Science Proving 'Global Flood Myth' true - Dating for Prehistoric Civilization Legitimized!

reply to post by Hanslune


Bad Astronomy is not my kind of place.

However, i only bring up sublimation as an example.

reply to post by Hanslune


I saw this when it aired: www.pbs.org... and in this documentary, researchers modeled the sort of impact that would have been responsible for the extinction of large mammals in North America during that time... without leaving an impact crater.

Here's where you can see the program in segments: www.pbs.org...

[edit on 8-4-2009 by X-tal_Phusion]

there are too many occurences of a great flood happening when looking at the mythos of many cultures... And I don't buy the theory about this simply being a story that spread from culture to culture, with the original story creator being affected by a great flood, either global or regional.

It seems as if many debunkers simply like to create a counter-story that in their mind seems more logical, when in fact their "theory" of what really happened is often no better or credible than the original story. They demand proof where it is not even possible to obtain, yet never offer proof to back theyre claims of it being untrue.

I say prove to me its NOT true!!

I understand that its good to ponder all things with a degree of skepticism, but some people seem to do it from an imagined position of great intelligence, to serve their own ends, or simply to go against the grain. Either way, it usually says alot about their personality

New studies are in on this subject

This post based on one by Paul H at the Hall of Ma'at

North America comet theory questioned. No evidence of an extraterrestrial impact 13,000 years ago, studies say by Rex Dalton, Nature News, Published

The article

The paper is here:

The paper

Surovell, T. A., V. T. Holliday, J. A. M. Gingerich, C. Ketron, C. Vance
Haynes, Jr., I. Hilman, D. P. Wagner, E. Johnson, and P. Claeyse. 2009,
An independent evaluation of the Younger Dryas extraterrestrial impact
hypothesis. Published online before print October 12, 2009

More studies as I understand it are underway. As I have noted before it will take another 10-15 years of studies to get a handle on what happened. If we're lucky a clear picture will emerge or if the picture is unclear and we have contradictory data we're be unlucky and the debate will go on forever.....well at least until the event to find it is found.

Surovell's co-author Vance Holliday, an archaeologist at the University of Arizona in Tucson, and his colleagues have an article in press at Current Anthropology that says the archaeological and geochronological records don't support a collapse of Clovis people at the time of the purported impact.

I'd suggest reading both the article and paper.

reply to post by Hanslune


Hi hans


I'll see your paper and raise you this paper

Shock-synthesized hexagonal diamonds in Younger Dryas boundary sediments
Douglas J. Kennetta,1, James P. Kennettb, Allen Westc, G. James Westd, Ted E. Bunche, Brendan J. Culletona, Jon M. Erlandsona,f, Shane S. Que Heeg, John R. Johnsonh, Chris Merceri,j, Feng Shenk, Marilee Sellerse, Thomas W. Stafford, Jrl, Adrienne Stichm, James C. Weavern, James H. Wittkee and Wendy S. Wolbachm

The long-standing controversy regarding the late Pleistocene megafaunal extinctions in North America has been invigorated by a hypothesis implicating a cosmic impact at the Ållerød-Younger Dryas boundary or YDB (≈12,900 ± 100 cal BP or 10,900 ± 100 14C years). Abrupt ecosystem disruption caused by this event may have triggered the megafaunal extinctions, along with reductions in other animal populations, including humans. The hypothesis remains controversial due to absence of shocked minerals, tektites, and impact craters. Here, we report the presence of shock-synthesized hexagonal nanodiamonds (lonsdaleite) in YDB sediments dating to ≈12,950 ± 50 cal BP at Arlington Canyon, Santa Rosa Island, California. Lonsdaleite is known on Earth only in meteorites and impact craters, and its presence strongly supports a cosmic impact event, further strengthened by its co-occurrence with other nanometer-sized diamond polymorphs (n-diamonds and cubics). These shock-synthesized diamonds are also associated with proxies indicating major biomass burning (charcoal, carbon spherules, and soot). This biomass burning at the Younger Dryas (YD) onset is regional in extent, based on evidence from adjacent Santa Barbara Basin and coeval with broader continent-wide biomass burning. Biomass burning also coincides with abrupt sediment mass wasting and ecological disruption and the last known occurrence of pygmy mammoths (Mammuthus exilis) on the Channel Islands, correlating with broader animal extinctions throughout North America. The only previously known co-occurrence of nanodiamonds, soot, and extinction is the Cretaceous-Tertiary (K/T) impact layer. These data are consistent with abrupt ecosystem change and megafaunal extinction possibly triggered by a cosmic impact over North America at ≈12,900 ± 100 cal BP.

www.pnas.org...



eventually people will accept that it happened,

But it wasnt a biblical global deluge.

My stance as usual some where in the middle.

Its my position that the biblical flood is a composite of two events widely separated by time.
There is a dim memory of the flooding of the black sea basin some 9k? years ago and a much newer event some 4-1/2k years ago. This is the event referenced in contemporary mesopotamian records.
There is burgoening evidence that there was yet another heavenly interloper in the affairs of man, the possible object that left burckle crater in the indian ocean.

As in this thread
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Like was mentioned inthat thread this was not the same flood referenced by the native americans.
But the floods referenced by the native americans were all the same flood either.
some were a memory of the devastating glacial lake break outs.
Some are of other large but local floods. And some are rememberences of thr great melt off caused by the younger dryas impact.

New article on status of the clovis comet theory

Link

reply to post by Hanslune


Very interesting link that anyone who has followed this thread should read.

I am sure more will come out of this.

reply to post by TheWayISeeIt


I am Grateful for your thread Science has long ago proven the vast change in sea temperature the Lovely Graphs here and my Thread debunking AGW (Anthropogenic Global Warming(Climate Change))
Heres Proof Global Warming(Climate Change) Is a Fraud


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/2b4d86b570fb.png[/atsimg]

I will be greatly interested in reading and discussing and partaking in your thread my fine sirs...!!!!!!

I've always loved the Cuban purported discover of an underwater city thing i remember first hearing about this from Graham Hancock i think.


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5f7b8d716878.gif[/atsimg]
Graph is easier to see once you tip it upside-down
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/747a2df85958.jpg[/atsimg]

reply to post by XRaDiiX


Sadly, TWISI has forsaken us. LOL...she dropped off about a year and a half ago. I wish she would return, though.

I've found this idea to be interesting even to the point of getting the book, alas it appears as my earlier skepticism was justified. However its a good example of how egos can twist science and also how science, fortunately, slowly corrects itself.

Sorry to hear that Twisi isn't about anymore

Good to read ya Big furry

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


That sucks i guess the rest of us can still partake in this discussion the notion of it is just fascinating.

The fact that the Sea Level was much lower at the time gives much credence to this theory too.

Perhaps the Natives Americans and/or South Americans Did have a big Civilization down there and a great flood wiped them out....

Can't wait until they find some more information about this and someone else finds the funds to do some research down there.

reply to post by Hanslune


it is always glad to read you, hans.

I am sure TWISI will turn up again some day.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Hanslune

 

it is always glad to read you, hans.

I am sure TWISI will turn up again some day.

Hey Bigfatfurrytexan, there was a great flood because of all the legends from people around the world (wiki flood myth). I came across that when I first started to comment on this site a few years ago. Your comment about the water causing parts of a continent to move up or down is correct and I didn't think about it until I googled the weight of 1 cubic meter of water. And it weighs 1,000 kilograms at 4 degrees celsius, and they say that the temperature is important because density of water is effected by temperature and this temperature is water at it's densest. And at one thousand kilograms that brings it to a little over 1 ton or 2,204.6 pounds. That isn't alot of water when you look at it, but it still weighs alot. And if you add on that the same size of soil weighs 1.5 tons (give or take the moisture content).

So look at the last Ice Age, at where New York City is the ice was 1 mile thick and if you went further north into northern Canada, it was 2 miles thick. This made the oceans 100 to 150 meters lower than today (but I think the oceans where closer to 250 to 400 meters lower, thats just to much water that is trapped and also the effect of evaporation). So while the rest of the planet had areas and places that where very much dry lands until the flood and/or archapeligos (like greece) and there was no seaway between Iran and Saudi Arabia at this time (You can find a good sea simulator online that will allow you to lower and raise the sea level). Once the ice age started to warm up, the ice melted and water (specifically fresh water started to flood into lands). But what caused much of the great flood (not all people had it happen at once some may have had water rising a decade before etc., but most had it happen at one time), was from the ice dams. One happened in the upper plain states, what happens is that while the ice melts, it not only start to flow into other areas but also into ice lakes that are on the surface of the ice sheets and also ice caverns inside the ice sheets. So as the decades continue and centuries this water continues to build and build and build to the point that it may have a few oceans of freash water sitting inside and on top of the super ice sheets. Then one day the ice dam/wall breaks and the water flows out and like any dam that breaks the water quickly makes the open larger and larger until the massive amout of water is flowing out.

Heck there where some small ones and large ones and super big breakouts that may have happened more than once, but just imagine what I said about how big those ice sheets where. Imagine 1/2 mile deep and 200 mile wide and 300 mile long (being very conservative it may have been alot bigger) of fresh water is trapped behind a glacial wall that is breaking all at once. That water hitting an ocean or sea would cause a massive tsunami of water to form from the introduction of the water pushing the sea forward. And then you will have to contend with the massive amount of weight that is put on the land in front of the water that is filling up the basin and the weight leaving the cavity/land/ice shelf. One side would move up (don't know by how much but it would) and the other side would go down. Just this alone could cause a ripple affect of earthquakes to happen (big ones) across the planet and definitely cause some volcanoes to erupt from the compression and the decompression of the landmasses from the weight distribution.

It's hard for us to imagine a landmass to move up lets say 900 feet (I believe that the water lakes could have been as large as 2,000 miles both direction and at least 1/2 mile deep all of a sudden just emptying into the ocean basin). Everyone has been schooled to believe that geological activity takes eons and epochs to happen, but yet we see as an example from the 70's Mount Saint Helens blowing it's top off and half the volcano sloughing off, quickly. And then these massive earthquakes cause other ice dams to break etc.. And I don't even take into account what would happen to the planet with all the earthquakes and the massive amounts of water weight being sloshed back and forth into the ocean. Would it move the axis a little or alot, after the Japan quake, it did effect the axis. I think their was an advanced planet spanning civilization during the Ice age, and once this horrible effent happened it caused a new dark ages and survivors of this planet spanning civilization and what was left of the old world tried to start the world back up via what was left and what they knew. These individuals may have been the helpers to the egyptians, and other civilizations we know today (Olmecs, I think part of the secret is with the Olmecs of central and south america)

Most civilizations tend to be by a large body of water or river, and with the flooding happening most of this old world and cities are underwater either off shore a few miles or underwater where land used to be and then the ocean came back to claim it. Like I said, once I figured out the weight of water it hit me that this massive weight moving quickly could have easily caused earthquakes and filled areas quickly.

wiki.answers.com...

reply to post by hoghead cheese


Yup. That pretty much sums up my premise.

However, you really should read the link posted by Hanslune. That article doesn't effect our conversation on what water masses would do to continental plates, but it does call into serious question the Younger Dryas Comet Theory.

I suspect this question will play out for another 10-15 years as research looks into the various aspects of this interesting phase in earth's history. I would speculate that we will probably have a much more specific picture of about 2025, not definitely what happened but a framework to flesh out with later research.

Originally posted by Hanslune
New article on status of the clovis comet theory

Link

Not a real surprise -- as I think I mentioned, I talked this over with paleontologists and the evidence simply didn't match up with the bones. Nor were the Clovis people suddenly extinct (as mentioned) -- they had to change their technology because hunting rabbits with a spearpoint the size of your hand simply doesn't work. Too slow, too much damage.