Chemtrail / Contrail Experiment?

Here is an interesting bill introduced by Dennis Kucinich in 2001 BILL HR2977

SEC. 7. DEFINITIONS.

In this Act:

(1) The term `space' means all space extending upward from an altitude greater than 60 kilometers above the surface of the earth and any celestial body in such space.

(2)(A) The terms `weapon' and `weapons system' mean a device capable of any of the following:

(i) Damaging or destroying an object (whether in outer space, in the atmosphere, or on earth) by--

(I) firing one or more projectiles to collide with that object;

(II) detonating one or more explosive devices in close proximity to that object;

(III) directing a source of energy (including molecular or atomic energy, subatomic particle beams, electromagnetic radiation, plasma, or extremely low frequency (ELF) or ultra low frequency (ULF) energy radiation) against that object; or

(IV) any other unacknowledged or as yet undeveloped means.

(ii) Inflicting death or injury on, or damaging or destroying, a person (or the biological life, bodily health, mental health, or physical and economic well-being of a person)--

(I) through the use of any of the means described in clause (i) or subparagraph (B);

(II) through the use of land-based, sea-based, or space-based systems using radiation, electromagnetic, psychotronic, sonic, laser, or other energies directed at individual persons or targeted populations for the purpose of information war, mood management, or mind control of such persons or populations; or

(III) by expelling chemical or biological agents in the vicinity of a person.

(B) Such terms include exotic weapons systems such as--

(i) electronic, psychotronic, or information weapons;

(ii) chemtrails;

(iii) high altitude ultra low frequency weapons systems;

(iv) plasma, electromagnetic, sonic, or ultrasonic weapons;

(v) laser weapons systems;

(vi) strategic, theater, tactical, or extraterrestrial weapons; and

(vii) chemical, biological, environmental, climate, or tectonic weapons.

(C) The term `exotic weapons systems' includes weapons designed to damage space or natural ecosystems (such as the ionosphere and upper atmosphere) or climate, weather, and tectonic systems with the purpose of inducing damage or destruction upon a target population or region on earth or in space..

[edit on 2-8-2008 by Swingarm]

reply to post by Swingarm


Let me guess, it didn't go through?
Why not?
Don't we need to be protected from deadly weapons aimed at citizens?
At least Kucinich TRIED to pre-empt the use of weapons of mass destruction.

reply to post by OzWeatherman


Maybe you could help, by getting a sample of aircraft traffic emissions.
We could pool money together to get it tested.

But, that would ONLY be over Australia.

reply to post by Clearskies


Here are a few more links.

www.californiaskywatch.com...



www.dontchemtrailmebro.com...


nl.youtube.com...

Originally posted by davidifty

I cant definately prove chemtrails exist but you can prove they dont!

But can you prove that any of the pictures people take of alleged chemtrails are chemtrails? That's the billion dollar question

If it looks like a contrail and acts like a contrail why are you so sure it's not a contrail?

Originally posted by Clearskies
There are TWO factories in our county. When I called the Atlanta EPA, in '05, they told me their sensors didn't show anything from them!
I told them something is wrong with their sensors.

The pictures who posted show contrails and normal clouds. But in any case, here in the UK - for example - we often experience low level pollution haze from Europe. Depending on weather conditions, you need may well need to look hundreds of miles away. A big forest fire can affect atmosphere conditions thousands of miles away ....

Originally posted by Swingarm
Here is an interesting bill introduced by Dennis Kucinich in 2001 [url=http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c107:H.R.2977.IH:]BILL HR2977

On behalf of a group who wanted to prevent the US from shooting down space aliens. The Bill was rejected and subsequently revised without mention of the various made up weapons.And again rejected. Twice. It was consigned to the dustbin years ago.

Besides which, where does it say that Chemtrails are visible and masquerade as contrails?

Non sequiter reasoning will not prove anything

reply to post by davidifty


david, these chemtrail threads pop up every few months....there seems to be a grave mis-understanding about aviation and meteorology, just to name two areas.

I'll add by saying I have flown commercial jetliners for nearly 22 years. I have a pretty good knowledge of what can and cannot be "sprayed" by passenger jets.

Now, all I'm saying is: Passenger jets do not and cannot "spray" these alleged chemicals...besides, it would be pointless, as others will no doubt point out. However, IF (big IF) there is a military program, using military aircraft, then we'll likely never know. Problem is, again, 'spraying' anything from altitudes above 30,000 feet is about like throwing a cup of bleach into a lake. First, it is insufficient quantity compared to the volume of the water (or air, in the case of atmospheric 'spraying') and second, there is no way to control whatever you 'dump'...way too many variables.

Just sit back, and contemplate for a few minutes, and you will begin to see that this 'chemtrail' stuff is inappropriate paranoia. Governments can certainly poison us more effectively and efficiently if they wished to.

What air sensor system are you using, Clearskies?

I can't say chemtrails don't exist, but looking at the photographs with the supposed chemtrails, all I see is... normal contrails. Not many people seem to know that clouds are very likely to form around contrails, making them last for the whole day.

I still haven't seen a picture showing anything other than contrails - believe it or not, airplanes fly very often. Their paths intersect, forming X's and other letters

[edit on 2/8/2008 by relu84]

OP, there are plenty of people on this board who are interested in discussing chemtrails-if those who are trying to argue you to death saying you're wrong -"I'm an expert this blah blah"-just know that I've had the same tired arguements with them and they proved nothing to me. Take careful note that they are the exact same people every time...what else do they ever post about?? It is their reason for being presumably.

Try the ignore button.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Pilot


Pilot, seems your remarks might likely have been directed toward me, besides others. If you took even the slightest interest, you'd see that in my case, at least, I comment on a variety of subjects.

Of course, you're certainly welcome to your opinions, however skewed they might be.

We'll let others decide, based on ALL contributions. Of course, ignoring simply contributes to 'denying knowledge'. Your choice.

Keep reading, thanks for your posts.

reply to post by weedwhacker


Hey i hope you aint whacking any weed when fyling your planes

Thanks for you expertise.

I thought it was worthy of a question. I figured trying to measure contents of our air or rain may incline the argument may carry some weight. I seems to be more difficult than first thought.

As the thread is titled the whole point is to try and find further evidence or ways to find that evidence and bring it to the boards to discuss.

Obviously we cant do that with photos.

[edit on 2-8-2008 by davidifty]

reply to post by weedwhacker


Why are you thanking me for my posts? Are you some kind of Majordomo for this thread now??

Well, I appreciate your graciousness in all it's sincerity. You see, you are not on my ignore list.

No matter what, all you and the OTHERS do is regurgitate the same old script and it is boring. Maybe you can fascinate the unfamiliar , but I am not missing any new information, I've heard your arguments, gave them a very fair hearing and decided I did not agree.

I would rather discuss the topic with people who are still looking for answers, instead of those who think they have them.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman

Originally posted by davidifty
What about the object in pics 4,5,6 - any ideas what that maybe?

Hard to say what it is without being there and observing it, but my guess is that it is a lenticular cloud (altocumulus lenticularis). They are often saucer shaped and build on top of each other like picture 6 shows. They are often posted here and claimed to be UFO's. They are also a good indication that their is turbulence in the atmosphere and often occur near mountainous regiones, although they are not exclusively confined to those areas. If its not that it is most probably a pileus cloud (check the last link)

They don't strike me as weather phenomena at all since:

1) They appear identical in shape and relative intensity but one to the right of the pair is a more "translucent" copy of the other.

2) Same basic position in the photos with completely different cloud patterns around it.

3) In 4 and 5 - no leaves on the trees.

4) In 6 - leaves on the trees. Those clouds sure persist.

5) As far as I can see-- taken from indoors.

My best guess is a reflection of an overhead lamp inside the room. Two images because the glass is dual-pane. The reflection from the outer pane is weaker. Heck, it even looks like a floodlight. Sound reasonable?

I know there are folks that will say ' perfectly normal contrail ' nothing to see here move along.My question is, if they are par for our skies why the fuss. If they have always been here no one would notice. I am 61 and have been watching the sky for about 50 of those years. Always wanted to be an airline pilot so I would frequently be looking up. Finally did get to fly for a couple of years. Unless there has been some type of dramatic climate change, I really can not view them as 'normal'. It seems like they have only been obvious the past several years. Just my observation, but I will never buy the average contrail story. Hell, if this is the official government explanation ( contrail )it is already highly suspect.

They are Just Normal Contrails?!!!!

Are you blind? Or are you 9 years old and that is the only kind of sky you have ever known. I am 38 years old and I can vividly remember what the sky used to look like 10 years ago. There were few to no persistent residual jet contrails. The contrails dissipated. The contrails used to dissipate. Have you all taken in so much fluoride that you can not remember what a a sunny day with a dark blue sky looked like? Do you not remember when even on non windy days you used to be able to see the clouds shift and billow and change shape?

I have been studying persistent residual jet contrails here in Chicagoland for two years. Observing outside for hours at a time, watching "them" lay down trails and watching what happens after the grid is laid. Here is what I observed.

1. Large white jets flying higher than regularly scheduled OHare and Midway traffic lay parrallel and intersecting lines usually east to west or North east to southwest. Many east -west parrallell lines with a few strategic intersecting lines to form "X's".

2. After the grid is laid the large white planes will not be observed any more that day. Although regular Chicago air traffic remains on a regular schedule daily.

3. The grid pattern of the residual persistent contrail will begin to spread out in the sky, but not dissipate. It will collect moisture and a thin stoic cloud will begin to form. The cloudcover will begin most notably in the center of the "x" and then after 2-4 hours spread out to created a dull hazy cirrus cloud that is stiff and unchanging.

4. The weather bureau will forecast a sunny day, but if these jets lay down trails it will become cloudy and hazy.

Thankfully we have had far fewer chemtrails this summer than last and the weather has been great for us. Last summer we had daily chemtrail laying and drought like conditions.

Sampling the chemtrials:

1> Snow: The most dramatic sampling I have read about online is from an observer in Colorado who samples the snow. She analyizes it under a microscope and has found nanotech devices in the snow.

2>Air Filter: I have heard of people putting an air filter outside and sending it to a lab for analysis and they found very high barium and alluminum.

3>rain collection: very easy to do and vary easy to send to a lab. Only $20-$30 a test.

reply to post by weedwhacker


As I have pointed out to you before, you're wrong about the inexistance of chemtrails, I have seen a very obvious instance of this being done, and I am at a location where it is more or less unambiguous. Plus I confirmed it with the local international airport, two airframes were in the holding pattern for a few hours, then left.

Atmospheric spraying, for whatever reason and with whatever substances is a reality, and this can be equated to the term chemtrails, as chemicals are being left in the contrails, and this is reality no matter how much you see yourself as it's debunker.

We are under some form of tyranny in the skies, not just on the ground, and people in the industry need to get out of their slumber and report what's really going on.

To end on a positive note though, at least here I have never recalled seing such a green summer, so plants at least seem to be thriving. I bet it's the high CO2 levels we're paying taxes for. Damn, there went my positive note

reply to post by EnlightenUp


I made a fool of myself earlier today - www.abovetopsecret.com...

A genuine oversight

Originally posted by Xwino
if this is the official government explanation ( contrail )it is already highly suspect.

I have no idea whether the government even have an explanation. But it's been common knowledge amongst meteorologists for over half a decade.

As someone who wanted to be a pliot I'm surprised you weren't aware?


Anyway, the point of this thread was to discuss ways of finding our if chemtrails exist. So, does anyone have any realistic ideas other than photographing contrails?

Originally posted by Zepherian

As I have pointed out to you before, you're wrong about the inexistance of chemtrails

Chemtrails may exist. But no-one has yet provided any evidence.

Saying you've seen contrails and didn't notice them years ago is [n]not evidence.

btw anyone ever buy a car and then suddenly noticed loads of the same model on the streets that they'd not noticed before? The cars were there - you just never registered them because you had no reason for doing so before. Same with contrails.

We know they've been around for decades because there are hundreds of accounts and photos of them - and as a general rule, scientists don't spend years studying things that don't exist

Atmospheric spraying, for whatever reason and with whatever substances is a reality

So where is the evidence?

Repeating something time and time again doesn't make it become reality no matter what Terry Pratchett might suggest.


[edit on 2-8-2008 by Essan]

reply to post by Essan


I don't have evidence to prove it to you, but I did prove it to myself. I saw them laying down the contrails in a pattern and I confirmed they were not normal jets in a holding pattern because I know people at the local airport and got it confirmed with ATC. And I watched the contrails for a few hours develop into cloud cover and then rain.

Had I setup a time lapse photography session I could have proven it to the world, it was that unambiguous.

Besides, asking for proof when hundreds if not thousands, if not millions of people are talking about this seems to be an attempt to sidestep the issue and give it a degree of uncertainty which is far higher than the reality of the situation would suggest.

I tell you as a first hand witness, they are real. Even if they are only climate manipulation I am pretty sure, as with almost everything big science comes up with, there will be undesired and nefarious consequences.

reply to post by Essan


Chemtrails are an interesting thing for debunkers. It's an easy way to elevate your master debunker mentality. I think it's a big part of why so many come to these threads and scoff at the people who are participating and trying to actually share what little info is really available on the subject. I too rejected chemtrails initially. The aluminum particulate that apparently is produced from chemtrails still doesn't make sense to me, and I'm not sure I believe chemtrails produce aluminum.

It is interesting however that morgellans is apparently linked to chemtrails but is looked on as an imaginary disease. there is allot of crazy sh!t going on in the world there is no denying that. Check out this Link for the whys.
I have been around for quite a few years an never remember "contrails" going from one horizon to the other without dissipating. then hanging there for hours Do You? I feel There really is something to this, and guess what, I don't even believe in planet X

[edit on 2-8-2008 by Swingarm]