It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Choking dog officer receives death threats

page: 9
9
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 09:55 AM
link   

Originally posted by Sonya610
I do not project human qualities on my pets, I also don't project them on other people! My impressions are based on the individual actions of each. You do not know what you are talking about. It strikes me as a bit creepy when animal lovers speak of their companions as their “kids”, or refer to themselves as the Mom or Dad to their animals. They are not kids, they are adults, they are fully functioning members of another species. They may see us as caretakers, servants, pack leaders, or great companions, but the only ones that would view a human as a “parental” figure would be those that were raised and bottle fed by surrogate human parents from birth.
You don't project human-like qualities on your animals, but you'd let a child die rather than your dog? I don't understand you reasoning process here Sonya...


Over the years I have had many animals, virtually ALL rescues. Some I was very close to, some obviously did not even like me that much. I have had a cat for 5 years, a kitten found starving in a park, and it was QUITE obvious that the cat didn’t have any use for me. The cat loved the dogs, greeted them and showered affection on them, but despite the fact I fed him it took him 3 years before he could be bothered to greet me with the same happy meows that he lavished on the canines. He has been with me for five years now, I would not dump him for any reason, he has actually become much nicer to me over the years.

I have also had dogs that were obviously far more attached to another dog rather than to me, I have no doubt given the choice they would have chosen their canine buddy over me in a heartbeat. So you don’t have any clue about the social or emotional dynamics that go on between humans and companion animals, and when you say people like animals because it is “unconditional” love you prove you know nothing.

So if these animals exhibit so little affection or regard for you, what's the emotional or psychological payoff for you? I'll bet if you helped out a few people in need, you'd feel just as good about yourself, and they'd probably even express a little gratitude for your efforts.


Okay so animal lovers not only have a wide range of mental problems, but now they also have poor social skills? Wow. I happen to make my living in large part via social skills, I am in sales. Sheesh thanks for pointing out my lack of social skills Dr. Lloyd, I will look into it.
I didn't say all animal lovers, only those who take their love for animals to the extreme. Maybe you do earn your living based on your social skills, but I bet you don't voice your extreme opinions about animals when interacting with other people..



Inappropriate PHYSICAL relations? What are you implying???? If you are implying what I think that went WAY WAY TOO FAR! Or perhaps all close attachments can lead to “inappropriate physical relationships” is that what you are saying? Because if that is what you are saying that extremely ugly implication can be turned right around on you.
[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]
I'm not implying anything, I was just stating an observation. Why are you getting so upset? Haven't you ever seen people act inappropriately with their pets like kissing them on the mouth, etc?




posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 10:12 AM
link   

Originally posted by chise61
LOL you said that as if it were an admirable trait
It's not one of our most admirable qualities, but it's a quality no animal is capable of imitating due to mental limitations.


And yes dogs are thinking, feeling beings, they have emotions just like we do. They feel love, fear, sadness, happiness, they mourn the loss of a loved one. They ARE self aware, and yes they DO dream, my dogs dream all the time.
I'm sorry but I disagree with you on this point. animals are not sentient or self-aware. They have feelings like fear and pain, but they don't grieve, love, or or feel sadness.


I think dogs carry out acts of kindness all the time. There are plenty of cases of dogs keeping lost children alive by providing body heat, etc.
There's more cases of them maiming or killing children rather than saving their lives. Just do a Google of Dog attacks and see for yourself.


As far as what people were taught in church, i remember being taught that when God flooded the earth he made sure that Noah saved the animals, must've been a reason for that. Maybe he thought that they were more worthy than we were.
Maybe he realize that humankind would need them for sustenance and to perform labor they were incapable of doing..

[edit on 26-8-2008 by LLoyd45]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 10:46 AM
link   
reply to post by shuck
 


"Animals do not constantly help us in any meaningful way nor provide for us the things we need to continue living. "

Well then lets hope that you never go blind and need a seeing eye dog to help you "continue living"
Lets hope you are never paralyzed and need a service dog to help you "continue living"
Lets hope you are never trapped and need a rescue dog to find you and help you "continue living"
Lets hope you are never in need of a bomb sniffing dog to help you "continue living"
Lets hope you never need a cancer sniffing dog to find your cancer so that you can "continue living"
Lets hope your house never catches on fire because you don't have a dog to awaken you so you can "continue living"
Lets hope that a dog never needs to find drugs so as to help you and your family "continue living"
Dogs are here to help us "continue living"

[edit on 26-8-2008 by sickofitall2012]

[edit on 26-8-2008 by sickofitall2012]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 11:32 AM
link   

Originally posted by LLoyd45
Maybe you do earn your living based on your social skills, but I bet you don't voice your extreme opinions about animals when interacting with other people..


True, and very few people would have the NERVE to say many of the things that were expressed in this thread to my face in a normal social or business situation. But believe me, if someone dared say some of these things to my face I would most certainly throw back some VERY harsh opinions.

As a matter of fact I left my last job because the owner killed a small helpless animal ( harmless snake, I happen to have a snake and I do not like to see ANY animal killed sadistically for fun) in the parking lot, and he had the nerve to ASK ME if I had a problem with it later. I quit and I told him that was WHY I quit, I also told my present employer WHY I quit during the hiring process, and I clearly expressed my disgust with the human being that committed such an atrocious act. Granted these companies are in the same industry and they knew me, if I had been a stranger and confessed something like that in an interview that would probably have been a different story.

And yes I am sure people at my current company, and people at my past company probably thought I overreacted and thought I was a bit nuts, and I DO NOT CARE. You can be sure NONE of them would have the nerve to challenge my views on the topic, for most part they just got very quiet.


Originally posted by LLoyd45 Haven't you ever seen people act inappropriately with their pets like kissing them on the mouth, etc?


I could care less if people kiss their dogs on the mouth. Neither me or my dogs are into that, however what other people do is their own business.

I do know enough about epidemiology to realize there are very few diseases or parasites transmitted between canines and humans. Humans on the other hand are a MUCH higher disease risk, colds, flu’s, Heptatis A, to name a few are all easily transmitted between humans during casual contact. Anyone that has worked in an office knows that the amount of colds and flu’s circulating in the office varies dramatically based on whether or not the employees have small children in daycare, yet I would not presume to tell people they should not kiss their small children because by doing so they in fact pose a direct disease risk to me when I work around them.

Well actually it did come up once, some ignorant person commented that having a dog in the office was “dirty” and I quickly pointed out that employees bringing their small children with runny noses in was fact FAR worse. They didn’t seem to like hearing that too much. LOL



[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 11:53 AM
link   
reply to post by burdman30ott6
 


Pretty sure teacup poodles still belong to the canine species. Just because they're not your "cup of tea"
doesn't make them any less a dog.

What type of dog do you deem fit to live? And upon what do you base your conclusions? What exact type of dog is not deserving of a size 16 lug boot imprint (or whatever you said) in it's back, from your limited perspective?

Point is, it's subjective. Humans have had a relationship with domesticated dogs going back thousands upon thousands of years. Dogs, regardless of size and demeanor are still dogs. And, people will always love their dogs as family. The officer was wrong, and highly insensitive, at best. I wouldn't trust someone like that to protect me! And, suppose the officer doesn't like children. Would that make it ok for him to say "Oh, it's just a child. You can always have another one."

By the way, animal abuse and psychopathic behavior is strongly linked.



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 11:55 AM
link   

Originally posted by Sonya610
True, and very few people would have the NERVE to say many of the things that were expressed in this thread to my face in a normal social or business situation. But believe me, if someone dared say some of these things to my face I would most certainly throw back some VERY harsh opinions.
I'd put the subject right up there with discussing religion or politics. If you want to see a fight, discuss either in casual company. I prefer to avoid both topic if possible.


As a matter of fact I left my last job because the owner killed a small helpless animal ( harmless snake, I happen to have a snake and I do not like to see ANY animal killed sadistically for fun) in the parking lot, and he had the nerve to ASK ME if I had a problem with it later. I quit and I told him that was WHY I quit, I also told my present employer WHY I quit during the hiring process, and I clearly expressed my disgust with the human being that committed such an atrocious act. Granted these companies are in the same industry and they knew me, if I had been a stranger and confessed something like that in an interview that would probably have been a different story.
Taking a life just for the sake of doing so is wrong. Animals are entitled to good care, proper nutrition, and medical care just like people. A snake, unless it is a poisonous variety, is probably more beneficial to man than harmful in my opinion. They eat bugs, rodents, and a variety of other yard pests. I agree with your call on that situation. The guy was a jerk if he killed it just for sadistic purposes.


I could care less if people kiss their dogs on the mouth. Neither me or my dogs are into that, however what other people do is their own business.
I find the behavior disturbing, but as long as they stay away from me, I really don't care one way or another.


I do know enough about epidemiology to realize there are very few diseases or parasites transmitted between canines and humans. Humans on the other hand are a MUCH higher disease risk, colds, flu’s, Heptatis A, to name a few are all easily transmitted between humans during casual contact. Anyone that has worked in an office knows that the amount of colds and flu’s circulating in the office varies

you're right, humans do serve as hosts for a variety of maladies, and I try to limit my contact with them as well. Arms reach is about as close as anyone is allowed to get to me unless they're family. I'm not a touchy, feely type person, and I don't like being spit or sneezed on by strangers. There's simply too many disease going around today to take unnecessary chances.


Well actually it did come up once, some ignorant person commented that having a dog in the office was “dirty” and I quickly pointed out that employees bringing their small children in was FAR worse. They didn’t seem to like hearing that too much. LOL
[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]
I disagree with you there. If the dog has been properly treated for fleas and other parasites, it's cool with me to bring him in, but not everyone is that considerate. One place I worked in had to be totally fumigated because one of the workers brought her flea-ridden dog in for a visit. The lobby, our offices, and our persons were covered in fleas before the weak was over. Children might have lice (unlikely, but possible if they have poor hygiene), but I've never seen one transmit fleas to anyone. LOL



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 12:05 PM
link   
Anyone reasonable should realize that anyone or anything choking... human or animal... you are not going to have time to get it to the hospital. Do CPR.... yes there is a dog form of it too, I'm pretty sure most people could improvise without any training though.

Racing down the highway with a choking person/animal who isn't going to make it is endangering other drivers. In the case of a dog, yes, an entire car full of innocent people's lives is more important than a dog... that's what they're risking speeding down the highway at midnight.



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 01:14 PM
link   
Here's a great page on first Aid for your dog. It covers most basic emergencies like airway obstruction, cardiac arrest, bleeding, and bandaging.

With this knowledge committed to memory, you can avoid taking the risks that the dog owners discussed in this thread did, and who knows? you might even save your pets life in the process!
First Aid- Top 10 things to know for your Dog



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 05:19 PM
link   

Originally posted by LLoyd45
They have no sense of right or wrong, they feel no compassion for their fellow animals, and they're driven by millions of years of instinct, not reason.


They have no compassion? Ever watched a dog lovingly clean the surgery wounds of their fellow canine for hours until each bit of blood is gone?

Every had a cancer striken alpha dog get annoyed by a puppy that wanted to play, a puppy that took liberties because it could SENSE the older dog was weakening in subtle ways? Every watch that and see the alpha's oldest companion dog rush up to growl and chase the pup away, then sit and patiently lick the face of his ill alpha friend (when instinct could driven him to take the role of alpha for himself, they had certainly squabbled over the years) simply to calm his buddy down and sooth him?

Don't tell me they don't show compassion. Don't tell me they are incapable of bonding with humans and with eachother. You have seen very little. I have seen a lot.

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 05:53 PM
link   

Originally posted by Sonya610
Don't tell me they don't show compassion. Don't tell me they are incapable of bonding with humans and with eachother. You have seen very little. I have seen a lot.

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]
Whatever you say Sonya, I've grown tired of this discussion. We've somehow got side-tracked from the main topic of the thread which was two irresponsible idiots transporting a dead dog, to whether dogs are sentient or not..



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 05:58 PM
link   

Originally posted by Voxel

Actually that is patently not true. Real animals (pets are not real animals) will often do things that we, as humans, would consider pretty horrible.
  • Young eaglets will bite to death their siblings in times of less than adequate food.
  • Most birds will kick defective offspring out of the nest to die of exposure.
  • Fish will kill each other for territorial reasons and will often kill weaker fish for little or no reason.
  • Male lions will sometimes kill all the cubs of a pride he has taken over.
  • Ect..

None of these are the exception; rather, they are the rule. This is how animals live and die. From what I have seen of the natural world, it is immensely more violent than the human world.

Now ask yourself:
  • How often does a human get remarried after a divorce and have their children killed by their new lover?
  • How many times have the bullies at school killed a weaker kid?
  • How many parents just let their sick/deformed/retarded children die?
  • Even in countries where starvation is a problem, when was the last time a sibling killed another over food?


Humans and animals are wired remarkable similarly but humans can and do temper the instinct to kill with reason. Humans have the power to effect destruction on a level animals can not even come close to comprehending and, as a species, the numbers to do horrible things on such a scale that it would make WW2 look like a bad soccer riot. Yet we don't. Our human culture has given us a remarkable amount of constraint compared to even our closest relatives.
Jon




LOL ok first someone says that a teacup poodle is not really a dog and now you say that pets are not real animals
what are they if not real animals? Do you think wer'e talking about stuffed toys here



The things that you've listed here are indeed things that animals do, however they are acts of survival, not atrocities that they are carrying out against their own species. There is a big difference between animals killing off the weakest to keep the species alive and humans trying to wipe out a whole race because they think that particular race beneath them.

And have no doubts about it, if a human were placed in a situation where they had no choice but to leave one of their offspring behind to die they would in fact choose to leave behind the one that has the least chance of survival. Whether we like it or not it's an instinct that is deeply ingrained in ALL species, the strongest survive.


You must not watch the news very much, there are plenty of cases of children that are killed by a steparent/ boyfriend, girlfriend all the time. There are also cases of parents that lock there disabled, retarded children in closets & basements, starving and abusing them.


There was a time in human history that all these behaviours were carried out by humans as well as animals, and those humans also were rewarded with offspring and pack leader positions. The practice of humans banding together to punish those behaviours has not been present throughout our entire history, it is a response that we implememted slowly over the course of time.

I am well aware of the fact that the world of nature is not a "touchy- feelly happy world" but what animals do they do out of survival instincts, not greed, some warped sense of pleasure, or the arrogance of thinking that they are above other beings and therefore entitled to do as they wish.


If you truely believe that humans temper their instincts to kill with reason, then i would say that you are not very aware of current social events, or you are lucky enough to be living in some fairytale, lala land eutopia. I'm sorry but i don't believe that we have the kind of restraint that you seem to think that we do. We are still overrun with wars, genocide, famines, we destroy entire ecosystems to put up parking lots, tear down rainforests, we continuously tear apart this planet and each other, so really how much contraint do we really have.



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 06:32 PM
link   
reply to post by LLoyd45
 


Yes they are sentient, self aware, capable of feeling love, grief, happiness, sadness, and compassion. They are also capable of being altruistic. And what exactly makes a relationship with an animal innappropriate ?


I saw their grief when my alpha dog passed away of old age several years ago. I saw their compassion when my omega got an aggressive form of cancer a couple of months ago. They normally walked all over him as he was the omega but when he became ill they were very careful not to run past him up the stairs and would patiently wait until he was up, they treated him very differently when he became ill. I see his son still grieving over the loss of his father.

Perhaps you just can't allow yourself to see just exactly what animals are capable of because you feel it takes away from us as human beings, that is however sad, still your loss.


In the great majority of cases of children being maimed you can be sure that the fault lied with a human and not the dog.


Perhaps he realized that animals were not capable of the destruction that humans are, that they were in fact the greater creation.



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 07:15 PM
link   

Originally posted by chise61

Originally posted by Voxel
Now ask yourself:
  • How often does a human get remarried after a divorce and have their children killed by their new lover?
  • How many times have the bullies at school killed a weaker kid?
  • How many parents just let their sick/deformed/retarded children die?
  • Even in countries where starvation is a problem, when was the last time a sibling killed another over food?


You must not watch the news very much, there are plenty of cases of children that are killed by a steparent/ boyfriend, girlfriend all the time. There are also cases of parents that lock there disabled, retarded children in closets & basements, starving and abusing them.


I agree he must not have a clue about what goes on in the world. In this country we have laws, so that limits a lot of behavior, most child murders are committed by parents. And lots of kids in foster care were dumped because they were not normal.

Of all U.S. children under age 5 murdered from 1976-2005 --

    31% were killed by fathers
    29% were killed by mothers
    23% were killed by male acquaintances
    7% were killed by other relatives
    3% were killed by strangers


In third world countries babies are culled at birth for various reasons, because they are the wrong gender, or if they have deformities. Some countries try to combat the problem by putting up drop boxes where people can donate their unwanted infants. And in those places its VERY EASY, no one is going to bother looking into a dead infant, or small child. Hey the kid died, no questions asked.

Here is a nice quote: KOUANDE, 18 July 2005 (IRIN) - Unless a baby is born head first and face upwards, many communities in northern Benin believe the child is a witch or sorcerer. And tradition demands that the infant must be killed, sometimes by dashing its brains out against a tree trunk. In the eyes of the Baatonou, Boko and Peul people, a child whose birth and early development deviates in any way from the accepted norm is cursed and must be destroyed.

Now what about starvation? It is quite common in some third world countries for fathers to eat first, then women and children. Sometimes the animals eat before the children, which accounts for many of the “starving baby” ads that flood TV (course they don't talk about that little fact when they try to get donations).

Human females are also suspectible to post partum psychosis, which can lead them to kill their own offspring. That is also far more common in countries without a lot of education and very little law enforcement.

But wait, humans are still much better than animals right? Because humans are all self-aware and they THINK about these things before they do them. Yuppers.


[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 07:18 PM
link   

Originally posted by chise61

Yes they are sentient, self aware, capable of feeling love, grief, happiness, sadness, and compassion. They are also capable of being altruistic.
Can you please provide me with a credible link to any research that states that these are indeed facts?


And what exactly makes a relationship with an animal innappropriate ?
The relationship becomes inappropriate when you start relating to an animal emotionally, psychologically, etc. as if it were another person.



I saw their grief when my alpha dog passed away of old age several years ago. I saw their compassion when my omega got an aggressive form of cancer a couple of months ago. They normally walked all over him as he was the omega but when he became ill they were very careful not to run past him up the stairs and would patiently wait until he was up, they treated him very differently when he became ill. I see his son still grieving over the loss of his father.

please listen to what you're saying.. You keep speaking in terms of alpha males, pack leaders, omega males, and dogs having fathers and sons. Dogs have sires and pups. you're a person, and a member of a society, and not a pack.


Perhaps you just can't allow yourself to see just exactly what animals are capable of because you feel it takes away from us as human beings, that is however sad, still your loss.
I'm just being realistic Chise, and you should do the same.


In the great majority of cases of children being maimed you can be sure that the fault lied with a human and not the dog.
In over 90% of the attacks there was no provocation involved. It was simply a matter of the dog trying to assert it's dominance over a smaller animal.


Perhaps he realized that animals were not capable of the destruction that humans are, that they were in fact the greater creation.
In that case, show me where in the Bible it says "dog was created in God's image".. Animals are put on this earth for food, and to toil as their human masters see fit.



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 07:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by LLoyd45In over 90% of the attacks there was no provocation involved. It was simply a matter of the dog trying to assert it's dominance over a smaller animal.


Dogs vs. people huh?

In 2007 32 people were killed by dogs.
In 2007 16,425 people were killed by people.

Estimates say there are approximately 72,000,000 dogs while there are about 300,000,000 people in the U.S.

Do the math. If you are still worried about the dangers of Fido your math skills must not be very good.

So tell me, would murder be easier to deal with if the killer was self-aware? Something to ponder.

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 08:03 PM
link   
Here's a few facts regarding dog attacks if you're interested. It's one thing to love dogs, but it a totally different ball game when you dismiss factual information offhand.



Each year approximately 4 million Americans are bitten by dogs, and about 800,000 of these persons (44 percent of whom are younger than 14 years) present for medical treatment. More than one dozen fatalities related to dog bites occur each year in this country; most of these victims are children. Although most dog bite attacks are not provoked, there are several measures that adults and children can take to decrease the possibility of being bitten. Family physicians can educate parents and children on ways to prevent dog bites, but, when dog bites do occur, the physician must be knowledgeable about how to treat the bites effectively.
More than one dozen fatalities related to dog bites occur each year in this country; most of these victims are children.

As of 1994, an estimated 34 million American households owned at least one dog, accounting for a canine population in the United States in excess of 55 million. Most dogs never bite a human; however, under certain circumstances, any dog is capable of inflicting harm. The most common victims of dog bites are children, especially in incidents that prove fatal. Almost one half of all reported cases of dog bites involve an animal owned by the victim's family or the victim's neighbors. Most victims are involved in normal, non provoking activities before the dog attacks. For example, neonatal deaths resulting from a dog bite most often involve a sleeping baby.

Several dog breeds have been identified for their role in fatal dog bite attacks, including pit bull breeds, malamutes, chows, Rottweilers, huskies, German shepherds and wolf hybrids. From 1979 to 1988, pit bull breeds accounted for more than 41 percent of dog bite ­related fatalities, three times as many as German shepherds.

Article



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 09:11 PM
link   

Originally posted by LLoyd45
Here's a few facts regarding dog attacks if you're interested. It's one thing to love dogs, but it a totally different ball game when you dismiss factual information offhand.


Well I have done a fair amount of dog rescue, mostly adult Dobermans but other breeds as well. I am guessing i have had 50 or 60 dogs living in my home at various times. Virtually all rescues, starved dogs off the street, dogs locked up and starved by their scum owners, some were physically abused, all sorts of stuff. Almost all plenty big enough to do some serious damage if they wanted to.

Do you know how many times I have been bitten? None. Not once.

But then again you know a lot more about dogs than I do Lloyd.

[edit on 26-8-2008 by Sonya610]



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 09:14 PM
link   
reply to post by Sonya610
 


Sorry try again, you’re not on target here.

First I am a trained first responder; I have had my own family emergencies and kept my cool very well. Went to the hospital without driving very fast over the speed limit and safely. Secondly my son is more valuable than my dog.

So first I would not be driving recklessly because it could kill me and my son if not others. Also as I mentioned I am trained in how to remove the object safely.

Oh and before you go getting all self righteous on me about your precious pet realize this. I value human life more than that of an animal (I believe I even hinted at this in my post). I care about animals and their suffering and have put them out of their misery many times. If your precious pet harmed my son in any way I would put a bullet between its eyes. Again humans > animals, in my view. If you do not agree I am sorry for you.

Raist



posted on Aug, 26 2008 @ 11:15 PM
link   
reply to post by LLoyd45
 


There's plenty of research out there about animal emotions and intelligence Lloyd all you gotta do is look for it.

Look up Martin Seligman's foundational experiments & the theory of Learned helplessness at the University of Pennssylvania in 1965. During this study the saw dogs show chronic symptoms of clinical depression.

Symptoms analogous to clinical depression, neurosis, & other psychological conditions have been in general acceptance as being within the scope of canine emotion for a good many years now.


Ok so i can relate to my dogs in an emotional way as long as i know that they are dogs and not another human and it will not be an innappropriate relationship right ?



I know what i'm saying, what's wrong with it ? I'm speaking about dogs in relation to how they live, they are pack animals, that is how their society functions. They have Alpha and Omegas that is their nature and what they need in their pack to survive.

I at the time had five dogs, so yes they were a pack and as such they had an alpha (btw the alpha was female, not male) and an omega, and of course to them i was the ultimate alpha (the pack leader if you will) as all humans must be to their dogs.

Maybe to breeders of papered dogs they are considered sires and pups, but to me mine were father and son. My son's dog was an extremely good father to his puppies, in fact more attentive to them than their mother was. I kept one of the puppies and he lived with his father for 11 years and yes when we had to put his FATHER down a couple months ago he did mourn him and become depressed.

LOL i really do know that i am a person and a member of society, what did you think i thought i was a dog LOL ? However to my dogs i am a member of their pack. I treat them as members of my family, and they treat me as a member of theirs, which is called a pack. You seem to be unaware of the fact that humans also have a pack mentality.




What am i being unrealistic because i believe that dogs have emotions like we do ? I believe that it is you that is being unrealistic in your beliefs that humans are the only animals that are capable of feeling love, joy, sorrow, anger, etc.



It matters not if the attacks were provoked or not, what i said is that in the majority of dog attacks the responsibility lies with a human.

I've been around dogs all my life, when i was about 6 i was petting my aunts dog and she told me to get away from the dog because it was too hot and she didn't want to be bothered and was going to bite me. My aunt walked away and i continued to pet the dog and she bit me in my face. Thankfully it wasn't bad, just a little nip, no scars or anything. Was it the dogs fault, no it wasn't. Was it my fault, in a way yes because i didn't listen to what i was told. Ultimately though it was my aunt's fault as she was the adult and proceeded to leave me unattended with a dog that she knew was capable of biting me.

If an animal is not properly trained and bites someone it is the owner's fault, not the animal's. If a child is left unattended with an animal and is attacked again it is the human's fault for leaving the child with the animal, not the animal's fault.

A simple thing like staring at a dog, or walking to near it's food, or pups can provoke an attack. Adults know this, children don't which is why they should NOT be left alone with animals.



Me saying that maybe he realized that his animals were a better creation than us does not imply that he created animals in his image, so you asking for me to point that passage out in the bible is not even a serious request and you know it.


As far as animals being food for us, read the beginning of Genisis. " I have given to you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the earth, and every tree in which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; TO YOU IT SHALL BE FOR MEAT (King james version). In the original hebrew text i believe it reads ......TO YOU IT SHALL BE FOR FOOD. So actually i believe he gave us the plants and trees for our source of food, not the animals.

If you choose to see yourself as a human "master" to animals then that's your right, but me, i am "master" to no one.


I am just a big lover of all animals and you and i will never see eye to eye on this subject, so we'll just have to agree to disagree on this subject. You keep thinking they're beneath you and you are their "master". I'll keep believing that i'm no better than they are, and that they are capable of the same emotions that i am, and i'll continue to rescue the strays off the streets and treat them as members of my family and we'll both be just fine.



posted on Aug, 27 2008 @ 07:12 AM
link   

Originally posted by chise61
I've been around dogs all my life, when i was about 6 i was petting my aunts dog and she told me to get away from the dog because it was too hot and she didn't want to be bothered and was going to bite me. My aunt walked away and i continued to pet the dog and she bit me in my face.


Yup, it is almost always small kids, and they frequently get bit in the face. That is why the Doberman rescue ladies would simply NEVER place Dobies with families that had kids under 12. Not even puppies. Maybe some other, softer breeds but never dobies. They are protection dogs, they have boundaries that need to be respected (especially the males), and if people don't understand that they should NOT own that type of dog.

Sure some of the dogs would have done fine with small kids, but kids are often too unpredictable and they are NOT disciplined, if there was a problem the dog would end up losing.

I have also heard of problems with female pits and small children, apparently sometimes the pit becomes so protective of her human pups she won't allow the parents or anyone else to yell or otherwise threaten the children in anyway. Of course the kids liked it, but the parents were less than thrilled.


[edit on 27-8-2008 by Sonya610]



new topics

top topics



 
9
<< 6  7  8    10  11 >>

log in

join