Nazi war crimes suspect faces court

Nazi war crimes suspect faces court

www.news.com.au

ACCUSED Nazi war criminal Charles Zentai will appear in a Perth court today for an extradition hearing.

Mr Zentai is accused of torturing and murdering 18-year-old Peter Balazs in Budapest in 1944 for failing to wear a yellow star identifying him as a Jew.

The Hungarian Government is seeking the 86-year-old's extradition to face war crimes charges.
This week's three-day hearing in the Perth Magistrates Court will decide whether his case meets the terms of the Australian Extradition Act

(visit the link for the full news article)

Another example of extreme stupidity being abused.

Seriously, he's 86 with failing health! What will an extradition and trial prove???

I don't know which is the worse offense to commit - being an ex-Nazi, or hacking into NASA computers. Either way, the offended countries will pursue you to the corners of the Earth to find you and extradite you.

www.news.com.au
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 17-8-2008 by tezzajw]

Originally posted by tezzajw


Another example of extreme stupidity being abused.

Seriously, he's 86 with failing health! What will an extradition and trial prove???

I don't which is the worse offense to commit - being an ex-Nazi, or hacking into NASA computers. Either way, the offended countries will pursue you to the corners of the Earth to find you and extradite you.

www.news.com.au
(visit the link for the full news article)

...and what does it say to the Jews, Gypsies, Homosexuals, etc. who's people were victims of the Nazi atrocities if you decide to not prosecute a person who committed such atrocities simply because he is old?

What does it say for COMMON SENSE to prosecute him?

Ok, fly him to Hungary. Trial him and find him guilty, then what? He dies a year later in jail? How much will all that have cost?

What's the POINT???

Notice at the end of the news article that he is listed as number 7 of the top 10 wanted NAZIs. How about this for some common sense: Wait another five to ten years and they'll all be dead anyway! His alleged offence was 64 years ago.

Common sense would use the money to help people now. Instead, they're funding the pockets of lawyers and judges to make him an example. How much will this end up costing? How many houses could that money have been built for real people, who need help, rather than funding a 64 year-old grudge for one murder???

Common sense... it's not common anymore.

[edit on 17-8-2008 by tezzajw]

The easiest way to answer your asinine post is to repost what i already said:

...and what does it say to the Jews, Gypsies, Homosexuals, etc. who's people were victims of the Nazi atrocities if you decide to not prosecute a person who committed such atrocities simply because he is old?

While I have nothing but sympathy for Mr. Zentai's family, if he did what he is accused of he should be punished. Running away and hiding for 60+ years doesn't excuse his actions, nor should he be given a free pass because of it.

He's had a much longer life than he allowed his victim to have.

At least he isn't being tried in absentia.

Ok, scotty. What should be done with him?

Let us know what you would do with him and how much you would be prepared to spend to bring him to 'justice'?

Now while you're spending all that money, explain to the homeless people in Perth, that every $250,000 spent on this case could have built a home for five people.

Originally posted by tezzajw
Ok, scotty. What should be done with him?

Let us know what you would do with him and how much you would be prepared to spend to bring him to 'justice'?

Now while you're spending all that money, explain to the homeless people in Perth, that every $250,000 spent on this case could have built a home for five people.

Same thing all the others got for whatever it costs No special treatment for people who perpetrated such atrocities. What truly saddens me is that you clearly think that money and the guys age are more important then the people who were victims. It's people like you who help bigotry and hate go on in this world.

Originally posted by tezzajw
What does it say for COMMON SENSE to prosecute him?

Ok, fly him to Hungary. Trial him and find him guilty, then what? He dies a year later in jail? How much will all that have cost?

What's the POINT???

The point is to uphold the law: If you make exceptions for anyone, then you set the precedence of letting anyone else off too. As long as said trial upholds whatever stands for "due process of law," then that's what must be done.

The US government has already committed far too many atrocities to the Rule Of Law (ie: the Constitution) to date, & each violation merely sets precedence to commit more...When the lawmakers themselves show contempt for the law, that attitude always filters down to the people. There's numerous examples in history that proves this.

[edit on 17-8-2008 by MidnightDStroyer]

Originally posted by scotty18
Same thing all the others got for whatever it costs No special treatment for people who perpetrated such atrocities. What truly saddens me is that you clearly think that money and the guys age are more important then the people who were victims. It's people like you who help bigotry and hate go on in this world.

Wow, great answer!

So, let's spend say $2 million dollars to fly an 86 year old man, with ill-health, half way around the world, to put him on trial. Then, if he's found guilty, we'll lock him up.

What truly saddens me is that SOME people WANT TO BE victims for the rest of their lives, instead of making good with what they have and moving on.

By the way, scotty, you might be new here, so watch the potential personal insults. You come close when you use the 'It's people like you who...' line.

My solution helps people today make a better life for themselves. Your solution makes lawyers rich and perpetuates ancient grudges. Each to their own.

Originally posted by tezzajw

Wow, great answer!

So, let's spend say $2 million dollars to fly an 86 year old man, with ill-health, half way around the world, to put him on trial. Then, if he's found guilty, we'll lock him up.

Yep, why should he get special treatment because he avoided facing up to what he did for so many years.

What truly saddens me is that SOME people WANT TO BE victims for the rest of their lives, instead of making good with what they have and moving on.

Nobody is wanting to be a victim, just justice for those who deserve it. I have an idea, let's murder some of your relatives, use their skin to make lampshades, do experiments on them, shoot them in the back of the head (adults and children) and let them fall into a mass, unmarked grave, pull fillings out of their teeth, etc. and see if you think the people who did this deserve to go free ater they are caught because of money or age. You have no clue.

By the way, scotty, you might be new here, so watch the potential personal insults. You come close when you use the 'It's people like you who...' line.

Wow, I am calling you out for saying foolish things and you are threatening to run and tell on me????? I guess you know you have nothing of substance here.

My solution helps people today make a better life for themselves. Your solution makes lawyers rich and perpetuates ancient grudges. Each to their own.

No, your solution insults the memories of those where murdered and makes excuses for the scum of the earth who committed them.

I would want any murderer brought to justice for "just one" murder.

I'm guessing you're too young to have experienced many or all of your family being exterminated in the holocaust. If you did, I don't think you'd call it "common sense" to let the murderer go free.

For those who lived through the Nazi terror there is no forgetting.

To fail to prosecute a war criminal because of the cost of the trial is ridiculous. It costs this country millions to prosecute killers if it leads to an execution and that's as it should be. The accused should have their day in court.

Nobody should have an exemption from justice just because it took a long time to catch them.

At what point did I say that he should be set 'free'?

If he has to be detained, as so many of you think he should - then why can't he be locked up in a secure facility in Perth? What is the point of flying him to Hungary??? WHY???

Tell me again, how can you justify flying an 86 year old man, with ill health, half way around the world to face a trail, all to be put in jail, IF he is found guilty? Remember that he is INNOCENT until proven guilty, or have we also forgotten that?

It's nuts.

Sestias - legal 'justice' is a BS ideal that governments like us to think that we are all entitled to. There is no justice - none. Think about it. Tell me how relevant your justice will be to an 86 year old man with failing health? How relevant will it be to the distant relations of the person who he allegedly murdered? They get to clap and cheer that they can finally lock up an old man and know that the community will be much safer because of it?

There is no justice, other than what you make of it.

I have told you over and over but you choose to not listen and make veiled threats.

reply to post by tezzajw

And you also seem to fail to recognize that, in Perth, it's only a hearing to determine whether or not to extradite him...Not to determine innocence or guiltThe actual trial should take place where the alleged crimes were committed. Do the words "Extradition Treaties" mean anything to you?

Yep, still sounds like "due process" to me...And I'm quite well-versed in the American (& my State) Constitution although I have to admit I'm a bit lacking in the laws of other countries.

Besides, I'm one of the first to admit that governments aren't perfect...Indeed, they're staffed by human beings just as fallible as any others (if not a bit more so: Check page 5 of this thread for my reasons why I think so). But one of the primary reasons why governments exist at all is to uphold the law.

[edit on 17-8-2008 by MidnightDStroyer]

Originally posted by MidnightDStroyer
And you also seem to fail to recognize that, in Perth, it's only a hearing to determine whether or not to extradite him...The actual trial should take place where the alleged crimes were committed. Do the words "Extradition Treaties" mean anything to you?

I know it's only a hearing. Read my OP, I know about extradition treaties, which is why I compared it to Gary McKinnon being pursued by the USA.

But one of the primary reasons why governments exist at all is to uphold the law.

I've read a lot of your posts about the US Constitution and I know that you know the US law. Cool. In theory, it's a wonderful document that guarantees everyone is treated equally and fairly. In practice it's completely worthless and a total sham. Look at what the current regime is doing in the USA - whatever they like, in spite of the law.

When a government breaks its own laws, then wouldn't that suggest that the ENTIRE system is corrupt? If the government can't abide by its own laws, then it's time to abolish the government and its laws.

Anarchy sounds like a dirty word to many people, probably because they fear what life would be like without unnecessary laws cluttering their lives on a daily basis. Every law written, is another bind that ties our freedom.

Something the OP is really failing to realize here is that any Ex-Nazi found convicted of his crimes is given the death penalty. He won't face jail time, he will be executed.

I don't see the point in re-iterating the other posters points about the absurdity of just leaving an murderer and Nazi alone because he hid from the law and is old, and comparing murder and war crimes to computer hacking is , to be polite here, a ludicrous grasping of straws.

Was i wrong in believing there is no statute of limitations on genocide, much less murder?

[edit on 17-8-2008 by D.E.M.]

reply to post by D.E.M.


Not neccessarily so. I know of one who was sentenced to life in prison after being convicted in Italy.

In June 2005, The Australian unearthed six witness statements from Budapest trials conducted in 1947 and 1948 accusing Mr Zentai - then a 23-year-old warrant officer in the Hitler-aligned Hungarian army - of being involved in the five-hour beating of Balazs, 18, alongside his transport unit captain, Bela Mader, and lieutenant Lajos Nagy.

But in a translated transcript of Mader's interrogation at Budapest's military political office on November 15, 1945, Mader points the finger of blame for Balazs's assault at only one person: Nagy.

Mader's testimony was used at Nagy's trial in the Budapest People's Court in February 1948, and he was convicted.

Mader was also convicted at a trial in relation to Balazs's murder and admitted during his interrogation that he was cruel to the teenager as he lay dying in the inner office.

www.theaustralian.news.com.au...

Am I missing something here? Looks to me like someone has already been tried and convicted of this crime.

The legal crap and tax-payer funded circus continues to roll along... This has to be a joke. But, as most people in this thread have argued, justice must be done!!! Yeah, right... the sheer stupidity of it makes me laugh.

Update - Possible High Court Appeal