Who created God and then who created him and him and him......

reply to post by billyjoinedat2k8

'Cause inside the box it's warm and welcoming; protection from the elements.

Originally posted by billyjoinedat2k8
If God created us (which i believe as a christian) then who created him and so everything comes from something and im sure God is no different surely someone out there is smart enough to atleast have a go at working out this riddle.

1. I'm not quite sure what you're talking about when you say, "God." I've never met anyone who could adequately define the concept enough to reasonably discuss it.

2. If you dump the unproven assumption in the argument that time is linear, that pretty much eliminates the need for any kind of creation in the first (or last) place. Imagine spacetime (including "time") as a kind of bubbling pot of water, but without the constraint of the pot. Everything all churning around, moving up and down and back and forth in little bubbles. No real beginning or end. Stuff from the future occasionally bubbling into the past. It ends up "bootstrapping" itself into existence, as a result of conscious observation by any and all living things.

The trick is to try and analyze exactly what you're asking, and find out where the hidden assumptions are. In your case, at the very least you assume everybody just automatically knows what "God" is, and that time is linear. Start by proving those things before moving on to the rest of the argument. Good luck.

In the theory about the big bang, there was a theory on how that occurred.

Simply put: Particles *popped* into existence for no apparent reason, they just came out of nowhere.

They ''popped into existence'' in such a manner that they formed a formation that created *BIG BANG*.

Those same particles that pop in usually do not last long though, and pop out of existence really fast as well.

The popping in and out of "existence" of particles has been monitored in recent times.

Note the last existence is between quotes, because noone obviously knows for sure if they actually just ''vanish'' from existence, or whether they go somewhere else.

[edit on 19/8/08 by -0mega-]

Talk about the age old question we humans have been asking since recorded history began.

If I can remember correctly, I believe this was the exact same question I presented to my first Sunday School teacher as a young lad. I received a stern look and reply, "You don't ask those kind of questions." From that point on, I became a true skeptic to religion, and studied in earnest to find the answer to that question.

Lo and behold, the answer was never found, unfortunately. Perhaps I didn't look hard enough and in the right places. However, all of the literature and history books I scoured while growing up, eluded to the fact that no religion is supreme and absolute in knowledge, there are always certain questions that "should not be asked" and certain things we should just have faith in, without any tangible, physical proof. No god, of the countless thousands we creative humans have conjured up--that we have defined--would be the one responsible for us being on this satellite of the sun.

While I may believe in this:



Many others around here would follow this belief:



I personally, think this is one of the toughest questions our species has ever grappled with, and could very well last, unanswered, until our extinction. Creator vs. creation... It's the toughest brain teasers like this that inspire humanity to further enlightenment.

Cheers!

[edit on 19-8-2008 by Rashaverak]

Are you serious the teacher actually said "you dont ask those kind of questions" thats terrible and things like that annoy me so much when people dont even question theyre beliefs they just mindlessly follow it without question.

reply to post by billyjoinedat2k8


Absolutely serious.

I remember asking this question, as a way to break the ice, to all of the other teachers I had within the religious establishments I joined. From childhood to college, I must have frequented half a dozen churches.

None of them ever had a definitive answer, or even a slightly convincing one that didn't involve "praying" and simple, plain faith.

You humans and your laughable ponderings..

When will you learn.

You question (imho) is the answer.
Because in that train of thought you could not exist either.
But you know that you exist? right?

Originally posted by Spreadthetruth
You humans and your laughable ponderings..

When will you learn.

When? When we recognize our confusion for what it is and filter it out until we hear our conscience/God consciousness and tap into the cosmic energy of Truth. Until then, we are scattered all over the place seeking knowledge when the knowledge is already within. When enough people reach that state of enlightenment (how many are needed?), then a universal consciousness can shift and set in motion a chain-reaction of enlightenment for everyone. Then you will realize your proper place in this manifested fractal consciousness of God.

God did not have a beginning and will never have an end. We can not possibly understand this fully because we are finite, we had a beginning. It is easy for me to imagine never dying and living forever but not to have always existed. God is the only being who has always existed.

Sorry I've not read any of the thread but I think that God would be just one of those things that IS. I don't think it would be possible to intellectualise it either way. At some point when you question existence, something has to come out of nothing. God would be a fact aka an axiom.

Definition: In traditional logic, an axiom or postulate is a proposition that is not proved or demonstrated but considered to be either self-evident, or subject to necessary decision. Therefore, its truth is taken for granted, and serves as a starting point for deducing and inferring other (theory dependent) truths.

from wikipedia

Everything that has been created must, by definition, have a creator. HOWEVER, there is no "law" that says everything MUST have been created.

In other words, God was not created, he IS. (Which is why He tells Moses that his name is "I AM", for all you existential types out there! )

Originally posted by sir_chancealot
Everything that has been created must, by definition, have a creator. HOWEVER, there is no "law" that says everything MUST have been created.

In other words, God was not created, he IS. (Which is why He tells Moses that his name is "I AM", for all you existential types out there!

)

Shame on you.

God is the only being who has always existed

See, that's what throws it all off for me. God is not a being.
There's a force that exists in the universe that no one understands, not even ETs. that force is know as God, it has always been there, and it shapes the universes. It builds new stars, planets and everything else out there, not only life.

To the people of this planet, God is simply the other beings that brought us here. We are the lab rats of space. Unless you think we are the superior beings of the entire universe.

My c2.

The Universe and God are infinite and therefore perfect. Given infinite time man shall never create anything perfect.


He who has no beginning and no end, God...

reply to post by billyjoinedat2k8


We as humans can not understand something not having a beginning because we had a beginning. At least not while we are in the physical world. God/the supreme being has just always been and never had a beginning.

Some concepts are impossible for us to grasp for some reason. It is as if a shroud is covering our eyes or understanding while we are here.

reply to post by Rashaverak


Well, this certaintly is interesting. I have gone about the same question for years, ever since I could actually understand what "mommy" meant. Half my family is christian, the other half is catholic, and I alone stand as the black sheep for always questioning things. Nothing makes sence; not religion, and certainly not Science. Even the smallest particle is made of something smaller, and like I read earlier, there seems to be no definite beginning or end. So the question remains unanswered. T_T

I have thought about this my self and I realized the minute a being has the ability to break the constraints of time they exist in all times. So a true omnipotent being that realizes time is just an illusion in effect all ways has been and all ways will be.

I just can't see how you can prove or disprove something that can not been seen. People Say's he's there but should I believe them? They say have faith, but I've seen faith kill people. Until he talks to me face to face then I just can't put a belief in him. For me to believe in something there has to be more proof then books written by man. This doesn't mean I don't wonder about some other God or nature being God etc... I just don't know.

Originally posted by billyjoinedat2k8
Annoying though aswell

i do believe we know the answers to these questions but we cant get to that part of the brain yet so we know it but we dont know it at the same time.

what makes us think that? oh yes, it is all pre conditioned thoughts. they are correct. When we let go of what we think you know, and learn to meditate... Inner space is infinite, ALL of yOUR questions will be answered. You did. Not you personally, but youll see what we mean when you get to the center. There is a reason why the buddha laughs, and the guru always smiles... the secret is inside..seek it...cause you already got it...



[edit on 9/29/2008 by psychedeliack]