Obama to ban the sale/transfer of ALL Semi-Automatic weapons., page 11
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 46 times


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 12:21 AM by seircram
Originally posted by Jenna
reply to post by salchanra


While I partially agree with you, I must say that having locks come with each gun purchase is not a bad idea. Just mandating that guns come with locks is not the same as saying you have to use the lock or that you have to prevent someone with no knowledge of gun safety from grabbing it and accidentally shooting you or themselves. Nothing wrong with making a lock readily available for those who don't want to chance children getting a hold of one though.


Almost all of the guns that I have purchased in the last few years have come with a "lock", however, most of them are pretty lame. I would bet that about 99% of them end up in the trash. So saying that a lock "must" be included with a gun sale (and as I said, most already are) is lame since the manufacturer is ALWAYS (at least in this paradigm) going to provide the cheapest lock or locking solution they can - thus meeting the letter of the law but in practicality, defeating the purpose.

And "finger print" locks may be fine, but how much will they add to the cost of a gun AND what has to happen when you sell, trade or give away your firearm? We already have the "magnetic ring" locks available and they are not widely used because of the obviously limitations (loose the ring, drop the ring, forgot the ring, etc.)

And yes, I totally agree that having gun locks or safes when children, or other non-gun educated adults or visitors, are present in a household is a must. And I would also say that most unintentional deaths, especially with children, are because they are not or have not been properly trained on the way to act around firearms, including the idea that "real guns are not toys and treat all real guns as if they are always loaded, etc."

Ultimately, pulling the trigger on a firearm OR pushing the red button that says, "Launch ALL nuclear missiles to start WW3" depends on the trust, integrity and spirituality of the person behind said trigger or button.

It's more likely that the anti gun people will try to do what they are trying to legislate now, make ammunition VERY EXPENSIVE with individual laser-etched serial numbers, etc.

Unfortunately, like most/all firearms laws of the past, an actual criminal would find it fairly easy to still get a gun or ammunition since they basically do not care about the laws. They will make it, steal it, or smuggle it in.

In my mind, the ONLY way gun control will work effectively on any planet is when there are ZERO guns available on that planet (or galaxy, etc.).

So I will try to get back to you in 2012 or there about. I am still wondering if 5th Dimensional beings enjoy any kind of target "shooting"...


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 12:29 AM by davion
Originally posted by Illahee
reply to post by davion


I take it you don't understand the power a President now has. He can enact by decree based on anti terror assessment.

Perhaps you should get out of high school before handing out the put downs?

Folks better get up to speed on the power the president now has. He does not need anything from the house or senate to enact his wishes.

It seems we heard all this same garbage when they said oh there will never be an assault weapons ban. You just wait and see what they tack on the end of it this time.....

[edit on 8-8-2008 by Illahee]


What proof do you have that he'd ban guns based on terrorism? Do you have a quote of him saying he'd do that? Or are you just making an assumption so you can continue on with your argument? Sounds like the last one to me. Just attempting to come up with the worst case scenario so you all can whine about it.

What happened to that assault weapons ban anyway, oh yeah it was voted down when an extension was attempted to be placed on it. There's also a recent one from 2008 that was made by a Republican that wants to extend the ban, why aren't you all foaming at the mouth about that, maybe because it's not a Democrat or something.

Besides, didn't gun manufacturers, during the ban, just change their weapons so they didn't fit within the ban? So why is everyone complaining? If they banned assault weapons again the gun manufacturers will just adapt to fit outside of the ban



reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 02:04 AM by Illahee
reply to post by davion


Try going back to page one and read it all the way through. I am not about to list a link of the presidents current abilities for anyone that can't read right here on dozens of threads about what he can and can't do let alone read the whole thread and associated links.

Principles that Obama supports on gun issues:

* Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons.
* Increase state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms.
* Require manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.

Its verified fact and he will lobby where he has to to get his way.

He is a traitor to America by subversion of the constitution and bill of rights.
Fact, and I am letting everyone know.

[edit on 9-8-2008 by Illahee]


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 03:12 AM by Illahee
Here are a few more facts....We know exactly who Obama is.


FACT: Barack Obama voted to allow reckless lawsuits designed to bankrupt the firearms industry.

FACT: Barack Obama wants to re-impose the failed and discredited Clinton Gun Ban.

FACT: Barack Obama voted to ban almost all rifle ammunition commonly used for hunting and sport shooting.

FACT: Barack Obama has endorsed a complete ban on handgun ownership.

FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.

FACT: Barack Obama voted to uphold local gun bans and the criminal prosecution of people who use firearms in self-defense.

FACT: Barack Obama supports requiring law-abiding gun owners to register their firearms.

FACT: Barack Obama refused to sign a friend-of-the-court brief in support of individual Second Amendment rights in the Heller case.

FACT: Barack Obama wants to eliminate your Right to Carry.

FACT: Barack Obama was a member of the Board of Directors of the Joyce Foundation, the leading source of funds for anti-gun organizations and “research.”

FACT: Barack Obama supported a proposal to ban gun stores within 5 miles of a school or park, which would eliminate almost every gun store in America.

FACT: Barack Obama voted not to notify gun owners when the state of Illinois did records searches on them.

FACT: Barack Obama voted against a measure to lower the Firearms Owners Identification card age minimum from 21 to 18, a measure designed to assist young people in the military.

FACT: Barack Obama favors a ban on standard capacity magazines.

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory micro-stamping.

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory waiting periods.

FACT: Barack Obama supports repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment, which prohibits information on gun traces collected by the BATFE from being used in reckless lawsuits against firearm dealers and manufacturers.

FACT: Barack Obama supports “one-gun-a-month” sales restrictions.

FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on inexpensive handguns.

FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on the resale of police issued firearms, even if the money is going to police departments for replacement equipment.

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory firearm training requirements for all gun owners and a ban on gun ownership for persons under the age of 21.


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 12:20 PM by davion
Originally posted by Illahee
reply to post by davion


Try going back to page one and read it all the way through. I am not about to list a link of the presidents current abilities for anyone that can't read right here on dozens of threads about what he can and can't do let alone read the whole thread and associated links.

Principles that Obama supports on gun issues:

* Ban the sale or transfer of all forms of semi-automatic weapons.
* Increase state restrictions on the purchase and possession of firearms.
* Require manufacturers to provide child-safety locks with firearms.

Its verified fact and he will lobby where he has to to get his way.

He is a traitor to America by subversion of the constitution and bill of rights.
Fact, and I am letting everyone know.

[edit on 9-8-2008 by Illahee]


I already read the whole thread, I just see a lot of whining and assumptions being thrown around because he has wanted more restrictions on fire arms.

Boohoo

And like I said, if a ban was put in place again, gun manufacturers will skirt around it, and you'll still be able to buy your precious little guns.


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 12:43 PM by Patriot207
reply to post by davion


I'm sure if it was the First amendment we were talking about you would be doing some "whining" about your "precious little freedom of speech"



reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 01:35 PM by Illahee
reply to post by davion


Elections are won on the issues and past performance in office. This Issue will be brought up during the election and he will face the gun owning majority.

As I said before NOT ONE person can deny Obama's history of anti gun voting and his own writing of gun ban bills.

He publicly said his stance on gun control has not changed. He recently said he is distancing himself from that issue. Just like dogsh** on the bottom of his shoe the stink of what he has done will be thrown in his face and he will answer regardless of how much distance he prefers.

Like it or not this is the set of deeds he has done that will cost him the election.

[edit on 9-8-2008 by Illahee]


reply posted on 9-8-2008 @ 11:48 PM by himself
Originally posted by Patriot207
After reading through this thread I thought I would clear up some misconceptions that Europeans and even some Americans have on how easy it is to buy a gun in the states.
...
Reading some posts would lead one to believe that a 13 year old can walk into a hardware store and walk out with a machine gun.

...

Good post on the process for LEGALLY buying a gun in the USA.
Thanks.......

This nation (USA) has tens of millions of black market guns available to anyone with cash.

Only law-abiding citizens can be disarmed by passing laws/btw

Drug dealers are a main source for illegal guns in the USA.
A 13yr old CAN ask a drug dealer for a gun and pay $50.00 for an old revolver or a hundred & up for a stolen 9mm or .45 auto
Likely a gun somebody took from daddy's closet and traded for drugs.

I personally got offered full auto Thompsons stolen from a NG armory for $175.00ea, and have been called by a local gun dealer to identify "what is it?" a German STG-44 assault rifle someone was trying to sell him without paperwork.
Both times I recommended a call to the BATF/btw

A guy sitting at the curb in a truck tried to sell me a WWII P-38 Walther two months ago.
No receipt? No sale!

Most gun shows, I sit outside and buy more cheaply from people planning to take guns inside and sell to dealers.

Last private purchase I asked a uniformed cop to check our ID and witness the purchase.*
Most Americans are not so picky and law abiding.


*Witnessed dated Bill-of-Sale,
documents when the gun changed possession, just in case it was/is ever involved in a crime.

Gun Control:
"No gun 'under my control' will ever be used to commit a crime."

---------edited to correct both spelling and syntax---------






[edit on 9-8-2008 by himself]


reply posted on 11-8-2008 @ 11:31 AM by salchanra
reply to post by djcloudy


CCW courses are fine. But the true problem I see with gun ownership is blantant fear of the unknown. People who have never handled a firearm or have been taught how to use and respect them only hear the mid stream news reports about how evil guns are. I would like to see firearm training taught in every public school in our nation. You want to end senseless gun violence and accidental killings, start teaching our children that guns arent to be feared, but must always be respected. We teach the 1st ammendment, the 5th, 13th, and 19th all the time, why has our nation forgotten to teach the 2nd and the 10th?



reply posted on 11-8-2008 @ 12:29 PM by ZindoDoone
reply to post by salchanra


When I went to school we had a fireing range in our school. Gun safety was taught in gym class. Then the socialists of the baby-boomer generation took over the NEA and all the ranges where closed and all shooting sports that you might refer to in converstation was deemed inappropriate and you where sent to counciling for antisocial behavior. Then, notations put on your permanent record! George Orwell would be proud!
Zindo


reply posted on 12-8-2008 @ 11:59 AM by Andrew E. Wiggin
Thats funny.

Because Obama's stance on gun control is quite the opposite of the non-sense the OP is trying to point out.

Barack Obama
Ok for states & cities to determine local gun laws. (Apr 2008)

Source


As a general principle, I believe that the Constitution confers an individual right to bear arms. But just because you have an individual right does not mean that the state or local government can't constrain the exercise of that right, in the same way that we have a right to private property but local governments can establish zoning ordinances that determine how you can use it.

Source


Yes. Personally he supports gun bans.
Profesionally he says leave it up to the states.

There's a big difference.

[edit on 8/12/2008 by Andrew E. Wiggin]


reply posted on 12-8-2008 @ 12:13 PM by salchanra
reply to post by Andrew E. Wiggin


And this is good? He thought that the DC gun ban was fine and legal, the big court told him he was wrong. If the US Constitution says its legal then it is across the nation, not just in areas where they want it to be. Whats next, Idaho saying free speech isnt legal, and NY saying no more freedom of religion? Because as an individual state, thats what they want?


reply posted on 12-8-2008 @ 01:24 PM by Andrew E. Wiggin
reply to post by salchanra


The freedom to own a firearm is confered to the militia of a state, as outlined in the constitution

you should be glad that the next president says we should leave it up to the states to decide.

because if we were to strictly enforce the rules set before us in the constitution its self, you'd have to belong to a well-organized militia in order to have a right to bare arms.

Compromise.
its what Obama offers.
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