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Originally posted by justamomma
Why did he not just make robots then? If doing things my own way and learning from them is so wrong, then why not just take away my free will since having free will technically means I should be FREE to exercise my will w/out fear of punishment.
Originally posted by NOTurTypicalBecause true love is freely given, it cannot be programmed. If God created us only to serve him we wouldn't do it out of Love, not out of our free will.
I hope that makes sense.
Yes God is the creator of everything. But "evil" as I showed previously, isn't a THING, it's what is present in the absence of good.
Originally posted by v01i0
reply to post by NOTurTypical
Are you saying that God didn't create evil, but instead evil is somekind of by-product of it's creation?
I can respect your opinion of evil being lack of good, but personally I don't view it as such. I think that the "God" is creator of everything. Every "creature", by which I mean both flora and fauna, in short everything. And by "God" I mean no personality, no single specified "creature", but rather a "law" or "will" of the everything that exists!
Anyway, in general I appreciate your contribution in this matter.
Originally posted by Geemor
Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Not true for an omniscient God. Take the garden of Eden for example, Adam and Eve were naked, they were not ashamed of such until they ate the fruit.
What made them ashamed to be naked in public was the "knowledge" of right and wrong from the standpoint of decency.
hmm, ok. but didn't adam and eve firsthandely experienced the evil by going against the will of the god by eating from the tree of knowledge? they couldn't know about good and evil before they had sinned.
Let me assure you that I do not see the sense in this AT ALL! How can I give love freely when the consequence of not giving is hell? How is it love when there are attachments to it?
I cannot love a god (or anyone for that matter) that says I give you the choice to do as you will but if you choose wrong according to my morals I will throw you in a lake of fire for all eternity. BLEH!!!
I find people such as yourself ridiculous when you say we have "free will" and god's love is free. His love, according to you, is anything but free. Anything offered that comes with stipulations REGARDLESS of the stipulations is not free..... this is fact, something the bible lacks.
Use YOUR head people and open your eyes. If you look at this logically, you will see that although the bible paints some beautiful metaphors and holds bits and pieces of wisdom, it WAS altered greatly for the sole purpose of controlling you, not loving you. It is meant to make you conform to ideas and thoughts that are NOT your own and if you don't, it threatens punishment.
That is evil and if god is responsible for this love with moral stipulation message after he created us and made us individuals w/ different interests and desires, a brain to think our own intelligent thoughts, a curiosity and the desire to experience but then also set up a place to throw all of those who go with these things he gave us, then rest assured, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out he is a trickster playing an evil game and therefore evil.
Originally posted by v01i0
Hello once again,
I hate to see how people and religious groups strip their gods from omnipotency by denying evil from the God. It is like stealing 50% of God's properties if he cannot be evil.
What comes to the christianity, many people seem to forget that God as also evil; God created Satan, and when Moses performed miracles in Egypt, many people tend to forget that it was God whom hardened Pharaoh's heart not to let Hebrews leave the slavery.
So then, people still keep asking why does God allow such evil in world? Answer of course is that God is evil (as well as good). Those who deny evil from God are denying God.
So all the religious sects and cults that are promoting the concept of God being only good, are in fact liars and denying the God's omnipotency.
You shall not make yourself a carved image or any likeness of anything in heaven or on earth beneath or in the waters under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them. For I, Yahweh, your God, am a jealous God and I punish the father’s faults in the sons, the grandsons and the great-grandsons of those who hate me; but I show kindness to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments (Exodus 20:4-6).
Originally posted by NOTurTypicalWell, I'm doing my best to explain, and I'll try until you do understand. You don't give your love "for fear of going to hell". Love isn't born out of fear. I love God for the sacrifice he made to redeem me from eternal damnation. is it a damnation I deserve? Yes, the first time I sinned, or did evil I was unjust in God's eyes to enter heaven, that was Satan's goal in the garden of Eden. No one can love God out of fear of hell, one loves God out of astonishment that he would bear my punishment for me. That's true love!!!
Why not? When you get a drivers license you agree to abide by the rules of the road or you risk losing your license, or worse, going to jail. Love towards God should be utter amazement that he'd put himself in our place and die a death we should have died for our sins. I myself can never say "thank you" enough for that act of love.
We do have free will, you asked yourself why we were not created "robots". It's your choice if you want to be redeemed. Take it or leave it. And God must punish people for refusing to accept payment out of free will for their sins. If he didn't he would not be a just God. He'd be very corrupt like Satan.
That's a straw man argument, God's commandments are for our protection, they DO NOT "control" us, we have free will to obey or not to obey. I've stated numerous times that if every man woman and child obeyed God's commandment the world would be a perfect place. The fact that this world is NOT a perfect place is because we humans do things contrary to God's perfect law.
Originally posted by NOTurTypicalUmmm, Satan tricked Eve into eating the fruit that gave us those desires. God commanded them not to eat the fruit that would give them the knowledge of good and evil. If you want to hate someone for that, hate the one responsible: Satan.