
reply to post by TheHunted

 

Yes, you are correct. Americans, and I would guess humans in general only rise up when something directly affects them for the most part. For instance look at what Congress tried to do with taxes after the bridge collapse in Minnesota. Raise taxes, redo the infrastructure of our nation. Very reactionary. How many people wanted to address this concern 3 years prior? Thats the trouble with the world, no one has any vision anymore, we just react, usually badly, when something happens and not look down the road.

I think IMO this is why the OP alerted us to Biden being chosen as a VP candidate. The OP has also started a popular thread about Obama and banning semi-autos. The issue for me isnt so much that they want to take my guns, its about taking my freedom. If Obama/Biden had said they wanted to tweak the 1st ammendment and had a record of surpressing free speach, I would have the same disdain for them as their attacks of the 2nd. Any politician who tries to usurp our rights and freedoms will feel the wrath of our nation. Be in the 1st or the 2nd, most people dont understand that most of the others have been trounced allready, especially the 10th.

Biden wants to ban guns, as does Obama, hence the point of this thread, they are attacking the basic rights that have made this country great. No matter what your feelings on guns are, you need to ask yourself, where will they stop? What would be next? The "fairness" doctrine, quartering of troops in our homes, the abolishment of any religious symbol? Sure those are extreme cases, but once we lose one right, there is no telling where it will end.

I wont advise anyone on ATS how to vote this November, but I certainly will be voting for the individual who poses the least amount of risk to my fundamental rights afforded me by God and by the US Constitution.

I respect firearm owners, and just like any American I have a fear of losing my rights. Thanks for the heads up OP. Good Luck we all need it...

reply to post by iamcamouflage


Yes, and law enforcement officers should be better "licensed" and regulated. The cursory psychological testing they get in police "academy" is a joke. Our Forensic Psychiatry clinic sees at least three cops a month who are caught in crimes and/or abusing their "power" and suspected of being psychiatrically impaired. There are many more out there, and more coming back from the Sandbox daily, who are not fit to be dog catcher but are given a gun and badge by some moron police personnel unit.
WARDOC, Desert Storm VEt and MD

AS we read all the different incoming reports about concentration camps in the USA, and now ,anti-gun politicans who feel they know what is best for American's, and the 2nd Amendment is to be ignored,overruled by the these same elitist's, WHO WANT A POLICE STATE RUN by the Oligarchy elite's who'll control every aspect of our lives from conception to death!
It is obvious, that the democrats have an agenda, and that is to completely take the nation into fascism-socialism, and end every right you and I have.
The Obama campaign is an incidious and evil ploy, to get the young,eager,stupid, and educated yet totally un-wise, voting populace to support his calls for "CHANGE" on a platform not spelled out, or made known. His whole campaign is a Barnum and Bailey SHOW of SHOWS, with Ring Master, Dr. Feel Goods ( Obama) magical mystery tour thrown in to boot! There is not one iota of reality or truth in any of it. Yet, the modern and completely boobtube driven younger voters, fall for this media ordained "ROCK-SUPER STARS" deliveries of oratory make believe dreams and promises because he has the audacity!!!
This Guy, and now his VP pick, are" pigs in a poke " and anyone who thinks they are getting free bread and butter with jam given to them, if they elect this modern day Svengali, are going to be sorely disappointed...
We got about TWO MONTHS left, for America to wake up before it is too late...in those two months, the Obama-Biden show will pull out all the stops to seal the deal. Let the Democratic Razzle Dazzle Flim-Flam GRAN FINALE begin. It'll be one Hell-of-a-Show!

Originally posted by TheHunted
War on drugs-War in Iraq can you even compare two on money wasted, lives lost? Iraqi war is still costing nearly a billion dolars a month. So Republicans do not have a very good track record on wars. As long as they are in office we will remain and enter into nonsense wars. Why would that even matter? Just as long as we have our guns, we will have no matter what.

I'm fairly certain that a large contingent of Democrats supported the war efforts as well. In fact, it is a Democratically controlled Congress that continue to fund this debacle. In your haste to make this a purely partisan issue, you have failed to a.) stick to the topic of the thread and b.) acknowledge the fact that the 2-party system is a complete failure.

reply to post by kozmo


Thanks Kozmo.

I have been avoiding pushing the main topic flow. More so that the casual observer can detect who the derailers are and determine what is driving the derail.

1. ADD and ADHD.
2. Educationally challenged.
3. Paid disinformation.
4. Attempt at humor. (perfectly acceptable when in good taste)

I have yet to pull all of the Biden gun ban information and go though it.





[edit on 27-8-2008 by Illahee]

reply to post by Illahee


When you have it, will you be making it available here or a different thread?

reply to post by salchanra


S.2237...The Biden Crime Bill

I've only glanced over it, but it appears to be very similar to (if not the same as) the original AWB. One thing I will say: it is significantly less restrictive regarding the individual weapons banned than would be HR 1022.

There's a grandfather clause in it (EDIT: it appears that this has also been added into 1022), so existing weapons or magazines would NOT be subject to the ban. That's one small positive, but I have little doubt that by the time it was crammed through Congress, this provision would likely be gone and more weapons would be added. In other words, we'd probably end up with something closer to HR 1022.

That's not to say that this isn't a bad bill. It is. Its just not quite the absolute disaster that 1022 would be. But it is bad enough.



[edit on 27-8-2008 by vor78]

Originally posted by vor78
[I've only glanced over it, but it appears to be very similar to (if not the same as) the original AWB. One thing I will say: it is significantly less restrictive regarding the individual weapons banned than would be HR 1022.

I loved 1022! Did you see when she decided to add the ban on hi-cap magazines?

16 April. Anyone remember what was going on at that time? Virginia Tech shooting.

A friend checked and found out that Congress closed for business that day at 1400. That means she was pushing for her ban while they were still bagging and tagging the dead.

Nothing like striking when the iron is hot, huh?

reply to post by jerico65


Speaking of Carolyn McCarthy, I'm sure you'll love this:

What's a barrel shroud?

Unbelievable. She thinks it should be banned, but doesn't know what the hell it is. I wish I could say that its surprising, however. It seems that gun ban advocates in DC are one of the most badly misinformed groups of lobbyists out there.

Let me ask a question to the anti-obama-policy people in here

1.) IF you are not criminals - then why does his policies bother you?
2.)Why do you omit the fact that he's trying to take guns from CRIMINALS? Is it to further spread your ignorant agenda?
3.)Did you sleep through American Constitution class? Do you not realize that it takes the Senate, the President, and Congress (the VP has nothing to do with it) in order to pass a law that would federally ban certain types of weapons?


now a statement

no matter what happens

if "hand guns" are banned without a special permit - you are not losing your "Right" to a firearm

You still have a right to own a firearm.

So my last question:


4.) Is it possible for you to evaluate and discuss the facts? And leave the talking points from lame and ignorant men like Rush Limbaugh at the door?

Originally posted by Andrew E. Wiggin
Let me ask a question to the anti-obama-policy people in here

1.) IF you are not criminals - then why does his policies bother you?
2.)Why do you omit the fact that he's trying to take guns from CRIMINALS? Is it to further spread your ignorant agenda?
3.)Did you sleep through American Constitution class? Do you not realize that it takes the Senate, the President, and Congress (the VP has nothing to do with it) in order to pass a law that would federally ban certain types of weapons?


now a statement

no matter what happens

if "hand guns" are banned without a special permit - you are not losing your "Right" to a firearm

You still have a right to own a firearm.

So my last question:


4.) Is it possible for you to evaluate and discuss the facts? And leave the talking points from lame and ignorant men like Rush Limbaugh at the door?

Andrew, do you think some gangbanger is going to be stopped by all of this? Nope, a criminal will still be able to get a weapon of any kind, and Joe Schmoe will be restricted from owning one. That's what no one wants to see, and Biden and Obama are all for gun control.

You can still one one, providing it doesn't have a hi-cap magazine, a barrel shroud, bayonet lug, a pistol grip, attachment points, over a certain caliber, etc, etc, etc. So many restrictions on what you can have, you might as well go down to the quarry and buy a freakin' rock. But, hey, according to the law, you can still have one! Dude, she didn't even know what a freakin' barrel shroud was, but she wanted to ban it!!!!!

Yep, it takes a lot to get a ban passed, but they did it before. Now the new one will be even more restrictive. And permanent.

[edit on 28-8-2008 by jerico65]

Double post please remove.

[edit on 28-8-2008 by Illahee]

Originally posted by vor78
reply to post by jerico65

 

Speaking of Carolyn McCarthy, I'm sure you'll love this:

What's a barrel shroud?

Unbelievable. She thinks it should be banned, but doesn't know what the hell it is. I wish I could say that its surprising, however. It seems that gun ban advocates in DC are one of the most badly misinformed groups of lobbyists out there.

Whats a barrel shroud? LMAO What an idiot. Gee lets ban all chile peppers because they might get used for pepper spray. What a dolt.

Originally posted by Andrew E. Wiggin
Let me ask a question to the anti-obama-policy people in here

1.) IF you are not criminals - then why does his policies bother you?
2.)Why do you omit the fact that he's trying to take guns from CRIMINALS? Is it to further spread your ignorant agenda?
3.)Did you sleep through American Constitution class? Do you not realize that it takes the Senate, the President, and Congress (the VP has nothing to do with it) in order to pass a law that would federally ban certain types of weapons?


now a statement

no matter what happens

if "hand guns" are banned without a special permit - you are not losing your "Right" to a firearm

You still have a right to own a firearm.

So my last question:


4.) Is it possible for you to evaluate and discuss the facts? And leave the talking points from lame and ignorant men like Rush Limbaugh at the door?

Actually I'm wondering if you slept through an American Contitution class. The 2nd ammendment states, That the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, and the last time I checked a ban of any sort is an infringement.

reply to post by Vykarian


Well said. I guess in some cases, less is more.

Mr. Wiggins,

When you force on the citizenry a special permit system and registration..only those with 'Special" access to the elite end up with the permits. If you don't believe me, talk to someone from your home town and those of NYC and Los Angeles. If you aren't connected you will not recieve a permit, period!!

Zindo