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Originally posted by jsobecky
reply to post by ThePiemaker
It speaks to our moral fiber as a nation, how we treat the most defenseless among us. We are not a disposable society when it comes to life.
Originally posted by jsobecky
reply to post by ThePiemaker
It speaks to our moral fiber as a nation, how we treat the most defenseless among us. We are not a disposable society when it comes to life.
Americans (53%) consider themselves "pro-choice" on abortion, whereas 42% call themselves "pro-life."
Originally posted by ThePiemaker
I hate that abortion is even a political issue. stay out of other people's business. If you don't want an abortion, then you don't get one. Don't try and make that decision for somebody else.
Originally posted by jsobecky
He also made a false statement last night when he said that under Bush, the number of abortions has not been lowered.
www.factcheck.org...
Originally posted by jsobecky
Obama has tried to mitigate his stance by announcing that he is in favor of methods that would reduce the overall number of abortions. But that is nothing more than pandering. He also made a false statement last night when he said that under Bush, the number of abortions has not been lowered.
www.factcheck.org...
U.S. abortion rate falls, study finds
Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:32am EST
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. abortion rate has fallen to its lowest level since 1976, with about 20 percent of pregnancies being terminated by abortion, the nonprofit Alan Guttmacher Institute reported on Thursday.
Its survey of all known abortion providers found the abortion rate fell 9 percent between 2000 and 2005, probably due to a combination of better access to contraception and less access to abortion providers, the group said.
Reuters
Originally posted by schrodingers dog
Originally posted by jsobecky
It speaks to our moral fiber as a nation, how we treat the most defenseless among us. We are not a disposable society when it comes to life.
Oh the old moral fiber.
Since, as you suggest, make law with "moral fiber" as our guide, it would be helpful if you could define that for us?
Then please tell us who's morality we should use as a baseline?
I would also like to know if "moral fiber" should be a part of our foreign policy? Let's say how do we apply this "moral fiber".
Perhaps we should paint it on the tip of our bombs as they kill thousands of innocents, many of whom are actual walking around babies.
Or shall we use this "moral fiber" with arbitrary discretion when it can be pimped as a convenient abstract emotional tool?
You know, I was in the middle of posting my opinion that you really are saying nothing new here. According to Gallup:
Americans (53%) consider themselves "pro-choice" on abortion, whereas 42% call themselves "pro-life."
And both candidate's stance is neither new or contradictory to their party's ideology.
But you had to use the old moral fiber and in the process destroying any of this thread's credibility.
Moral Fibre. You're funny
Originally posted by jsobecky
One of the issues that was discussed last night was abortion. We now know the candidate's opinions on when life begins, and their stances. McCain is pro-life, and believes that life begins at conception. Obama is pro-choice and said the answer to that question was "above his pay grade". He states that his pro-choice stance does not mean he is pro-abortion.
But Obama's voting record tells a different tale. He has strongly opposed the Supreme Court ban against partial birth abortion, a particulary disgusting procedure. In the Illinois state Senate, he opposed a bill similar to the Born-Alive Infants Protection Act, which prevents the killing of infants mistakenly left alive by abortion. And he has stated that he wouldn't want his daughters "punished" by a pregnancy, another odd perspective for a prospective leader of the free world.
www.washingtonpost.com...
Obama has tried to mitigate his stance by announcing that he is in favor of methods that would reduce the overall number of abortions. But that is nothing more than pandering. He also made a false statement last night when he said that under Bush, the number of abortions has not been lowered.
www.factcheck.org...
Originally posted by schrodingers dog
Originally posted by jsobecky
Obama has tried to mitigate his stance by announcing that he is in favor of methods that would reduce the overall number of abortions. But that is nothing more than pandering. He also made a false statement last night when he said that under Bush, the number of abortions has not been lowered.
www.factcheck.org...
You're not on your game today:
U.S. abortion rate falls, study finds
Thu Jan 17, 2008 11:32am EST
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. abortion rate has fallen to its lowest level since 1976, with about 20 percent of pregnancies being terminated by abortion, the nonprofit Alan Guttmacher Institute reported on Thursday.
Its survey of all known abortion providers found the abortion rate fell 9 percent between 2000 and 2005, probably due to a combination of better access to contraception and less access to abortion providers, the group said.
Reuters
You better get your moral fiber for breakfast!
Originally posted by schrodingers dog
All I am saying to you is if your are going to use you moral compass to create social law then use it universally.
No, that's not "all you're saying". You attempted to poke fun at the word morality by painting it as "old-fashioned" "traditional" "out-of-touch", etc.
And whether you want to admit it or not, morality does play a big factor in legislation. What else are we to be guided by? *You*? Ha!
Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
I would hardly call Obama's stance on abortion 'extreme'. He is, as some may have noticed, opposed to abortion. He doesn't think it's a great idea.
He is, however, pro-freedom on this subject.
His stand on partial-birth abortions is that an exception must be made in any bans if the health of the mother is at risk. We need to remember that.
Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
Obama hit it on the head with his stance that we as a culture need to prevent unwanted pregnancies in the first place... that's the best way to lower the abortion rate. This means realistic, effective sex ed and easily obtained, effective birth control.
Originally posted by Open_Minded Skeptic
I find it endlessly fascinating how so many of the "right to life" proponents are all concerned about a mass of cells, but not so concerned when they look ahead at the conditions into which the child will be born. And too frequently abused. So I guess the welfare of a mass of cells outweighs the welfare of the ultimate child sometimes.