Where is the F-23 (PAV-1@Dayton PAV-2@Northrop?)

reply to post by Canada_EH


Would just like to add that it is possible to get onto Hornet Way and the straight on view is the best although there is a little bit of tree obstruction. Referring to your image down here:



[edit on 8/6/2008 by racerzeke]

Well I got a email back again from WPAFB Museum research center and I must say that I've been trying hard not to let the first part go to my head
Here it is for all to read:

Certainly you seem to have a better chronology than that available to me
at the moment. The individual handling airlift of museum assets is out
of the office, so I cannot readily access her files.

But, I think I have identified part of the problem.

The Air Force Flight Test Center Museum at Edwards AFB is a Field Museum
of the National Museum of the United States Air Force. If the airframe
was on display at that museum (or under their local control at EAFB)
prior to its airlift to the NMUSAF at WPAFB, this would not necessarily
be reflected in our files.

My records only indicate when the museum took original control of the
aircraft, apparently on 13 May 1996. Though the airframe was offsite,
control was still maintained by the NMUSAF and our field affiliates
within the Air Force History & Museums Program. All aircraft within the
museum program despite their varied locations around the nation at our
many field museums, are tracked internally by the National Museum of the
United States Air Force. I think this likely explains the divergent
dates.

Brett Stolle
NMUSAF/MUA
Research Division

I must take the time publicly to thank Brett for getting back to me and also shedding some light to the first email he had sent and that it seems we do have a solid timeline for the airframe of PAV1. Anyone hear anything else recently or get an image yet of PAV2?

Man I really regret not attempting to snap a pic of the PAV-2, sorry guys Hopefully some braver member will get one Or I dont know I might try to go down there again and see what I can do. I also emailed the Western Museum of Flight inquiring about the F-23 and they havent replied in 2 weeks or so. I've emailed them before and usually get a reply within a few days, dont know if they are avoiding me or not.

The aircraft main data plate for the YF-23 at Wright Patterson AFB includes the following information:

Model: YF-23A AIR VEHICLE

Part no. (complete air vehicle): 400-000001-1001

Serial no.: YF1001 (Northrop build number), N231YF (civil registration)

Contract no.: F33657-86-C-2087

Date of manufacture: 04 JULY 1990


Presumably the data plate for PAV-2 would include:

Part no. 400-000001-1002

Serial no. YF-1002, N232YF

Well PAV2 made a surprise appearance today on the Horton documentary on national geographic. Follow the link for the image from the show.



Seems like if we can't get a shot of it the TV will supply it for us lol.

[edit on 8-7-2009 by Canada_EH]

Time for an update on PAV-2. We know it was at WMOF at the Hawthorne location and then went to Northrop for quite some time. WMOF has moved to their new location at Torrance Airport a few years ago and PAV-2 was eventually moved there. Saw satellite photos of it sitting out front the museum near the runway. I went to visit the museum as I haven't been there since 2004. PAV-2 was moved to a holding lot at the end of the airport near the hangars. Museum staff took me there and unlocked the area for me to check out and photograph PAV-2. It's parked with the YF-17 Cobra and the F-14. Was told that PAV-2 will be getting new paint and some restoration in the next month. Here are some pictures I took.

reply to post by Canada_EH


Now THAT's a handsome aircraft!

This is the view from the street (from behind the Acura dealer).



Lastly, I checked Google Maps and Google Earth and the satellite images show a dirt lot where all three of these planes are. Then I checked Apple Maps on my iPad and they were there! You can glide around in 3D view so I snapped a couple. Amazing that Apple Maps satellite imagery is more up to date than Google's. Just enter Torrance Airport, CA and move to the south end of the airport. They are located just behind the Acura dealership.

She's still a beauty....

That plane looks like a beast! I love the look of it and wish it would have won over the F22.

2

originally posted by: Canada_EH
yf-23 RCS model -1990

[edit on 27-7-2008 by Canada_EH]

I fell down a Google Hole and ended up here ... glad I did. I'm actually in that photo of Model 705 at RATSCAT. I still have my blue ATF23 suit.

I'm so happy to find it online and find people talking about it ... even if the thread is nearly 10 years old

a reply to: AllenModel705
Welcome to ATS.
She was a beautiful aircraft, even prettier than 22.

originally posted by: HatTrick
Any one else here feel that the F-22 was selected due to political maneuvering as opposed to shear merit?

So many keep asking that question. Here's one in rebuttal: WVR/BCM, doesn't or does the F-22 eat the F-23 due to TV??

Yes, perhaps a bit faster and stealthier, but WVR logic demands the Raptor waxes the 23.

If true, I'm very happy for the current crop of drivers that have that advantage.....

P.S. Likely so would the TV'd Flankers, the smaller and more agile EFs and perhaps even the Raffy's.......

a reply to: nwtrucker

Why would logic demand that the F22 would wax the F23?

originally posted by: Flipper35
a reply to: nwtrucker

Why would logic demand that the F22 would wax the F23?

Thrust vectoring....The F-22 has TV the F-23 does not.....


sorry. No such thing as the F-23. The YF-22 had TV and the YF-23 did not. Pretty simple actually, 20-22 degree of thrust deflection makes up for the sheer size of the two platforms and makes the Raptor more than equal to all the competition out there. The YF-23? Likely the loser against even current potential advisories.

a reply to: AllenModel705

It's a shame that the 705 model got cut up a few years back after languishing for so long out in the New Mexico desert near RATSCAT

a reply to: nwtrucker

Yet the pitch rates and sustained turn rates were very close...TV is not the be all-end all that you claim it to be for WVR engagements..

originally posted by: EBJet
a reply to: nwtrucker

Yet the pitch rates and sustained turn rates were very close...TV is not the be all-end all that you claim it to be for WVR engagements..

"Be all/end all" is your words, not mine. Or are you suggesting 20-22 degrees of potential deflection isn't a significant advantage to the Raptor. As far as the two being "close" in STRs and pitch rates, obviously you have access to information that certainly isn't public knowledge, more likely classified as well. Instantaneous turn rates and getting one's nose on the target wouldn't be close at all. IIRC.

All that aside, do you suggest the YF-23 was a match for the YF-22 in BCM? Even in the day, the Raptor was considered the more maneuverable of the two.

Wonder why YF120 won versus YF119 too...