Hello.

This is a touchy topic, but the topic is "Russia's new nuclear challenge to Europe". Remember that?

We aren't here to discuss members political associations. Or their intelligence. Or anything else outside the topic.

Just a reminder...stay on target.

Originally posted by seagull
Hello.

This is a touchy topic, but the topic is "Russia's new nuclear challenge to Europe". Remember that?

We aren't here to discuss members political associations. Or their intelligence. Or anything else outside the topic.

Just a reminder...stay on target.

Thank you!

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Last Time!!!

This discussion WILL stay on topic.

Excuse me for that, but at least I learned there is an ignore button.

On Topic, A good thing to research is how long will it take for Russia to fully arm their fleet with nukes and are their vessels in any shape to actually deploy them? Their fleet has been rusting away and neglected for some time after all.

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Lets start with that American mindset is not in tune with current times. USA has gotten used to being the big kid on the block and is unwilling to adapt that mindset. Russian on another hand was in that economic mess not so long ago. They had no other choice but to accept the fact. Thats why in the 90's Russia and US were really "buddy-buddy". They had enough nukes to end all life on this planet but they didn't have the means to respond in more tactical or precise fasion.
In the past years the tables have turned. US is bogged down in the middle east and Russia is making a lot of money from that mess. (Oil Prices move mostly internationally)
In the simple temps, it is unprofitable for Russia to have peaceful, stable Middle East. That is why they are supporting Iran, and sold weapons to Iraq. They are brewing a proxy war. Superpowers don't fight directly, you want one of your minions to fight for you, simple strategy.
Now objectively speaking, Russian is try to do everything in its power to get US to go to war with Iran, they are trying to start a proxy war there. Unfortunately USA, with macho thinking is likely to fall into that trap.
This whole shield debate is superficial in nature, but it becomes an ego contest rather quick. For the fairness sake, US did get pretty upset about Russians considering to base their bombers in Cuba. Neither one of those propositions are catastrophic in nature like the media would make you think. Russian ICBM block would easily overwhelm the shield systems, and USA does have the capacity to neutralize any airborne threats from Cuba.
What really is happening, is Russia trying to manipulate the world market to its liking, like US has done in the 90's.

Exactly!! It makes me wonder if Russia is trying to play an economic game, control the pipe lines, and crush the US as the US had done to her during the 80's. Putin is not an idiot. This was not coincidence, I believe it was planned. The big question is what is Russia trying to obtain? She would not go to such lengths unless she had an ultimate goal, which I believe Putin may think this is the ultimate time frame to financially crush the US. Hmm, I wonder if this might be related to the rumor that the Chinese are going to dump the dollar after the olympics? Perhaps a means to sway public opinion on the upcoming presidential vote??

Originally posted by centurion1211


If you're an American, why would you think that the russians need your help with any of their policy moves?

And what "aggression"? It's a numbers game, man. 10 interceptors will not even make a dent in the russian missile arsenal if the russians decide to shoot them off.

I am not "helping" them with their policy moves, I am simply stating the obvious. If you flip the situation around a bit, perhaps it will make more sense. Imagine if you will, that Russia made deals with Mexico, Cuba, and Canada (imagination here) to allow Russia to put up a missile defense shield around North America.

Now lets imagine that the US says "OK fine put up your defense shield, because as you say, it is only there to protect everyone... right?"

So Russia puts in its shield and a week after its done, they begin to systematically bomb the US using ICBM's. Every time we shoot off a retaliatory strike, oh whoops forgot about that defense shield that is now causing our retaliation to be hindered.

US would not exactly be to happy, would it? Hell, even the mere mention of moving some military forces to Cuba got Washington all bent out of shape.

The point here is that we made a chess move, and we are now dealing with the consequences of that move. Russia has now also made a chess move, by going into Georgia, an ally to some NATO members, and pushing them around. They will now have to deal with consequences of that move.


All in all the chess game is far from over. These are just the pawns being pushed around at the moment. It will be quite different once the castle, rooks, bishops, and the "King and Queen" start to make their moves.

I only hope that this can be resolved as it was once before during the cold war.

[edit on 20-8-2008 by xmaddness]

[edit on 20-8-2008 by xmaddness]

you know what im tired of all this b.s. if america wants war with russia or vice versa the lets get on with it.lets see who comes out victorious.who do you guys think would win?oh!and how do you star and flag posts or threads,and whats it for.

Originally posted by flaco
you know what im tired of all this b.s. if america wants war with russia or vice versa the lets get on with it.lets see who comes out victorious.who do you guys think would win?oh!and how do you star and flag posts or threads,and whats it for.

No one wins. The next big fight would be nuclear, and all would lose.

You know what I find fascinating? Is that this planet is all we have, and is all we will ever have. Whether we come from evolution or creation we all have a common singularity in common. Yet, we continually fight and bicker over stupid crap, and kill each other in very horrific manners. The madness makes no sense.

Originally posted by SectionEight
Holysheepdip, a nazi. So why would a nazi side with a socialist state? The nazi's were bitter enemies of socialism. Or is it just the inherent fun in seeing mayhem and destruction for you?

Hitler considered himself a "socialist".

I do not know how new you are here, but it is quite common to hear the same old song and dance "the sky is falling". I would advise your sir, to get used to it.

The same time Russia, or the United States became unable to swamp ten theoretical or planned interceptors, apparently.

I'd like to point out that the three other officially recognized nuclear powers, China, the U.K. and France could also swamp these interceptors, much less Superpowers with tens of thousands of warheads.