NASA Historian: Advanced Alien Cultures May Be Sentient Machines In A Post Biological Universe!, page 1
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Topic started on 13-8-2008 @ 08:10 AM by mikesingh


For starters, what would the level of a post biological culture be? What we’ll be looking at here is an advanced alien culture that is probably beyond even a Type 3 civilization, which, according to Dr Michio Kaku, has reached a technological level high enough to travel through and between multiverses as a matter of course! (We are still Type 0!)

The Post Biological Universe

The possibility exists that cultural evolution over the long time scales of the universe has resulted in something beyond biology, namely, artificial intelligence (AI). Such a post biological universe cannot mean a universe devoid of biological intelligence, since humans are an obvious counterexample. Nor does it mean a universe devoid of lower forms of life. Rather, the post biological universe is one in which the majority of intelligent life has evolved beyond flesh and blood intelligence, in proportion to its longevity.


Is it possible that advanced intelligent life exists where biology has morphed into post biological machines? The motivating factor is the inherent desire to improve mental capacity. Is it possible that highly developed alien beings have already reached a point in their evolution where, having reached the peak capacity of their biological brains, have taken the next logical step and opted for robotic brains equipped with artificial intelligence?

According to Steven Dick, NASA Chief Historian (as told to Ker Than in Popular Science):

This brain swap may not be as far off for humans as one might think. In only a few decades, the computer revolution here on Earth has produced supercomputers capable of performing more than a quadrillion calculations per second. (According to research by Hans Moravec, an artificial intelligence expert at Carnegie Mellon University, that trumps the human brain's estimated top speed of 100 trillion calculations per second.)

Some scientists speculate that in a few decades, an event called the technological singularity will occur, and machines armed with computer brains will become sentient and surpass human intelligence.

Civilizations equipped with technology light-years ahead of our own could have already experienced the singularity thousands or even millions of years ago.


What is the likelihood that such advanced robotic races exist? Given the limitations of biology as we know it, the force of cultural evolution, and the imperative to improve intelligence, it could very much be in the realms of possibility. And, if post biological beings do exist, would they be interested in us at all? Most likely the gulf between their minds and ours might be so great that communication would be impossible!
So is SETI barking up the wrong tree?


Image courtesy: whyfiles.

”We conclude that the conventional radio SETI assuming beamed broadcasts from targets - selected exclusively on the basis of the old fashioned biological paradigm - within the vicinity of our Solar System is ill-founded and has minuscule chances of success."
Cirkovic and Bradbury.


James Gardner, author of The Intelligent Universe: AI, ET, and the Emerging Mind of the Cosmos answers an interesting question by Universe: (His first book, Biocosm, suggests that intelligence doesn't emerge in a series of Darwinian accidents, but is hard-wired into the cycle of cosmic creation).


James Gardner

Universe: You often cite Ray Kurzweil's ideas of our trans-human or post-biological future. As a writer, what do you think the role of writing -- or more generally, of culture -- will be in a post-biological society? Does the singularity necessarily imply an end to creativity and the arts as we know them, or simply a huge shift?

Gardner: I believe that culture and art will continue to flourish in a post-biological future. That future will build on what has gone before. Indeed, it will represent a fusion of the human and the trans-human. (As you saw in the last part of my book, I disagree with the pessimistic views of Arthur C. Clarke in Childhood’s End.) Because it will vastly expand the realm of intellectual possibilities and the sheer size of available cultural space, the onset of the Singularity should facilitate an immense burst of creativity and give birth to new artistic genres that we can only dimly foresee.


And…

Self Replicating Von Neumann Probes

How about the Von Neumann probes? These are self replicating sentient robots/machines possessing an extremely high level of artificial intelligence, way more advanced than human intelligence. These are pre programmed to eventually reproduce by the millions soon after their arrival on a planetary body with the help of local resources and these copies would then be launched by them to the next set of neighboring stars. This process would be repeated, over and over again, so that increasing numbers of identical probes would be involved in penetrating ever more remote regions of the Galaxy.

Advanced technologies required to build such a spacecraft would include highly sophisticated artificial intelligence, molecular self assembling nanotechnology, and an advanced propulsion scheme like anti-matter rockets, beamed energy, interstellar ram-jets or the more esoteric FTL propulsion.


Illustration of a Von Neumann Probe.
Courtesy: David Darling, in The Encyclopedia of Science.


Having dispatched copies of itself, a probe would begin to explore the star system in which it found itself. It would conduct scientific research and transmit the results back to the point of origin. It could also be used as a means of interstellar colonization by constructing an artificial life-sustaining environment and then implanting this with synthesized fertile egg-cells bearing genomes transcribed from the probe's computer memory.

Eiseley has suggested that the embryonic individuals of such a colony could be tended by robots, also built by the probe, until they were old enough to function independently. They would then be free to develop their own civilization around the host star.
David Darling.


Beyond the future!

So if we ever come in contact with an ET race, we could well be interacting with a post biological entity – a sentient machine of mind boggling complexity! Or something even beyond that? Looking far, far into the future, could post biological entities have no form, but exist only as pure forms of energy?


Image credit: Roger Johnston.

Cheers!


Refs:

www.dailygalaxy.com...
www.setileague.org...
www.daviddarling.info...
whyfiles.org...
David Darling
www.urbanhonking.com...









[edit on 13-8-2008 by mikesingh]


reply posted on 13-8-2008 @ 11:07 AM by aleon1018
It would seem that immortality is part of the keys to space flight and time travel. We've already seen some of these suggested in our alleged science fiction such as Star Trek.

We often overlook how we receive much of this information over the air waves. Jump gates and powerful computers could be hidden and or cloaked from view just about anywhere and even mobile in these androids.

I've probably already met some of these alleged machines or guardian angels etc. And they were apparently very heavy. It's my understanding that they use some type of collective radioactive engergy for their own power and use this for various purposes such as spontaneous tissue regeneration or healing. The christ figure may have been one of these also. But, this could also be misleading and quite the opposite. We already make reference to OOBE or astral travel.

So, it's my guess since this energy is so abundant, that it's used most often and is probably another one of the keys to life and nature.

I suppose this youtube has been posted here before.

www.youtube.com...

Our ability to escape from dying worlds might be using this type of travel also. This has also been suggested in some Star Trek episodes using jump gates. A collective consciousness doesn't have to be physically oriented in a biological form, but, possibly in stasis form such as a crystal. A persons consiousness and personality could then most likely be duplicated or cloned.

These machines could just be portable jump gates that look like averge humans. If we can imagine it, most likely they're capable of having already done it.



reply posted on 13-8-2008 @ 01:48 PM by mikesingh
reply to post by Zepherian



Agreed to a point. But let's see what the Intelligence Principle is:

"The maintenance, improvement and perpetuation of knowledge and intelligence is the central driving force of cultural evolution, and that to the extent intelligence can be improved, it will be improved.

Applying this principle to life in the universe, extraterrestrials will have sought the best way to improve their intelligence, and may have long ago advanced beyond flesh-and-blood to artificial intelligence, constituting a post biological universe."
- Dr. Steven Dick

Would we follow the same principle? I daresay, 'yes' as this is probably a natural progression in universal evolution. At present, we use just about 10% of our brains. In the distant future we may have reached the point of saturation where even the full power of the brain becomes a limiting factor. The only alternative is to progress with AI as part of the evolutionary process. Stagnation goes against the very grain of evolution. And that's when we enter the post biological phase.

Further down the line, perhaps a few billion years from now, we may morph into pure energy beings with no bio baggage! Hard core sci-fi, what? But that's probably what lies ahead in the far distant future. After that? Well, I can't even begin to comprehend! Perhaps all this energy would merge to become .....God?? And engineer another Big Bang to create another universe? Like ours?! Now, am I at the threshold of understanding what God is, after all?

Heck! This is frying my brains. I'm heading for some chilled beer to cool off, some!

Cheers!




[edit on 13-8-2008 by mikesingh]



reply posted on 13-8-2008 @ 08:27 PM by MystikMushroom
This reminds me of the "new" Cylons on the new Battlestar Galatica...


The Cylons were created by Man.
They were created to make life easier on the Twelve Colonies.
And then the day came when the Cylons decided to kill their masters. After a long and bloody struggle, an armistice was declared.
The Cylons left for another world to call their own.
A remote space station was built...
Where Cylon and human could meet and maintain diplomatic relations.
Every year, the Colonials send an officer...
The Cylons send no one.
No-one has seen or heard from the Cylons in over forty years... ---Opening text of the Battlestar Galactica Miniseries


The "new" cylons are "artificial" humans, "synthetic" if you will, but nearly impossible to distinguish from REAL humans.



Humanoid Cylons[1] are the quintessential Cylon form in the Re-imagined Series. These Cylons biologically mimic human form so completely that they are nearly undetectable to current Colonial technologies. Humanoid Cylons have the capacity to emulate many human physical acts, including sex. They also display convincingly human personalities (affection, jealousy, sadness, anger, sense of humor, religious faith, etc.) This behavior continues even when interacting with other Cylons outside of Colonial scrutiny, clearly establishing that their personalities are genuine. The humanoid Cylons are responsible for masterminding the complete destruction of the Twelve Colonies through their use of sabotage and infiltration.





They sure look good to me!

Battlestar WIKI entry on Humanoid Cylons...


reply posted on 13-8-2008 @ 08:32 PM by Tiste Andii
reply to post by mikesingh




Great thread mikesingh.

I have often thought along these lines myself. I find it very amusing how people assume that there is no life upon certain planets when there could be robotic life or even beings of pure energy.
Just because the environment is not like ours life couldn't exist? Whatever...

Some people may have a hard time deciding if a robot would be considered a living being, but in my opinion if it has intelligence and thinks and acts on its own it is a living being.

I do find it a bit frightning when I think of robots living and existing with us, but if some of the laws SLAYER69 described were put into place it would comfort my fear!!

Cheers

Tiste
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