Ladies and Gents, is Chivalry dead....or not wanted?

I am posting this because of something that happened the other day that really made me want to bash my head up against a wall

I was just going round to my local corner store to get some ice coffee (*drool), as I was entering the store door, a woman was entering in behind me. So as you do for anyone regardless of gender, I held the door open for her as she followed me in. What happened next was unexpected.

She just let loose on me calling me a pig and a woman hater, carrying on about me thinking women are the weaker sex....etc. I was sort of dumfounded, and I didnt really know what to say, so I just walked away shaking my head and totally embaressed. Im just glad the store was empty apart from the cashier

So ladies, is chivalry dead...shall we not open doors for you, or let you have a seat on the train or help you get prams of the bus (if you are having trouble of course)? Or should we keep doing these things?

Im totally confused, normally I would help anyone who needs it in public lady, man, elderly, young..whatever. But after this I am rethinking about doing any of this stuff again

Thoughts everyone? Any guys had a similar experience?

Personally, I think feminists are going a little too far with their tirade. Personally, if she was in front of me, I'd expect her to hold the door open for me. It's just common decency, not "chivalry" or whatnot. Personally, I think she needs a severe smack from reality.

I'm a good 'ole Suthern boy, and my mammy taught me that you don't treat girls politely (i.e. holding doors, offering to carry baggage, ect) in a demeaning sense, but out of respect.
Or at least that's how I learned it.
Occasionally I get "Nice to know some men know how to be a gentlemen still." from little old ladies, and occasionally I get the "OMG you're such a chauvinist!" from some women.
It was how I was brought up, you treat women with respect, it has nothing with thinking of them as lesser or weaker.

Treat a lady as a lady and a tramp as a tramp.

It's their choice, but some still seem surprised when they're not worshipped. (or the opposite in your case Oz)

Therefore leading to the inevitable conclusion "You can't win".

The mysteries of the "ever-changing" needs and moods of a woman is not something to be mastered (by either sex), but can only be satisfied at the moment.......

Always open the doors Oz, it's up to the "openee" to be happy about it (or not).

Happiness is achieved by doing the right thing. You shared something that was refused, but at least you tried, eh!

The woman was probably pi**ed off before she got to the door ...she refused to let you be the one to cheer her up!

And remember.....trying to be a chivalrous knight doesn't always get you a knighthood (or a princess!) You've gotta fight a lot of dragons first.

And girls..... yes, I know.... you've got to kiss a lot of frogs!

Rrrrrribit! ....let me get that for you miss.........

Well I am a lady and I always hold the door open for someone behind me when I am walking into a place. Obviously not out of chivalry but because it's the nice thing to do. I don't think the majority of women are like that lady, perhaps she was having one of those bad "manhating" kind of days.

With thine gauntlee of mine which I thrust into the Earth between us, I challenge thee to a duel for the hand of this fine maiden!

Yes I think Chivalry is long dead, the age of jousting & duels for the hand of fine maidens is long gone & only in the movies now & very rarely at that. I blame feminism really for women thinking they're not weak & don't need protecting by chivalrous knights riding on horses in shining armour and rap for teaching us to treat women like garden tools for de-weeding our lawns

[edit on 29/7/08 by Discotech]

Originally posted by Discotech
...rap for teaching us to treat women like garden tools for de-weeding our lawns

[edit on 29/7/08 by Discotech]

That's one of the most interesting euphemisms I've read. Good job.

The next time you see her, scream bloody murder, slam the door in her face, then use pepper spray on her with the reason... "I thought you might be a mugger" that will learn her lesson in being a well.

Sorry , but chivalry is not dead. It's alive and well, the only problem is the fact that some people nowadays do not appreciate it. Be as nice as you can to people, and the really worthy will appreciate it. Perhaps if your nice to the right person at the right time, their day will go much better.

I have had people come back to a place I worked because I was so polite and nice to them.

Chivalry is not dead my friend. I hold the door for anyone, man, woman, transvestite (no really I have). They say that nice guys finish last, which is true for the most part, and I think that's why there are so few people that'll do nice things for others, too busy thinking about their selves, in today's society it's all about ME ME ME. It's the way people are becoming these days. My mom was telling me the other day that every thing has changed from when she was a kid.

Neighbors use to talk to each other and act friendly, random people would ask the ladies or elderly if they wanted help out to their car with their groceries.

I still do these things, just because I like to make people smile. And I really mean that, I'm not trying to make my self look better by saying it, but I really do try to help people out every way I can.

Don't give up man, some people (this number is going up) are ungrateful. Working customer service, I've had many experiences with the general populace. I had one customer yell at me for calling him "Sir". He said, "Don't call me sir! I work for a living". :bnghd::bnghd::bnghd:

There's still plenty of good people in this world (not enough in my opinion), and as the old saying goes, "Treat others the way you want to be treated".

That lady has some karma coming her way. Keep being a good person Oz, the world needs more people like you.

I'm not gonna deny it, I hold the door for women. And not for men, either. If there's a man behind me, I'll walk through first and sort of keep it open with my hand as I'm walking through, and that's usually enough. But if there's a woman approaching the door with me, Hell yes I generally open it up and hold it for her as she walks in before me. It's hard for me to believe that people are even being made to feel ashamed about this. It's not as if I think women are incapable of opening doors for themselves (duh), it's just a courtesy. I think if a woman got angry at me for holding the door for her like in the OPs post, I'd definitely retort. Probably pretty angrily, too. Physically, yes, women are indeed the weaker sex. Obviously this doesn't make them the weaker sex overall, but men are physically stronger...get over it and appreciate a favor like the rest of the 99% of women.

I'm a woman, and I enjoy being one. If a man holds a door open for me, I smile and say "thank you." If he doesn't, hey, I'm perfectly capable of getting that door myself. It's not that big a deal. I've been known to hold doors for others of both genders. I'm not against whatever remains of chivalry, but I'm comfortable doing things myself.

I think Herman is right, it's courtesy, good manners. I don't particularly understand why it would get someone all hot under the collar.

ho boy...

this post of mine could be a tocuh unpopular or well-received.

WELL...time to find out

Ok I see several issues with this whole idea of chivalry and 'is it dead?'

Let me start with the short answer.

Chivalry is dead and I am glad it is gone. Now before you go nutty on me hear me out.

The idea of chivalry is very old but it comes with a bit of a price; controversy.

I have seen a guy hold a door for a women and then begin to fondle her in public (his girlfriend by the way...if it was some stranger that would have been weirder) and she pushes him off, obviously embarrassed by the groping in public. He has the nerve to be upset that she pushes him away. His excuse was that he did such lovely things as opening car doors and getting her a beverage. The last time I checked logic I don't recall reading that a few gestures was equal to getting anything you want in return. I'm sorry but that guy is ignorant.

Now...on the flip side is the girl who believes she deserves to have the man do every single thing regardless of situation. I've seen a gentleman at a lovely dinner while my wife and I dined. This indivdual happened to have his left arm in a cast and during their exit it was clearly a bit difficult in this specific position for him to get to the door handle. she has a little fit about how he doesn't do things like this for her and the poor chap was clearly in shock.

Here is my point. Don't treat a woman like a queen and place her on a pedestal because from I have seen many don't like that. They don't want to be stomped in mud and don't want to be placed specially above everyone else. Either action results in placing them in some unwanted spotlight. Now I will not speak for all women because first off I am not a woman myself and second even if I was, no woman can speak for the next just as no man can speak for his brethren.

I myself am only going off of my observations. I am completely aware that the scope of my so-called social experiment is fairly small and can never truly represent 100% of the female population but I guess I will leave with this question...

Shouldn't we all be treating each other equally anyway?

-Kyo

she was prolly just pms'n really bad.

Growing up with 3 sisters we were always taught to act like gentleman,hold doors open,help them carry heavy items,I'm too old to change now,but my son's are the same way,why change because of 1 circumstance

Interesting post OZ...yes I think chivalry is dead as well..and god forbid if I call somebody maam, Its not like I do it on purpose, I spent ten years in the army so its still kind of a habit, It doesnt pay to be polite anymore!!!!

This person obviously has deeper issues than courteous people.

Chivalry is dead, however, since there are no ladies (okay, there are a few), but mostly just sex objects.

However, if feminist wants a real issue, they need to start by fighting the exploitation of women through pornography and sexually suggestive advertising if they want equal treatment, and start dressing for respect instead of sex appeal.

I just had to look up the word…

Chivalry - considerate and courteous behavior, especially shown by a man toward women.
1. The medieval system, principles, and customs of knighthood.
2.
a. The qualities idealized by knighthood, such as bravery, courtesy, honor, and gallantry toward women.
b. A manifestation of any of these qualities.
3. A group of knights or gallant gentlemen.

In light of the above, yes, chivalry is dead, yet I know that when we use the word today we use is synonymously with courtesy, politeness, and manners, but REAL chivalry is dead.

However, I think plenty of us sane people exorcise enough manners and common kindness today to say that no, chivalry is not dead.

Next time you run into someone like that just tell them, “ I don't know what your problem is, but I'll bet it's hard to pronounce. “

Either that or have phony business cards made for a psychologist, and hand it to them as you say, “I do have openings available…”

Oh I know, that would be funny, but I don’t think it would help much. You can’t fight fire with fire. Crazies are everywhere out there; You just gotta realize that you’re not their real problem, and just laugh… take nobody seriously.

reply to post by OzWeatherman


anyone who would punish someone like that in public - for doing something generous and civilized - has issues that go way beyond feminism

I can't speak for all women - but, a nice gesture is a nice gesture - not an opportunity for a political/philosophical diatribe

and I seriously doubt that the freedom and equality of women everywhere is going to be jeopardized by civility

I once received an entire (angry) lecture from a gentleman about how unimportant time was - and that he wouldn't be caught dead wearing a watch, society shouldn't live by the clock...on and on

simply because I asked (very politely) if he had the time

"no, I don't" would have been a good answer

so, no - not dead

but, maybe proceed at your own risk - there are some angry people out there :-)

Oz, that's terrible! I apologize for those of my gender who have no manners and want to humiliate those who do.

I took my 10 year old son to IHOP a few weeks ago and, as he has been taught, opened the door for me. He kind of struggled with it since he's only 10 but I smiled and waited patiently.

During that brief wait, 2 young (20 something) girls got to the door just as my son managed to get it open. I moved out of the way so that they could go through first and one of them called over her shoulder as she went through, "teaching the kid to be a sexist pig?" I was instantly furious. My son just looked confused and hurt.

I retorted back, "no. just teaching him to identify them. thanks for the show and tell example." We spent our breakfast out together time discussing how some people are raised badly, etc.

Just because there are ill-mannered people in the world doesn't mean you have to lower your standards. If they feel strongly about it they can wait until you get through the door, wait for it to close again and then open it for themselves. Sheesh!

Don't hold open the door, they think you're a jerk.


Hold open the door for them, they think you're a pig.




It's a lose lose for men.