Originally posted by Pumcy
You guys all need to read more about the situation. Everyone here that claimed no one tried to help is just plain wrong.
[edit on 31-7-2008 by Pumcy]

I have to agree with your post.
Had I been on that bus with my 4 year old son, I would have grabbed my kid and got the hell off that bus, or as far away from the attacker as possible faster than anyone has ever seen. No doubt whatsoever about that. Hopefully my wife would have been able to keep up. LOL.

But seriously....

It's real easy to say we are going to do something, but when it hits the fan, who knows what the reaction or instinct will be.

If you were a combat experienced soldier, or police officer or someone with training and constant experience that is one thing.
I mean your sitting there, reading a book, daydreaming out the window etc.. in a stable environment and country, no distresses or fears of violence and out of nowhere with even an inkling of a warning this sh*t happens! Throat shots with a large survival knife, the victim was probably past the point of no return within 10 seconds.
By that time you've just gotten over the initial shock and realized you've crapped yourself.

It's just hard to say how an average, non trained person would react in that situation, even trained. It's not like it was in a combat zone and your mind is on full alert.
I've had shocking situations where I instantly reacted in the wrong way, or wimped out. I've also had shocking situations where I have reacted correctly and positive far beyond what I thought capable.

There should be no debate whatsoever on this killer's fate. He needs a bullet in the head, now.
Case closed.
I wouldn't waste 2 seconds, or the effort to formally arrest\incarcerate this loon. Execute him.

This was the worst thing I'd watched on the news for a very long time. Something that doesn't happen. And the victim was between 18-22. I just kept thinking of my son. I also thought, if they're really trying to force people into microchips and even greater surveillance, wouldn't ever more increasing crimes like this keep happening? We have gun control in Canada, we cannot simply arm ourselves. And for most, the weapons would be used against them anyway. I thought of a Montauk boy, or some kind of MC. They just had a piece on ctv news a while ago about the transit system, and how there was security cameras, but everyone vulnerable as soon as they left the station. They kept restating it with emphasis. My suspicions were raised at the time, and I actually wrote them that I felt it was an odd report, and if this was some kind of push to a solution, ie. chipping us, that no, that would not be necessary. That was the skytrain, I think.

I dunno. I think everybody has impulses and evil thoughts, but, most of us maintain a control over such thoughts and a fair amount of conscience to aid us.
I own swords. LOTS of swords. Swords were created pretty much with one thing in mind-to kill a fellow human being. I have, while weilding many of my blades, wondered what it would be like to push it through someone. Big duh there, right? But, my wonderings are never actually pondered as something that would ever happen. I automatically dismiss it as "wrong" and I move on. But, I have pictured it.
My lady Gigi confessed to me one day after coming home from work that during her day, she was in the kitchen (at work), about to make a cup of tea and, while waiting for a co-worker to finish what she was doing, wondered to herself- What would happen if i just smashed this cup over so-and-so's head? She then realized she was kinda standing there all "off in space" as a stereotypical daydreamer would be. She thought What am I thinking? and snapped out of it.

The point I am making is that I can only speak for me and I am responsable for my own thoughts and actions....but is everyone? All the time? Can you guarantee I won't listen to the thoughts and not realize until after I do something horrible?
There are people who just can't stop from acting out the things their mind conjures up. I'm sure more than one unstable person has ridden public transportation and didn't "switch" on or off. But, this guy did.
Interestingly, it goes with my earlier assumption that it is Mind Control/Demonic Possession. I tend to believe they might go hand-in-hand more often than not. Essentially, in my view, Mind Control is, essentially, putting key elements together to 1) Erase your ability to repress such evil urges and 2) Implanting the image you want to trigger a reaction to. (IMO)

Meh, a little of column A, a little of column B. I do want to hear more about this guy. It does go very strangely with VTech and the Illinois college shootings, et al.

Cuhail

Okay... I should not have read this story right before going to bed... I can't imagine how horrible it would be to be 4 or 5 and witness something like that. Definitely psychologically traumatizing.

Originally posted by LeeHawt
I'm not so disturbed by the decapitation itself, I'm more disturbed by the people on the bus not helping, what a bunch of jerks I hope it haunts there minds till the day they die.

bigdog36 worded it best.

When you're on a bus, you're not in full-alert combat mode. If you heard a blood-curtling scream and saw someone being stabbed to death by a maniac, I'm 100% sure you would not run TOWARD the scene. You may say you would now, but when you're put in that sort of situation, who knows what your body's natural reaction would be?

And it is going to haunt them until the day they die. And no they don't deserve it.

The scariest thing about this is the random nature of it all. In how many instances am I vulnerable to an attack were some random stranger inclined to attack me. I'm paranoid as it is, I'm always watching people closely thinking about a scenario like this, damnit, this doesn't help.

As for people helping, no one was armed untill after they got off the bus at which point they did try but he was allready dead. I would like to think I would try something and I always have a good sized knife clipped to my waist, if their were opportunity sure but in this situation in tight spaces and only a small isle to maneuver in it's a no go, you would have to be behind him to do any good but he was in the very back corner and going head on towards a combat knife that large is a very bad idea.

It's unfortunate but the guy was as good as dead as soon as the guy attacked.

Horrible. Can't believe it.
This place is about 6 hours from me, so news spread fast on the street of what happened from a few truckers on route to my town who were there.
The bus driver flagged down the truckers for some help and protection while the passengers hide in the ditch. The bus driver locked the guy inside and turned the power off to the bus so he couldnt get away.

This very disturbed individual should have gotten some crowbars to the head that the truckers were holding onto while the cops were coming.

The poor victim was sleeping with an ipod, head tilted over with his neck exposed.
you know the rest, I'm not gonna go into more details, too shocking.

Originally posted by deadboi
I agree this is horrible and disgusting.

Caton described the attacker as surprisingly calm. "It was like he was at the beach or something. There was no rage in him. He wasn't swearing or cursing or anything. It was just like he was a robot or something."
...
Caton described the attacker as appearing "totally normal" earlier in the journey, even chatting with a young woman as he smoked a cigarette during a break.

If this had been revenge or a personal attack you would think he would be showing some kind of emotion. My guess is that he was seriously whacked of out of his mind on drugs. Possibly the cigarette was laced with something?

I don't know, but that guy sounds totally white to me, sience we are talking about race. And yes, I am white.

I am also five foot seven, one hundred eighty pounds.
So if I were on a bus and had to tangle with a guy that was six foot three, two hundred forty pounds, and perfectly capable of (ripping) off my head, I want my knife.
So no metal detectors.

Taser guns for Bus drivers, I am o.k. with.

[edit on 1-8-2008 by president]

Originally posted by nirbid
why waste your life for a deadly wounded person? he was stabbed in the throat multiple times with a big knive. what whould you accomplish if you survive the confrontation with the armed madman? the best outcome for the victim would be suffocation by his own blood. I'd rather help the other ppl to leave the bus asap and isolate the bastard, which is probably what they did.

Well we don't know precisely where he received the first few stab wounds, we only know that later the killer focused on the guys' neck, removing the head.

The first few stabs could've well been in the shoulder, the face, the chest, etc. Side angle stabbing, naturally the stabbed person will turn his back and right half in a circular manner to turn his back to the attacker while facing the window and scrunch up, protecting his organs somewhat better in theory, if the stabs aren't too deep. It's a natural reaction.

I know anyone can say coulda, shoulda, woulda .. but .. this boy could've lived had he knew some true self defense techniques, of the chinese persuasion. Particularly, the two most underrated attacks: pierce to the eyes, punch or pierce to the throat. Either of which causes a natural reaction in a human, an instinctual reaction that adrenaline cannot compensate for the extreme pain. Anyone poked in the eye or punched/chopped in the neck will instinctually scream in pain and stop what they're doing to cover the affected eye with a hand. It's instinct .. when you get accidently poked in the eye, you just have to put your hand on it and cover it for some reason don't you? Also, if you can suddenly no longer breathe, you'll also stop what you're doing, even in a crazed adrenaline state. You need breathe to function, and again .. this primal thing overrides aggressive action.

I've seen a 6 foot 3, 250lb, all muscle african american martial artist circuit brawler (competition fights) get "accidently" poked in the eye by someone trying to block an incoming punch from the guy, and the guy instantly jumps back like 3 feet holding his face and falls to the floor, screaming in pain, and the fight is stopped. 5 minutes later, his eye was swollen shut and likely stayed that way until days later. So don't tell me it doesnt work. You have to practice every day, for years .. devote your life to it.

Anyways, yes this is terrible. Fortunately the guy likely died before the crazy removed his head. But had I been there, if it looked feasible, I would've ran up onto the killer, whos back must've been faced to the aisle of the bus if hes turned inward stabbing this guy inside the seat, and simply stuffed my index fingers right into both of his eye sockets, then go immediately into a choke/arm lock combination hold, which is simple .. its just a choke from behind with the person's right arm wrapped up by my other arm, the hand of which holds onto the wrist of the other arm which is choking the guy out. So this is how it is held in place, disabling the arm and also choking the person at the same time. And all his body would be wanting to do in that moment is hold his hands over his eyes, trust me, anyone who has been poked good in the eyeball knows exactly the instinct im talking about. This instinct could override mind control even? maybe?

Okay, I'm posting today with a clearer mind. I try to live My life as honest and as non judgemental as possible and I need to apologize for judging these people so harshly. It was wrong of Me to accuse them of being cowards when I have no idea the terror they endured. I'm completely horrified over this situation and My mind has a hard time wrapping around it so it was easy for Me to get defensive and state 'what I would do.' My condolences go out to the family of this young man and My sympathies to the bus riders as well.

Peace. K*

The plain truth is this.......

You CAN NOT prevent every attack by a lunatic. We have metal detectors, security officers, CCTV, and so on in our schools, libraries, museums, airports et al and random attacks still happen. You can't allow yourself to afraid of every sound and shadow, because paranoia breeds more violence in the form of "I'll get them before they get me".

A random attack is just that, random. It does not mean that it will happen with predictable regularity in a certain place at a certain time of day so that you can avoid it.

I pray for these victims of violence, but realise that it COULD happen to me, and I may not be able to do anything to stop it. Fate does not disclose it's plans.

[edit on 1-8-2008 by Nowalive]