Puzzle #5 - origami/tangram symbols

There are 21 symbols used in this cryptogram. So there are 7 groups of 3 symbols. I will double check.

reply to post by Deaf Alien

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Did a double check. It's 20 PLUS that "bad" symbol

reply to post by Deaf Alien

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Okay it's 19 symbols plus the bad symbol and missing symbol. Somebody double check for me lol. Maybe it's not important. This is what I get for staring at those triangles for so long.

reply to post by Deaf Alien

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I did the first word and it translated to KETCHUP with anagram solver

reply to post by Deaf Alien

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lol. "the bad symbol"

Great job on counting these all.

[edit on 11-8-2008 by ragster]

Whew Im getting tired. There are several threads with the word ketchup in the titles

a diagonal line is a line that goes in all possible directions (whether its 2 d or 3 d), unlike a horizontal or vertical that only goes one way. perhaps it means its true "both ways"? sorry im not sure if that made sense...

I have an idea

the legend, is a puzzle key.

imagine placing the black symboled triangles over the existing symbols, to block out some triangles maybe change the shape of the symbols

the way we find our symbols to be keyed over, we use the dots, the dots represent letters from the old puzzle, so we look for those letters in the current puzzle. but

each time you code a new puzzle its never the same letters, thats what is making me think that the double dot symbols prove to show us something i dont know yet

this reminds me of wheel of fortune

you know at the end they give 5 letters to have.

maybe these 5 letters or 6 whatever describes a genre, or is clues.

You could be on to something. If we ignore the white and focus on the black parts and using the ENIIN charcters to cover or be covered by the individual glyphs actual letters will appear thus building words. Also black on black could remain the same, black on white must change.

[edit on 11-8-2008 by DraconianKing]

yea drac thats awesome

another thing i went through the puzzle again

something was wrong with one of the letter associations i had, i went through double checked it, triple checked it, this is the exact letter association for the symbols, and also for the 5 letter legend

alphabet

ABCDEFG HBIJKDFLG MFNOPCQAOO
MFGFIQNQRJ HSALAF

HNIDC




us-keyboard

QWERTYU IWOPARYST DYFGHREJQGG
DYUYOKFKLP IJQSQY

IFWRE



number of lines estimated
6722633 77652356 338762272677
3333758565 756563


[edit on 12-8-2008 by ragster]

I'm not one to shoot anybody's ideas down (especially with the complicated key to the last puzzle... asdfghjklpoiuytrewqmnbvcxz.... wtf??), but so far I think that Deaf Alien's explanation for the key at the bottom is the most likely... that the first block is ABC, and the last block is XYZ, and the idea of the game is to figure out what the pattern is to get the whole alphabet. However, I worked on it for about an hour and got frustrated and remembered my many wasted hours with the purple bars, so I'm more here for moral support than anything else.

Carry on, folks. Carry on.

reply to post by ragster

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I'm still not seeing the logic on why one of the letters in the 'legend' is considered 'bad'? Is it because it doesn't appear elsewhere in the puzzle, is it malformed in some way, or something else?

reply to post by Ian McLean

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yea it does not appear in the rest of the puzzle, I just always cancel unused symbols. I could be wrong

I like this idea as well but we have to be multidimensional in our approach at solving this puzzle. I've been working on trying to figure out the pattern as well, someone will eventually crack it.

Agreed.

As far as multidimensionallity goes, I was trying to edit a post of mine earlier to add a link, but for some reason it wouldn't show up. So let's try it HERE

So the idea I was going for was that the extra little triangle on the upper right corner of each symbol could be something like this, where, if you were to draw the shapes with a continuous line, you would need an extra angle outside of the normal shape in order to complete it (see the link if you don't understand). So I figured maybe part of the pattern has to do with the order you draw the lines in. I filled about 3 pages with little doodles of the different symbols, trying to figure out some sort of pattern to it, but I got absolutely nowhere. So, it's unlikely, but it is an idea.

[edit on 11-8-2008 by Wintermute]

Other thoughts:

As well as the one always-there triangle in each glyph (at the upper-right), there is another triangle (along the lower-left side) that is always there, except in one glyph (the fifth glyph in the third word).

Notice that no glyphs have all the triangles in them. Perhaps there's a 'cycle', in which the triangles within a single glyph can be rotated, that moves the 'always there' triangle inside the glyph, when applied a certain number of times (thus making a nice rectangle).

There's 8 possible triangles per glyph (not counting the always-on triangle); that's 256 combinations; there's only 26 alphabet letters, so if 3 of those triangles were to act as 'markers' (rotated to be the same in every glyph), the other 5 would yield 32 possible combinations, just enough for the alphabet.

Edit to add: hmm, the idea of a rotating cycle within a single glyph, to match a preset pattern on some triangles, would only apply a transform that's a subset of what a cryptogram translation could solve. So, if rotating cycles of triangles is the key, it would have to be between multiple glyphs...


[edit on 12-8-2008 by Ian McLean]

reply to post by Ian McLean

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yea the rotation.

the secret of the rotation of the glyphs and the cycle of triangles.

I have worked on the idea that the rotation of the triangle is important. And i thought perhaps the persistent triangle was the starting point of rotation. But i have yet to get anything useful from that idea,

i got the word GHOSTLINESS out of the top left series of symbols lol but i cant find anything in ATS on ghostliness surprisingly.

My eyes were freaking out a bit with all the triangles, so I made this:



Since triangles in a particular location always have the same orientation, it's the same as the original image (exact pixel placement aside).

Here is a PDF version (more resolution):
www.4shared.com...

I'm pretty sure it's accurate, but if someone could double-check it for me, I'd appreciate it.