American Jobs Lost , Thanks , McCain !!!, page


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reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 09:48 AM by vor78
reply to post by marg6043



Again, McCain may have some agenda in this. I'm not saying he doesn't, but simply that there's enough evidence of impropriety here that people went to prison over it (after admitting guilt, no less). An investigation was clearly warranted.

And yes, it would have created jobs. So would a great number of no-bid contracts that people rail against on this site all the time. Granted, this was not a no-bid contract, but the point is simply this: the ends do not necessarily justify the means. If the process of procuring the contract was corrupt, and it appears to have been, there's every reason for an investigation to occur.

[edit on 22-8-2008 by vor78]


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 09:58 AM by nyk537
reply to post by marg6043



Who are these people you're talking about?

Honestly, I don't know anyone who thinks McCain is a savior. McCain is the most flawed candidate of anyone we had in the primary. He has way too many liberal tendencies and cares too much about what people think.

He's no savior...not by a long shot; but he's sure better than Obama.


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 10:32 AM by jefwane
I've been following this story for a while. In my book it's a plus for McCain. You have a large American defense contractor who initially had the contrac, but it turns out they cheated. Bad enough to put a former Air Force officer and Boeing uppper executive in jail I believe it was thier CFO. Mc Cain leads a Congressional effort to force a competitive bid on the contract. Boeing loses the bid but runs crying to the GAO. The GAO finds that the "process" of the award was flawed and it is currently up for bid again. The tanker as awarded to the Northrop/EADS partnership was to be produced in that far away country of Mobile, Alabama.

After the GAO laid the smack down on the award, the Air Force re-opened the bid for the tanker. Just this morning
this news hit the wire.
Boeing Co. is considering bailing out of the politically-charged bidding for a $35 billion contract to build aerial refueling tankers for the Air Force, if it does not receive an additional four months by the Pentagon to put together a competitive offer.


I do have a bias in this let me be clear. I live in Alabama and would rather see the jobs come here than Washington. I would expect someone on the left coast to have the opposite opinion. It's a convoluted story no doubt and shows just how corrupt the Millitary Industrial Complex is.

What this story is not, is an indictment of McCain. It's not even a partisan issue. You have CONgress people from both parties in Washington spewing Boeing propaganda about foreign awards (though I'm sure Alabama may seem like a foreign country to them).

The sad part about this is that the Airforce still doesn't have a clear replacement for an aging tanker. Boeing has shown that if it cannot win in a bid (without corruption from inside the Air Force) it will do its best to stall delay and obstruct whoever does through courts and legal action to the detriment of the country.

If you want to use this whole convoluted mess as an attack on Mc Cain be my guest, I think this is one that could easily be turned to show a strength of character opposing a proven corrupt defense contractor.


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 11:34 AM by vor78
reply to post by marg6043



Its unfortunate that American workers may have to pay the price here, but as has been stated, there is significant evidence of wrongdoing in the procurement of this contract both on the part of Boeing and the Air Force. They're the ones ultimately at fault here.

Truth be told, I'd much rather that Boeing wins the contract (and they have another chance). But at the same time, I'm not going to support or condone the apparently corrupt process that got them the original contract. I definitely don't believe it to be something that should be rewarded with a $35 billion contract with no questions asked.


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 11:53 AM by marg6043
The real scandal here is the one that McCain deal was going to rub American workers from jobs in our nation.

Yes I am aware of the so call McCain best achievement exposing the corruption of Boing and the Military officials.

I was one of those that applauded McCain for this but that was before the real deal was exposed.

But is that an excuse to the real deal of corruption that McCain already was planning the take over of the tanker deal by the DEAS?

two tough letters McCain wrote to Deputy Secretary of Defense Gordon England in 2006 and another to Robert Gates, just prior to his confirmation as Defense secretary. In the first letter, dated Sept. 8, 2006, McCain wrote of hearing from "third parties" that the Air Force was about to redo the tanker competition by factoring in European government subsidies to EADS—a condition that could have seriously hurt the EADS bid. McCain urged that the Pentagon drop the subsidy factor and posed a series of technical questions about the Air Force's process


So is ok to get the glory for exposing corruption while already planning for the outsourcing of American jobs in favor of money?

"He was trying to jam us and bully us to make sure there was competition by giving EADS an advantage," said one senior Pentagon official, who asked for anonymity when discussing a politically sensitive matter. The assumption within the Pentagon, the official added, was that McCain's letters were drafted by EADS lobbyists. "There was no one else that would have had that level of detail," the official said. (A Loeffler associate noted that he and Nelson were retained by EADS after the letters were drafted.)


www.newsweek.com...

While McCain said that this was for the best interest of the air force he forgot to add that he got money out of deal for campaign.

Now how can this help Americas workers?

Since when McCain is of French nationality that is putting the French interest over Americas one.

Why should I vote for somebody that is going to look after foreign interest over American interest because it has a money sign for personal agendas attach to it.


[edit on 22-8-2008 by marg6043]



reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 11:56 AM by jefwane
reply to post by marg6043



Marg not once have I saw you acknowledge that it was a EADS-Northrop-Grumand partnership that would also have put many Americans to work assembling the plane in Mobile, Alabama. Last I heard Mobile was not a part of France and Northrop-Grumand is an American company.

[edit on 22-8-2008 by jefwane]


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 12:33 PM by marg6043
How the Airbus deal got concoted?

Well if you have links to powerful people in congress including a possible cadidate for president hurting for campaign money there goes the best bid.

While Sen. John McCain and Sen. Barack Obama spar over each other's ties to special interests, McCain was getting deep into the lure of lobbyist wanting he Air Force deal to go to Airbus.

A campaign add was launched In the way of avertisments to make the American public aware of what it was going on with McCain and Airbus.

"Seven of McCain’s staff and fundraisers lobbied for Airbus," 1. the ad says. "And guess what? John McCain intervened, which helped Airbus get that Pentagon contract.


That doesn’t look good for a presidential possible candidate even, McCain was warned about this but did nothing about it. Money was needed. for campaign.

The group is also asking the Federal Election Commission to investigate two other public reports that touch on McCain's connections to lobbyists: That a lobbying company, the Loeffler Group LLP, made payments this year to McCain's national finance director, Susan Nelson; and that a company controlled in part by campaign manager Rick Davis 1. sliced more than $100,000 off of McCain campaign's tab, when the campaign was starved for cash last year.


blogs.abcnews.com...

A Well-Connected Campaign Firm Resurfaces
The trail of campaign money corruption doesn’t end it gets bigger and bigger.

When Republican Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign hit the financial skids last summer, he reported that he owed one of his largest vendors $1,079,000.

The debt was owed to a computer company, called 3eDC. The firm has close ties to McCain campaign manager Rick Davis and his lobbying partner Paul Manafort.


blog.washingtonpost.com...

I guess the more money you own to your supporters the more favors you have to give away.

All this is conected to Airbus.


reply posted on 22-8-2008 @ 12:37 PM by marg6043
reply to post by jefwane



You know what you are right Boeing got caught with their pants down along with the military officials.

But the guilty got to jail and served time. I guess we most thank McCain for that.

But what I don't see is why we the American citizens have to pay for the mistakes of the people that have power over us.

Still it doesn't justify the lost of American jobs with a deal to a foreign country when our nation is suffering right now one of the worst time in economical history.

We need every single job we can hold unto.

And that is just my personal view of the situation.
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