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Christians: If we created AI, would they need to be saved?

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posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 12:45 PM
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Originally posted by asmeone2
Let's get hypothetical.

If we created artificial intellegence (whether intentionally or not) would it be subject to the same rules of salvation?

Could 'original sin' be eradicated from the programming?

If we programed these machines to pray, woudl God listen?

AI couldn't be "saved: because it is not created in the image of God (as man was) and therefore that image cannot be restored. Thus, salvation (in a Christian sense) is a meaningless concept in this context.

If we programmed machines to pray, it would be meaningless, since prayer is a connection between man, created in the image of God, and God, the creator.

In a Biblical sense, sin would only exist for a machine if there were a law for machines given by their creators, since without law there is no sin. But just as God is responsible for His creation, men would be responsible for their creation as well.




posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 12:48 PM
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Originally posted by quaple_pouge
2nd: only true humans are under "original sin", ie: decendants of Adam and Eve. The "seed of man (sperm)" is needed. Just as a side note, this is also why Jesus was the only perfect human. He did not have the "seed of man", Mary concieved Him through the power of the Holy Spirit.

This is a Western (i.e. Roman Catholic) view of sin. It is not universally Christian, nor is it shared by an enormous portion of Christians through the ages, nor the Apostles themselves.

It finds its source in Augustine of Hippo (and I have heard Greek philosophy, although I have not confirmed this), was developed by Anselm of Canturbury, and was used by the Reformers to invent the first theology of Protestantism. This "original sin" is virtually unknown in Early Christianity, or Judaism for that matter. It is a tradition of men.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 12:54 PM
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Originally posted by asmeone2
We don't count the soul and intellegence of a baby who is conceived by artificial insemination to be inferior.


Artificial insemination is only artificial in the sense that the "seed" is artificially inserted into the female (or device that simulates a female for gestation). It is still human life as God designed it "in His image."

The more pertinent question relates to so-called "artifical" life creations, i.e. the Frankenstein experimentation with fertilizing animals with human sperm, inserting human DNA into mice, or the research in which a lesbian couple has one of the female's DNA inserted into an egg of the other to make offspring. These are more fuzzy areas, no?



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 12:59 PM
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Originally posted by red 5
reply to post by quaple_pouge
 


So again I ask what about a cloned human?


It is still life as God created it "in his image." This even happens naturally as identical twins, no?

I suppose examples where man builds a new form of life from God's creation, as a child does with lego blocks. In these instances, there are difficult questions to ponder, and it is somewhat frightening to ponder. In those instances, the very act of creation becomes sinful, but how does this reflect on that which is created? I suppose in that context the response would be "I don't know."



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 01:04 PM
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Originally posted by red 5
Why more slippery than AI? still a sentient being on this planet, and self aware. For sure it would be afraid of deah as you are.


Self-awareness does not define the image of God. The AI will be unholy, even if it were self-aware. This is an example where any one individual would not be qualified to make a judgment. God himself must give guidance on this matter.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 04:13 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


Interesting question. People worship God because they believe they were created by God, however with a intelligence created by humans this relationship cannot be considered the same. Maybe it would be the robots that worship humans if they could understand spirituality in the same way that we do.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 04:40 PM
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reply to post by ScienceDada
 


wow Science dadda you have answered so many questions as if you ere asked thm, I think you must be god.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 04:46 PM
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Originally posted by ScienceDada

Originally posted by red 5
reply to post by quaple_pouge
 


So again I ask what about a cloned human?


It is still life as God created it "in his image." This even happens naturally as identical twins, no?

I suppose examples where man builds a new form of life from God's creation, as a child does with lego blocks. In these instances, there are difficult questions to ponder, and it is somewhat frightening to ponder. In those instances, the very act of creation becomes sinful, but how does this reflect on that which is created? I suppose in that context the response would be "I don't know."



And so i am asking you in your own words. If man creates a sentient human like creature, with a brain that can think like you (only smarter) why is it not man building life from Oz's creation? Sort of like a child using Lego blocks.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 06:52 PM
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Originally posted by red 5
And so i am asking you in your own words. If man creates a sentient human like creature, with a brain that can think like you (only smarter) why is it not man building life from Oz's creation? Sort of like a child using Lego blocks.


If it happens, it will be interesting. But simulated intelligence or an artificial being would still be missing something. As this is a thread specifically addressing Christians, then it is well within context to quote the Christian scriptures, Oz or not.

I suppose one could interpret the Apocalypse of John. Chapter 13 speaks of this happening: And [the beast] had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.

Christians actually expect that AI could fulfill this expectations, and this is well within the precedent that the Church has interpreted the scriptures. John foretells that it will deceive many, and that those who do not comply with the demands of the beast, including taking the mark on the right arm/hand or forehead will not be able to buy and sell. Thus, we will be persecuted and (presumably) starved to death.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 09:54 PM
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reply to post by ScienceDada
 


WHEN it happens, I hope for you (not pray) that you receive better consideration than you have given to this thought. We are not the most powerful thing in the universe and we do not know what Oz will think of AI. How can you presume to guess what your god will think? I hope that the God of the robots is kinder than the imagined god of the holy christians.



posted on Aug, 22 2008 @ 10:21 PM
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Would they have a conscience? Are they capable of having one or are they like the Stepford Wives? This to me would be the deciding factor.



posted on Aug, 23 2008 @ 02:10 PM
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reply to post by asmeone2
 


i think the word "artificial" sums it up.

david



posted on Aug, 23 2008 @ 03:09 PM
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If it had true intelligence and self awareness, then yes it should be 'saved' by it's creator. Unless it was a real prig, then give it a fat nagging wife with a limitless credit card and let it suffer for eternity like the rest of us.



posted on Aug, 23 2008 @ 05:30 PM
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Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe
If it had true intelligence and self awareness, then yes it should be 'saved' by it's creator. Unless it was a real prig, then give it a fat nagging wife with a limitless credit card and let it suffer for eternity like the rest of us.


Now THAT is funny



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 12:06 PM
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Originally posted by asmeone2
Let's get hypothetical.

If we created artificial intellegence (whether intentionally or not) would it be subject to the same rules of salvation?

Could 'original sin' be eradicated from the programming?

If we programed these machines to pray, woudl God listen?

Imagien a supercomputer dedicated to nothing but prayer... would this influence world events?


We couldn't create an eternal soul. That is what needs "saving", not the flesh. The flesh turns to dust when we die.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 12:09 PM
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reply to post by ScienceDada
 

No, not 'starved to death', the scriptures say that those who refuse the mark will be beheaded. With no food we could still sustain life like John the Baptist did in the wilderness.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 12:20 PM
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Ok so this is just my opinion of course lol ..


But my answer would be no ....and the reason why is just like many have stated in this post they are not created by God they are from man who is trying to create as God did (which they will never be able to do that anyway) in fact my personal opinion is an AI and even a clone would be considered just a host of which demonic spirits and or (fallen angels) can dwell and live among mankind in a somewhat human form ............

I do not believe that souls can be transferred through dna .....so even clones do not have a soul (Well at least not the souls of real humans) ....souls of demonic spirits yes /



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 08:47 PM
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The answer is no. I have done a great deal of working trying to create AI and I came to the ultimate conclusion that actual intelligence does not exist. You can not put a real consciousness of free will into a computer program, no matter how much you try. AI as artificial means it only appears to be intelligent, but it is actually just following a pre-determined program. These programs can be complex, but they are actual intelligence/consciousness.

As there is no consciousness/soul there is nothing to be saved. The AI is essentially adam and eve before the apple.



posted on Aug, 24 2008 @ 08:53 PM
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You know I stumbled on some sites one time ..by accident ....that were scientists message boards and they were working on and discussing adult cloning and they were discussing the fact that they cannot figure out how to create a soul for them ...........
I believe spirit is in them (which is seperate from soul if you ask me ) ...which is what gets passed in the dna that was used to make the clones ....spirit is a life giving force and it is in everything ..so man hasnt really created clones ..they just copied something that was already created ...but it lacks one thing to be an actual human and that would be ..a soul ....................



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