Where is the F-23 (PAV-1@Dayton PAV-2@Northrop?), page 1

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Topic started on 23-7-2008 @ 01:14 PM by Canada_EH

Hi all.
I'm still in the middle of trying to figure out if this image and if the news is current and not an old image posted recently but still I think people would like to check it out. The image is supposedly shot recently as this photographer took a tour of the Air Force Museum restoration hanger. The date is Mar 21st 2008 so as far as I know this is the first confirmation of Northrop releasing the airframe.

link:
good-times.webshots.com...

Image hosted

I have sent a message to the photographer and pending his answer I will also get ahold of the Museum. Still if any one can shed some light on this that would be great.

*Also of note since I have now went through the entire album and all are posted on said date and there is an image of what I think is the B-2 Honda mock-up on display that as far as I know was destroyed in 2005 at a what I thought was the South Dakota Air and Space Museum.

[edit on 23-7-2008 by Canada_EH]

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:39 PM by _Del_

I believe PAV-1 is now being restored at Wright-Patt. Could be recent pictures of the effort there. Though I believe the wings are currently re-mounted. So perhaps it's an older photo?

[edit on 23-7-2008 by _Del_]

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:40 PM by Canada_EH

Well how about this, it is listed on their website.
www.nationalmuseum.af.mil...

So did this happen when I wasn't looking?

[edit on 23-7-2008 by Canada_EH]

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:41 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by _Del_

Any idea when they got the airframe?

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:45 PM by _Del_

I want to say early last year (2007).

Don't quote me on that.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:50 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by _Del_

Haha Don't worry I wont have too soon enough. I just sent a message to Dayton's Research center at the museum and I hope I can get a bit more detail from them. Now also this still leaves 1 airframe missing. So does anyone have any ideas on its location. And as for the release of the plane why was it ever taken back to Northrop? Have they ever said why?

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:50 PM by FredT

The 2 airframes were at Edwards and at the Western Museum of Flight

The Airframe at Edwards (like the one at the WMF) has been MIA for some time. Also since 911 Edwards has not had its usual airshow and the FLight Test Museum with all of its cool stuff has been off limits. The info about the Edwards airframe comes from a friend but its about 4 years old as well

Far more time than needed for a restoration IMHO. I also have wondered why Northrop did not do it themselves.

There is a strong possibility that one or both were used for research (perhaps on the future bomber project) , but a stretch FB-23A bomber seems to be increasingly unlikey.

They hands down are one of the most beautifull aircraft I have ever seen (the XB_70 tops the list as well) and would love to see them on static display again.

[edit on 7/23/08 by FredT]

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:55 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by FredT

To make sure I understand here Fred with what your saying. 2 of the airframes where released and then taken back or at least unavailable to the public. Then in what we think was 2007 one of them was released to the Dayton museum.

[edit on 23-7-2008 by Canada_EH]

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 01:57 PM by _Del_

The real question is what was Northrop-Grumman doing with the airframes previously. Scuttlebutt was that they were used, as FredT said, in testing for the tactical bomber design. All pure rumour, but seems reasonable.
I'd love to know the particulars. I'd also like to see PAV-2 turn up and what, if any, changes have been made to it.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:01 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by _Del_

Yeah thats what I have now shifted to wondering. Its great that the PAV-1 will be released and we will at least have one of the beautiful planes on display. But what happened PAV-2 will be the next hunt though I will still try and get details from the museum that may shed some light on this.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:02 PM by FredT

Originally posted by Canada_EH
reply to post by FredT

To make sure I understand here Fred with what your saying. 2 of the airframes where released and then taken back or at least unavailable to the public.

Yes in essence. The one at Edwards was never given away but rather kept by the AF but on public display. Both were MIA for a while but this one now showed up (or at least a pic)

My question is this? were both airframes using the Pratt engine? The one in the picture has a pratt logo on it. The last time I saw the aircraft at the WMF I did not recall seeing that sticker. I look back through old pics and alas do not have a picture of that part of the airframe. If so this may be the Edwards airframe.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:03 PM by FredT

Originally posted by _Del_
I'd also like to see PAV-2 turn up and what, if any, changes have been made to it.

Im guessing if they modified it extensivly we will never see it.

Ill be the used PAV-1 for baseline RCS reading, then modified PAV-2 to track changes in RCS with the mods.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:17 PM by Dan Tanna

PAV-2 at northrop site

Good link shows it on the ground from above. Beautiful view.

This looks air worthy to me but it was said this was just a 'restoration effort'. Sorry, cannot remember where I got the image from, but at least i saved it under a memorable name! Grey Ghost.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:18 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by FredT

Fred I have images of airframe 800 not sure if thats PAV-1 or 2 with a P&W logo and I have images of 801 with a GE logo.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:21 PM by FredT

Originally posted by Canada_EH
reply to post by FredT

Fred I have images of airframe 800 not sure if thats PAV-1 or 2 with a P&W logo and I have images of 801 with a GE logo.

Sweet

If we can figure out which one was at WMF, we can at least narrow down possibly the fate of at least one of them

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:27 PM by Canada_EH

Originally posted by Dan Tanna

Awesome find Dan now if only we could narrow down where you found the image. That or contact Northrop. Also that is 801 while 800 is at WPAFB. So if this is resent then we have confirmed both airframe locations.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:31 PM by _Del_

The AF Museum picture has Paul Metz's name on the railing. It's also black, not grey (not that it couldn't have been repainted over the years. Metz's name with the Pratt logo sells it as PAV-1 to me.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:36 PM by _Del_

Originally posted by FredT
Im guessing if they modified it extensivly we will never see it.

I'd assume you're correct. It will turn up at the Flight Test Center Museum or at the photo-bomb range some years distant.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:39 PM by Canada_EH

reply to post by FredT

Well Fred the one at WMF was 801 as seen in these images. Also Dans image above is 801 which means we need to confirm date on his image.

As for 800 it is the airframe with the P&W logo which means its the one seen at Wright Pat.

reply posted on 23-7-2008 @ 02:57 PM by Dan Tanna

Its a 2006 post date in another forum! F-16.net

Its got loads of smaller but impressive pics from northrop in it too. I knew if I sat here long enough i would find it.

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