Originally posted by Riposte
What do you mean, "not hard to see the skepticism here?" Do you think I'm trying to hide it or something? Because I'm not.

It wasn't a question, but I was emphasizing your skeptical approach. Thank you for confirming it.

The "money angle" is perfectly relevant here, because if Gilliland is making several hundred thousand dollars a year from this, it doesn't seem to mesh nicely with the philosophy he espouses on his website and videos. That kind of a contradiction in lifestyle is a major warning sign.

It is even moreso a major warning sign for people who are already eager to debunk a case like that of James Gilliland. If you suspect Gilliland is making "hundred thousands of dollars" then make a case for it. Right now you're speculating and setting the scene. You're using his spiritual oriented message against him but you haven't proven anything in the slightest.

And as you can see from my previous post, I think there is absolutely nothing at all wrong with charging small fees to maintain his ranch and for food and medical expenses.

Alrighty then.

His whole purpose seems to be about being a good Samaritan, so yes, he is going to have to walk the walk, especially if he what he says is true. Otherwise the aliens are going to shut him out, and that is all according to HIS OWN WORDS.

You're going to walk what you talk as well. Atmospheric/plasma anomolies for one but that's off topic, right? As far as Gilliland's "own words", you're setting them up to be used against him. Again you're creating an atmosphere against Gilliland to serve your own belief system (and maybe agenda).

Why don't you just answer the question? I am asking what he charges (which means I don't know what his income looks like). So if you want me to drop it, give me some concrete answer instead of trying to evade the topic altogether.

I don't have an answer to your question. I've never been to Mt. Adams. I don't know what Gilliland charges. From what I can gather on the internet and reports by people who went there, there doesn't seem to be a disproportionate amount of money charging on the part of James Gilliland. That brings me back again to my original statement; "Why don't you just drop this argument? If you see James Gilliland charging way out of proportion then you can make an argument. Don't attempt to create an atmosphere where James Gilliland is already suspect as being a propheteer."

Got it?

Originally posted by Riposte
You should know this if you have read his website or know anything at all about his philosophy. I can't believe that I even have to explain this... but I guess you're one of the reasons why televangelists can make so much money.

I indeed didn't read his website because it had nothing to do with my question. I saw that you questioned his credibility because he was making money so I commented on that. I did this because everytime a person in Ufology (witness, whistleblower) is being discussed his credibility is instantly attacked by skeptics when he makes a dollar. This argument is getting old but you were also quick to jump into the thread with the same assumption.

Why not focus on what people saw there instead of the fee they have to pay? Just a thougt...



[edit on 19/8/08 by Fastwalker81]

Originally posted by LateApexer313
Mrdstrbr, you're just so totally lost to all the propaganda concerning this business, and it IS a business, they charge for the right to spend a weekend, and photograph these anomalies, correct?

Umm, as far as I know, no. There are nominal fees for food and water, things like that, but as far as I know he does not actually charge people to stay there.

And unless I remember incorrectly, you haven't been there have you? You're just reading all the material and placing yourself as head PooBah of Project Information Dissemination Captain.

Yeah!! I'm the Head PooBah, baby!

Originally posted by Riposte
I asked a question, and explained the implications of the possible answers. You just admitted that you didn't have an answer to my question, which means you were basically trying to discredit me by engaging in fallacious reasoning.

I answered your question and so did others. I said I didn't find any wrongdoing on the part of James Gilliland and so did others who actually went there. You were the one making suggestions, settings the scene in order to discredit. And in the end you dare to attribute "fallacious reasoning" to my person? Very gutsy, but try again.

You shouldn't even have bothered replying to me. I've dropped this angle already, yet you apparently decided not to read the thread and and as a result you have turned this thread into a quagmire. The burden of proof is not on me.

Oh, I read the thread. The quagmire was your doing with all your suggestions, and once you make suggestions the burden of proof falls equally on you.

Riposte,

You now know where you can book your next vacation and get those questions answered yourself...

I've wanted to make the trip myself. It seems like something is indeed going on there and James seems legit and genuine. He seems to be a contact point for a slow and deliberate disclosure from the ET side.

"counted well over a couple dozen different objects that were non-conventional "

was there something preventing you from photographing these countless ufo's parading around?

do you not own a videocam?

this thread appears to be nothing more than promotional advertising for a niche b&b service and not an investigation.

which i believe violates the tos.

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I cannot wait to see what all the Cable shows have to say about James sanctuary. Sounds like alot of beautiful and mind bending times. I say we get a bus like "Futher" and drive out there picking up ATSers as we make are way across the country. I personally live just over 1500 miles from the site but thats nothing when youve got great company and great stories to share on the trip over. Whos got a bus to share with the Galaxy?

Even if the guy had a camara and took footage of the UFO's, all you would see are dots in the sky and the skeptics here would still rip on it.

While there may have been actual alien or similar activity there at some time, I am suspicious that there may be those trying to provoke these people out or show themselves.



[edit on 19-8-2008 by aleon1018]

Originally posted by Alferd Packer
I cannot wait to see what all the Cable shows have to say about James sanctuary. Sounds like alot of beautiful and mind bending times. I say we get a bus like "Futher" and drive out there picking up ATSers as we make are way across the country. I personally live just over 1500 miles from the site but thats nothing when youve got great company and great stories to share on the trip over. Whos got a bus to share with the Galaxy?

That sounds fun! I wish gas didnt cost so much. I would love to drive up the 101 north in california on my way!

Right now, I'm researching information on access to that area, from the standpoint of public access. Maybe I'll start a new thread for "field trip to Mt Adams information for trekkers". It's a large mountain, and is frequented by backpackers, campers, climbers, etc. I happen to have these as hobbies, and know of many online, outdoorsy forums. One side is an Indian Reservation. Anyway, in response to the subject of the sancuary charging a nominal fee. The National Forest charges access fees. There are camping fees in their campgrounds. There is another fee to try and summit the mountain. This is to cover the cost of the publics' environmental impact...water, sanitation, upkeep, administartion, etc. James would have costs incurred to administer to the amount of people who are visiting. They have an impact. Should it be free? I expect to pay for my impact. I do every time I enter the wilderness, happily, I might ad.

Hey guys, sorry it took me so long to get back here. My PC access is somedwhat limited at the moment.

In response to the folks asking how much it costs to stay there, the answer for me was ZERO. I e-mailed James and asked if I could camp out overnight on his grounds, and how much I needed to pay, and he did not even address the money issue, he simply said, "Sounds great, see you here!"

Now, knowing that ANY place a person sets up camp on grounds usually requires a fee, I decided to send James a small donation in accordance to that. But he never asked nor required me to do so, I did it on my own accord.

My advice to those of you who wish to visit this place is to do what I did-e-mail him for permission, and set up your own little camping spot. If he says okay, then the cost is pretty much up to you.