I have been a Christian all my life...

I am 28 years old in two weeks and have been a faithful Christian all my life. I try to be a good person and fail many times each day as most do. I have always believed the Bible was good. Then I read it. What got me thinking was a video of a young girl in Iran that was stoned to death. It made me sick, it was AWEFUL and DISPICABLE. Then as I am reading the Bible I realize that the Bible tells us to do the same thing for many wrongdoings. I typed this up, it is some quotes that has me worried. I typed it for a friend of mine so some of it may not make perfect sense but most will.

Here we go, tell me what you think and remember The Bible was written by a perfect being who created and knows all even before it happens. He wrote the Bible to cover humanity from The Beginning to the End. So you cannot say times have changed as God knew how today's times would be when the Bible was written. You cant say Jesus changed things as he said he did NOT come to change the law and besides, the bible says gods word is PERFECT. Why would you change something that is perfect? You cant say it is "lost in translation" as then you would have to doubt EVERY word of the Bible and besides a perfect being should be able to get his word out as he intends.

Why would Jesus need to "change" anything the Bible says when God knew full good and well what would happen to Jesus. Why would he make a mistake and change his word and teachings when he can see until the end of time? The obvious answer is he wouldn't. The Bible never says specifically to disregard anything from itself and if it did... why would it need to if it was written by a perfect being? If God wanted to change the way Christians behaved he could have easily said "In the year 1900 AD you need to change "X"" but he does not. Please be respectful of everyone's views. PLEASE!

If you say this is bad translation then why is it that God, being all powerful, could not even get his word to his followers as he intended it to be? Why
did God not make himself known to African Tribes or ancient civilizations? Why must they all suffer in hell because of when and where they were born. Same
goes for today in the Middle East, where Christianity is illegal and the average person has NO access to Christian docs. If God is a kind and loving being
why then did he create the earth when he already knew, before creating it, he would destroy it not once but twice and send the majority of people to ever
live in hell (or if you dont believe in hell, he will deprive them of everlasting time with him in paradise.)


Slavery

Genesis chapter 17, verse 12:

And he that is eight days old shall be circumcised among you, every man child in your generations, he that is born in the house,
or bought with money of any stranger, which is not of thy seed. He that is born in thy house, and he that is bought with thy money,
must needs be circumcised.


Exodus chapter 12 verse 43:

The Lord said to Moses and Aaron, "These are the regulations for the Passover: No foreigner is to eat of it.
Any slave you have bought may eat of it after you have circumcised him, but a temporary resident and a hired worker may not eat of it.


Exodus Chapter 21, verse 1:

Now these are the ordinances which you shall set before them. When you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve six years,
and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing. If he comes in single, he shall go out single; if he comes in married,
then his wife shall go out with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children
shall be her master's and he shall go out alone. But if the slave plainly says, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children;
I will not go out free,' then his master shall bring him to God, and he shall bring him to the door or the doorpost;
and his master shall bore his ear through with an awl; and he shall serve him for life.


Exodus Chapter 21, verse 20:

If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished
if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property.


Exodus Chapter 21, verse 32:

If the bull gores a male or female slave, the owner must pay thirty shekels of silver to the master of the slave, and the bull must be stoned.
(now we know what a slaves live is worth, 30 pieces of silver)


Leviticus Chapter 22, verse 10:

No one outside a priest's family may eat the sacred offering, nor may the guest of a priest or his hired worker eat it.
But if a priest buys a slave with money, or if a slave is born in his household, that slave may eat his food.


Leviticus Chapter 25, verse 44:

Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary
residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to
your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.


Luke, Chapter 7, verse 2:

Now a centurion had a slave who was dear to him, who was sick and at the point of death. When he heard of Jesus, he sent to him
elders of the Jews, asking him to come and heal his slave. And when they came to Jesus, they besought him earnestly, saying,
"He is worthy to have you do this for him, for he loves our nation, and he built us our synagogue." And Jesus went with them. When he
was not far from the house, the centurion sent friends to him, saying to him, "Lord, do not trouble yourself, for I am not worthy to have you
come under my roof; therefore I did not presume to come to you. But say the word, and let my servant be healed. For I am a man set under authority,
with soldiers under me: and I say to one, 'Go,' and he goes; and to another, 'Come,' and he comes; and to my slave, 'Do this,' and he does it."
When Jesus heard this he marveled at him, and turned and said to the multitude that followed him, "I tell you, not even in Israel have
I found such faith." And when those who had been sent returned to the house, they found the slave well.



Colossians, chapter 3, verse 22:

Slaves, obey in everything those who are your earthly masters, not with eyeservice, as men-pleasers, but in singleness of heart,
fearing the Lord. Whatever your task, work heartily...



Titus, chapter 2 verse 9:

Bid slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect; they are not to be refractory, nor
to pilfer, but to show entire and true fidelity.



******Various Quotes of Hatred, Violence and Murder.*******

Exodus, Chapter 32:

Then he [Moses] said to them, "This is what the Lord, the God of Israel, says: 'Each man strap a sword to his side. Go back and forth
through the camp from one end to the other, each killing his brother and friend and neighbor.' " The Levites did as Moses commanded, and that
day about three thousand of the people died.


The following is text book definition of torture.

According to Genesis, God also tortures all women for eternity with painful childbirth. For her trangression of eating the fruit, God says to Eve:

"I will greatly increase your pains in Childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children."

******************I will include the definition of torture for you********************

tor·ture: Infliction of severe physical pain as a means of punishment or coercion.


Isaiah 13

Whoever is captured will be thrust through;
all who are caught will fall by the sword.

16 Their infants will be dashed to pieces before their eyes;
their houses will be looted and their wives ravished.

See, I will stir up against them the Medes,
who do not care for silver
and have no delight in gold.

18 Their bows will strike down the young men;
they will have no mercy on infants
nor will they look with compassion on children.

Hosea 13

The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
because they have rebelled against their God.
They will fall by the sword;
their little ones will be dashed to the ground,
their pregnant women ripped open."


********Various statments that 99.99% of Christians tend to ignore even though they would be the easiest to follow****************

Matthew 6:19

Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; but lay up for yourselves
treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart
will be also.

Luke 14:33

Any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.

Matthew 6:24

No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other.
You cannot serve God and Money.

Matthew 19:21-24

Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come,
follow me." When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth,
it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a
rich man to enter the kingdom of God."

Matthew 19:28-29

Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have
followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or
mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.

Luke 9:23-25

Then he said to them all: "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me.
For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it. What good is it for a man to gain the whole world,
and yet lose or forfeit his very self?

Matt 13: 22

The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of
wealth choke it, making it unfruitful.

Hebrews 13:5

Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, "Never will I leave you; never will I
forsake you."

Phil 2:3

Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves.

Acts 2:44-45

All the believers were together and had everything in common. Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need.


**********God is Sexist, he does not treat all equal (Remember this when you study the Bible, women should not speak)*********

1 Corinthians chapter 14:

As in all the congregations of the saints, women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission,
as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the
church.


1 Corinthians 11 (No more wearing hats)

But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a woman is her husband, and the head of Christ is God. Any man who prays or
prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head, but any woman who prays or prophesies with her head unveiled dishonors her head--it is the same as
if her head were shaven. For if a woman will not veil herself, then she should cut off her hair; but if it is disgraceful for a woman to be shorn or
shaven, let her wear a veil. For a man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but woman is the glory of man.
(For man was not made from woman, but woman from man. Neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.) That is why a woman ought to have a veil
on her head, because of the angels.


1 Timothy chapter 2 (Women should not braid their hair or wear gold or pearls)

Also that women should adorn themselves modestly and sensibly in seemly apparel, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or costly attire but
by good deeds, as befits women who profess religion. Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman to teach or to have authority
over men; she is to keep silent.

Genesis chapter 17 God says (God makes no covenant with women, only men)

This is my covenant, which you shall keep, between me and you and your descendants after you: Every male among you shall be circumcised. You shall
be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskins, and it shall be a sign of the covenant between me and you.


In Matthew 25:1 Jesus says:

"At that time the kingdom of heaven will be like ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom."

In John 20:17 Jesus says to Mary:

"Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father," as though the touch of a woman is somehow improper, but a few verses later, is happy to
have Thomas touch him.


In Genesis chapter 3,

God punishes Eve, and all women for thousands of years, with greatly increased pain during childbirth. No such pain is inflicted on Adam.

In Ephesians 5:22-24 we find this:

"Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body,
of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything."


In 1 Peter 3:7 we find: "Husbands, in the same way be considerate as you live with your wives, and treat them with respect as the weaker
partner and as heirs with you of the gracious gift of life, so that nothing will hinder your prayers."

In 1 John 2:13, John says, "I write to you, fathers, because you have known him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men,
because you have overcome the evil one. I write to you, dear children, because you have known the Father." No mention is made of women.


*****Misc***********

If you believe the story of Jesus, Jesus clearly knew that he is God. In John chapter 14, verse 8 we find this

Philip said to him, "Lord, show us the Father, and we shall be satisfied." Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet
you do not know me, Philip? He who has seen me has seen the Father."

So it makes you wonder about Jesus' famous lamenation in Matthew 27:46:

About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"—which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Since Jesus is God, what he really must have meant is: "Myself, myself, why have I forsaken me?" Which of course makes absolutely no sense.


**********Promises of prayer request fullfilment, I have prayed for my famlies and my own health many times.. never worked*********


Mark 11:24 is so simple:

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

John 14:14:

If you ask anything in my name, I will do it.

There is this statement in Psalms chapter 41:

1 Blessed is he who has regard for the weak;
the Lord delivers him in times of trouble.
2 The Lord will protect him and preserve his life;
he will bless him in the land
and not surrender him to the desire of his foes.
3 The Lord will sustain him on his sickbed
and restore him from his bed of illness.

In Mark 16, Jesus talks about the laying on of hands:

16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who
believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents, and if they drink any deadly thing, it
will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.

But even more remarkable is James 5:15, where the Bible says:

And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up.


***************Other Problems********************

If nobody is to work on the Sabbath what will happen in our hospitals and Nursing Homes? What about people needing emergency surgery. What about the people who
repair your electricity and keep your water clean and running? What is the punishment for working on the Sabbath? PUT TO DEATH!!!! Exodus 31:15 So you and everyone
you know should have been put to death LONG ago.

What should we do AS CHRISTIANS to others who do not believe as we do? Puclicly stone them TO DEATH. Deut 17:2-7 Sounds alot like another religion we consider
radical doesnt it?

What if a whole town does not believe in god? Well, Deut 13:13-19 tells us to Destroy the WHOLE town and Kill EVERYONE!!

If you hear it said about one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you to live in 13 that wicked men have arisen among you and have led the people
of their town astray, saying, "Let us go and worship other gods" (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly.
And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that
town. Destroy it completely, [a] both its people and its livestock. 16 Gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and
completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the LORD your God. It is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt. 17
None of those condemned things shall be found in your hands, so that the LORD will turn from his fierce anger; he will show you mercy, have compassion
on you, and increase your numbers, as he promised on oath to your forefathers, 18 because you obey the LORD your God, keeping all his commands that I am
giving you today and doing what is right in his eyes.


I bet you can guess what we do to people who blasphemes the name of God.. Yup.. Kill em!! Lev 24:16

anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. Whether an alien or native-born, when he blasphemes the Name,
he must be put to death.


Have you ever cursed your father or mother?? If so, you should be put to death!!! Lev 20:9

'If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death. He has cursed his father or his mother, and his blood will be on his own head.


What if you commit adultry? DEATH!!! Lev 20:10

'If a man commits adultery with another man's wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death.


We kill all the homosexuals too.. Lev 20:13

'If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

What about rebellious teenagers, surly we shouldnt put them to death.. Yup.. we should kill em. Deut 21

18 If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him, 19 his
father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town. 20 They shall say to the elders, "This son of ours is
stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a profligate and a drunkard." 21 Then all the men of his town shall stone him to death. You must
purge the evil from among you. All Israel will hear of it and be afraid.

According to the Bible and directly from Jesus' mouth none of us should have any hands or feet.. nor eyes or a tounge. We should have cut them off long ago.

Matt 18:7-9

Woe to the world because of the things that cause people to sin! Such things must come, but woe to the man through whom they come! 8If your hand or
your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet
and be thrown into eternal fire. 9And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye
than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell.

great posts

just thought i would throw in my 2 cents here, i recently came to the conclusion to just stay away from organized religion, completely. so many denominations and sects.....just make god your "religion" thats all you need. i have nothing else to contribute.

peace

Keeping Young Virgin Girls for "yourself" Numbers 31:17

Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Did you know the Bible says you can have Two wives? You dont have to treat them equally either. Deut 21:15

If a man has two wives, and he loves one but not the other, and both bear him sons but the firstborn is the son of the wife he does not
love, 16 when he wills his property to his sons, he must not give the rights of the firstborn to the son of the wife he loves in preference to his
actual firstborn, the son of the wife he does not love. 17 He must acknowledge the son of his unloved wife as the firstborn by giving him a double share
of all he has. That son is the first sign of his father's strength. The right of the firstborn belongs to him.

You can marry captive women against their will as well... Deut 21:10

When you go to war against your enemies and the LORD your God delivers them into your hands and you take captives, 11 if you notice among the captives
a beautiful woman and are attracted to her, you may take her as your wife. 12 Bring her into your home and have her shave her head, trim her nails 13
and put aside the clothes she was wearing when captured. After she has lived in your house and mourned her father and mother for a full month, then you
may go to her and be her husband and she shall be your wife. 14 If you are not pleased with her, let her go wherever she wishes. You must not sell her or
treat her as a slave, since you have dishonored her.


Have you been raped? Congratulations, you just got yourself a husband.. Your RAPIST!!! Deut 22:28

If a man happens to meet a virgin who is not pledged to be married and rapes her and they are discovered, 29 he shall pay the girl's father fifty
shekels of silver. [c] He must marry the girl, for he has violated her. He can never divorce her as long as he lives.


It gets better.. What if you are raped and you are too scared to scream for help? You get to be raped and then put to death for BEING RAPED!! Deut 22:23


If a man happens to meet in a town a virgin pledged to be married and he sleeps with her, 24 you shall take both of them to the gate of that town and
stone them to death—the girl because she was in a town and did not scream for help, and the man because he violated another man's wife. You must purge
the evil from among you.

Of course it should come as no shock that we kill all women who arent virgins before marriage. Deut 22:20

If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the girl's virginity can be found, 21 she shall be brought to the door of her father's house and there
the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father's house. You must
purge the evil from among you.

Originally posted by pureevil81
great posts

just thought i would throw in my 2 cents here, i recently came to the conclusion to just stay away from organized religion, completely. so many denominations and sects.....just make god your "religion" thats all you need. i have nothing else to contribute.

peace

That is exactly where I am headed at this point. Thank You. I hope people dont see this as an attack on religion, this is honestly my own struggle with my religion.

reply to post by shug7272

I have been a Christian all my life...

I'm so sorry.

I agree that there are many questionable passages in the bible. Plus, the old testament God and the new testament god are completely different.

The best advice I can offer you is to research many religions and come to your own conclusion. Don't let anyone think for you on this subject, and question everything to find more information.

I wish you luck in your endeavor! Here's to your awakening.

Originally posted by Mad_Hatter
reply to post by shug7272

 

I have been a Christian all my life...

I'm so sorry.

I agree that there are many questionable passages in the bible. Plus, the old testament God and the new testament god are completely different.

The best advice I can offer you is to research many religions and come to your own conclusion. Don't let anyone think for you on this subject, and question everything to find more information.

I wish you luck in your endeavor!

Here's to your awakening.

Dont be sorry for me, it has taught me many good things and honestly made me strive to be more kind. I thank you for the kind words and have always thought for myself, just never paid enough attention to the whole book.

reply to post by shug7272


The bible wasn't written by God but by man and most of it has been altered/changed so many times that it is not even close to what it originally was when a prophet wrote it.

Hidden knowledge that has been kept from us creating a belief system for control purposes.
Even King James made his own version and changed the words of Jesus Christ and he was not the only one. (The elite bloodlines and rulers of the past reformed their own version of the bible in order to confuse and mislead religions and the masses to maintain control) Deep down inside you know what's right and wrong and stoning someone and having slaves, killing and torchering someone is just plain WRONG and not what a GOD of LOVE would want for us.

Peace!

Originally posted by Malevolent_Aliens
reply to post by shug7272

 

The bible wasn't written by God but by man and most of it has been altered/changed so many times that it is not even close to what it originally was when a prophet wrote it.

Hidden knowledge that has been kept from us creating a belief system for control purposes.
Even King James made his own version and changed the words of Jesus Christ and he was not the only one. (The elite bloodlines and rulers of the past reformed their own version of the bible in order to confuse and mislead religions and the masses to maintain control) Deep down inside you know what's right and wrong and stoning someone and having slaves, killing and torchering someone is just plain WRONG and not what a GOD of LOVE would want for us.

Peace!

If God is all knowing and powerful why would he allow man to corrupt his word? I dont believe that it would be hard for God to get his word to us unaltered... should be easy for him. If he cant do that... hes not doing too hot.

about slaves,
dont forget the Israelites were also slaves themselves
once, but God heard their pleas and set them free.
other nations were very bad people, sacrificing
their own kids, the Israelites gave a bright
future to their slaves.

it was unlawful to force someone into slavery.
exodus 21:16
And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him,
or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death.

the Hewbrew slaves volunteered, they lived in poverty
and wanted an arrangement in exchange for
security, wher they could always leave with something.

the Israelites also saved oppressed slaves from other nations.
deuteronomy 23: 15,16
Thou shalt not deliver unto his master
the servant which is escaped from his master unto thee:
He shall dwell with thee, even among you,
in that place which he shall choose in one of thy gates,
where it liketh him best: thou shalt not oppress him.



about the violence,
first God gives them life, then sets them
free from bondage, takes care of all their needs,
promises them the world,
and they defile him right there in his presence, over and
over again, a very stubbon people, they better be
prepared for some tragedy.

reply to post by josephine


And god knew it would all happen before he created us... so why did he create us only to destroy us time and time again?

Well pretty much the same reasons your parents do the things that they do when they know full well your gonna do the stuff they tell you not to.

reply to post by shug7272

And god knew it would all happen before he created us... so why did he create us only to destroy us time and time again?

The universes was created to be unpredictable , on purpose.
God was lonely and wanted someone like himself, to be His friend.
God knew that in order for this friend to be really like Him, there had to be a built in randomness and a freewill.
God was smart enough to know that, because of how he created the universe to operate in a not fully predictable manner (and with free will), things could go terribly wrong.
That does not mean that God wanted it to fail, or slanted things in the direction of failure.

Originally posted by shug7272
Slavery

several things about slavery in the bible.

- the laws where put into place to protect slaves (exodus 20:26,27)
- people went into slavery voluntarily, kidnapping was prohibited. (ex 20:16)
- provision was given if the slave enjoyed working for his master. (ex 21:5,6)
- slave where to be let go after a certain amount of time. (ex 20:10. lev 25:10, duet 15:12)

slavery in christian times was alittle different. the scriptures are simply saying that if you become a disciple of christ, then contiue to obey your masters. becoming a disciple of christ was not an excuse to run away.

******Various Quotes of Hatred, Violence and Murder.*******

Exodus, Chapter 32:

there is a difference between wanton violence, and enacting justice. some isrealites even after selling miracles by god still decided to worship other gods. if you see the hand of god, and then deny it, face it, nothing is going to make you believe

According to Genesis, God also tortures all women for eternity with painful childbirth. For her trangression of eating the fruit, God says to Eve:

no, according to genesis, eve was suffering the consequences of her sin. so was adam.

just like an experienced mechanic can tell you what will go wrong if you neglect a certain part of your car, why cant god, who created man, be able to tell them what will go wrong from their sin?

remember, god said "you will die", not "i will kill you"

Isaiah 13

a prophecy about the fall of babylon

Hosea 13

The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
because they have rebelled against their God.
They will fall by the sword;
their little ones will be dashed to the ground,
their pregnant women ripped open."

again, prophecy. when god was rebelled against, he released his protection. it goes without saying, why should protect those who dont love him?

********Various statments that 99.99% of Christians tend to ignore even though they would be the easiest to follow****************

Matthew 6:19, Luke 14:33, Matthew 6:24, Matthew 19:21-24, Matthew 19:28-29, Luke 9:23-25, Matt 13: 22, Hebrews 13:5, Phil 2:3, Acts 2:44-45

true, but remmeber, it is a principle not a law.

matt 6:[33] But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

jesus is saying preaching is more important tha that Mercedes

but you are right, alot of christians are hypocritical in this regard

part b later.....

[edit on 19-7-2008 by miriam0566]

**********God is Sexist, he does not treat all equal (Remember this when you study the Bible, women should not speak)*********

1 Corinthians chapter 14:

women are not suppose to be teachers in front of the assembly. it doesnt mean they are supposed to be disgraced.

1 Corinthians 11 (No more wearing hats)

if a man being the head of a woman is something bad, than so should a man feel it is unfair to be under christ.

1 Timothy chapter 2 (Women should not braid their hair or wear gold or pearls)

again, a principle, women should not draw undo attention to them selves. a woman dressed immodestly isnt typically a religious person

Genesis chapter 17 God says (God makes no covenant with women, only men)

are you saying you advocate female circumcision?

In Matthew 25:1 Jesus says:

"At that time the kingdom of heaven will be like ten virgins who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom."

i dont understand how this is sexist, he's refering to the saints and thier bride like relationship with him.

In John 20:17 Jesus says to Mary:

"Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father," as though the touch of a woman is somehow improper, but a few verses later, is happy to
have Thomas touch him.

actually no, buy the context, mary thought jesus was ascending and went to stop him, jesus was simply telling her to stop.

In Genesis chapter 3,

God punishes Eve, and all women for thousands of years, with greatly increased pain during childbirth. No such pain is inflicted on Adam.

considering men dont give birth, id say that makes sense, but adam did walk away scot free. read the next verse

[17] And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
[18] Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
[19] In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.

dont men struggle to provide for their families?

In Ephesians 5:22-24 we find this:

"Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body,
of which he is the Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit to their husbands in everything."

In 1 Peter 3:7 we find: "Husbands, in the same way be considerate as you live with your wives, and treat them with respect as the weaker
partner and as heirs with you of the gracious gift of life, so that nothing will hinder your prayers."

so women being respected and loved is a bad thing?

*****Misc***********

If you believe the story of Jesus, Jesus clearly knew that he is God. In John chapter 14, verse 8 we find this

Philip said to him, "Lord, show us the Father, and we shall be satisfied." Jesus said to him, "Have I been with you so long, and yet
you do not know me, Philip? He who has seen me has seen the Father."

So it makes you wonder about Jesus' famous lamenation in Matthew 27:46:

About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"—which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

Since Jesus is God, what he really must have meant is: "Myself, myself, why have I forsaken me?" Which of course makes absolutely no sense.

the trinity nor duality are taught by the bible

www.belowtopsecret.com...

**********Promises of prayer request fullfilment, I have prayed for my famlies and my own health many times.. never worked*********

Mark 11:24 is so simple:

Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

John 14:14:

If you ask anything in my name, I will do it.

There is this statement in Psalms chapter 41:

1 Blessed is he who has regard for the weak;
the Lord delivers him in times of trouble.
2 The Lord will protect him and preserve his life;
he will bless him in the land
and not surrender him to the desire of his foes.
3 The Lord will sustain him on his sickbed
and restore him from his bed of illness.

In Mark 16, Jesus talks about the laying on of hands:

16 He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who
believe: in my name they will cast out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up serpents, and if they drink any deadly thing, it
will not hurt them; they will lay their hands on the sick, and they will recover.

But even more remarkable is James 5:15, where the Bible says:

And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up.

even jesus' miracles of healing were temporary, they were a foreshadow of what will be done in the future.

one must also be serving god with truth,

john 15:[7] If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.

in order to abide by jesus, one must study the bible and come to accurate understanding, close personal relationship with god is also needed. sometimes though, god chooses to refuse a request.

2 corinthians 12:[7] And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
[8] For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
[9] And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

If nobody is to work on the Sabbath what will happen in our hospitals and Nursing Homes? What about people needing emergency surgery. What about the people who
repair your electricity and keep your water clean and running? What is the punishment for working on the Sabbath? PUT TO DEATH!!!! Exodus 31:15 So you and everyone
you know should have been put to death LONG ago.

matt 12:[10] And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him.
[11] And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out?
[12] How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days.

jesus was showing that the pharisees were hypocrits and missed the spirit of the law.

the sabbath is where people were suppose take a day, stop working for material gain and worship of god. the religious leaders turned it into this cruel and hard tradition.

as for stoning,

people who did not observe the sabbath were forsaking the covenant they and their forefathers made.

think about it, that is what sin is, its rebellion from god.

What should we do AS CHRISTIANS to others who do not believe as we do? Puclicly stone them TO DEATH. Deut 17:2-7 Sounds alot like another religion we consider
radical doesnt it?

duet 17:2-7 is not refering to the nations, it is referring to isrealites who are "transgressing his covenant", apostates.

What if a whole town does not believe in god? Well, Deut 13:13-19 tells us to Destroy the WHOLE town and Kill EVERYONE!!

again talking about apostates, not men of the nations.

I bet you can guess what we do to people who blasphemes the name of God.. Yup.. Kill em!! Lev 24:16

again, people who promise to serve god, and then dont, and actually go against god.

Matt 18:7-9

you mean to tell me that you cant understand the meaning behind this scripture?

let me illustrate, a man is alcoholic, it ruins his life (make him stumble). he has to quit, but its really really difficult (like cutting off his arm). but he does that it doesnt ruin him.

Miriam has stepped up and made some points. All of the things this soul has brung up comes from his lack of understanding.

I wish I had the time to explain all of it, but remember this since you are a christian. God is the creator of your heart. Every ounce of love you have in your wretched soul is from his graces.

Like when I was younger I could step on bugs and laugh, now I cannot because that change comes from (HIS) graces of love, not me. Evil people in the world, gangsters, unjust murderers, robbers, cerial killers, these souls have no graces, no love, no remorse in their soul.

God gives some people graces which are love and he infuses them into sous, so your little concern you have is from him, I swear to it on my life and God will show you at the death bed where your love comes from..

This is the first step in humility.


Now why would God be stupid enough in the NT to teach this....


" Love thy enemies as thy self pray for them "

" Love God with all your heart "

" Turn the other cheek "



You see God cannot be stupid enought to blatantly contradict himself. So the only conclusion since God (never) taught hate. Those events were covered in very few sentence in one book, you don't know the circumstances of anything that happened in war and what was the oppositions motives. And also God knows who will grow up evila nd eveything, like I said your understanding is dim because you don't know the one you are placing judgement on, he knows everything, you don't know what was in peoples hearts.

what if you knew someone would grow up a murderer? Yet as a kid they were alittle playful, what do you do if you are God?

you just don't search hearts like God does and seriously you remind me of the athiest with your post. If you were a true Christian your questions would be sincere, but I see you put caps on some stuff like you were trying to get your point over in an attacking way rather then ask sincerily but that's my opinion.


God knows who is on the other side writing the original post, whether it be a secret athiest or a real christian, I don't know.


anyways all your love comes from him, he IS love itself and created it and infuses it into everybody, some run on pride though and they have few graces but are always built up how real they are and how much they love which is a facade.


as far as God changing the laws. Yes he ordered stoning, but what you don't understand is that stoning is not part of the initial laws. Those would be the ten commandments. In the NT age we are living in the age of mercy and forgiveness because of the eucharist he implimented and confession.

He died for our sins so we don't become stonned right away, that was changed in the new law because of the sacrafice but the ten commadments still are the same which is what Christ was talking about when he said the old law.

the commandments.

I wish I could answer all of your post but it's so long, I don't have time right now.


peace.

[edit on 19-7-2008 by JesusisTruth]

[edit on 19-7-2008 by JesusisTruth]

reply to post by miriam0566

several things about slavery in the bible. - the laws where put into place to protect slaves (exodus 20:26,27) - people went into slavery voluntarily, kidnapping was prohibited. (ex 20:16) - provision was given if the slave enjoyed working for his master. (ex 21:5,6) - slave where to be let go after a certain amount of time. (ex 20:10. lev 25:10, duet 15:12) slavery in christian times was alittle different. the scriptures are simply saying that if you become a disciple of christ, then contiue to obey your masters. becoming a disciple of christ was not an excuse to run away.

No the Bible specifically says you can own people and that they are your property. I quoted it in my OP. It never says that we should not do it. Per the Bible we can still own slaves and it is ok. Also we can beat them half to death as long as we dont kill them. That is what it says. Period.

there is a difference between wanton violence, and enacting justice. some isrealites even after selling miracles by god still decided to worship other gods. if you see the hand of god, and then deny it, face it, nothing is going to make you believe

So justice=violence..even death? Isnt that what other "radical" religions teach? Seems the same to me. Doesnt seem "kind and loving" at all. That is what was done to Jesus, he broke the laws and got his justice. I suppose that was ok. Not kind and loving at all.

no, according to genesis, eve was suffering the consequences of her sin. so was adam. just like an experienced mechanic can tell you what will go wrong if you neglect a certain part of your car, why cant god, who created man, be able to tell them what will go wrong from their sin? remember, god said "you will die", not "i will kill you"

Eve and EVERY WOMAN to ever live is punished with GREAT PAIN. That is the text book definition of torture... even evil. How would you like to tortured because your grandmother stole? Seems idiotic.

again, prophecy. when god was rebelled against, he released his protection. it goes without saying, why should protect those who dont love him?

Why should a kind and loving being encourage torture and killing of people who dont believe in him? Even the children? Unborn children? Sounds satanic to me.

true, but remmeber, it is a principle not a law. matt 6:[33] But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you. jesus is saying preaching is more important tha that Mercedes but you are right, alot of christians are hypocritical in this regard

Per the bible all of those Christians will not make it to heaven unless you believe a Camel can pass through the eye of a needle. Meaning you too will not make it to heaven assuming you own the computer you are typing on that makes you more wealthy than a vast majority of the world. VAST majority.

women are not suppose to be teachers in front of the assembly. it doesnt mean they are supposed to be disgraced.

Not true, the Bible says women should not teach period and should be silent in the church. If you are female and are teaching me about the bible you are sinning and spitting in gods face. If you speak in church you are spitting in his face and would be lucky not to be killed for it if the Bible sets any sort of precedent at all. As a matter of fact if you wear pants God "detests" you. Unless you dont think pants are mens clothing, which if it isnt I dont know what is.

if a man being the head of a woman is something bad, than so should a man feel it is unfair to be under christ.

And if you prey with your head uncovered as a woman you have spit in Gods face. Again not looking good for entry to heaven. It also shows that man is held in higher regard than woman. Per the Bible you should not be discussing this with me if you are female. You should be submissive.

again, a principle, women should not draw undo attention to them selves. a woman dressed immodestly isnt typically a religious person

No you are simplifying it. You can not braid your hair, wear gold or even pearls if you are a woman. Im guessing this means about 99.99999999% of Christians spit in Gods face on a daily basis.

are you saying you advocate female circumcision?

Doesnt matter what I advocate at all. The bible makes no covenant with women and seems to care little for them. God doesnt even seem to mind if you make a covenant with him or not if you are female. God made the rules not me, it wouldnt have to be female circumcision to be a covenant. God made that rule.

i dont understand how this is sexist, he's refering to the saints and thier bride like relationship with him.

It is holding women up as a sexual object of desire. Not to mention it sounds ALOT like another "radical" religion.

considering men dont give birth, id say that makes sense, but adam did walk away scot free. read the next verse [17] And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; [18] Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; [19] In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. dont men struggle to provide for their families?

Not today, not exclusively. That is now considered to be the job of man and woman. But women still take the pain as punishment which is text book definition of torture. Seems both should have been punished with something that would last for eternity and sense god can see to the end he knew women would be working. Doesnt seem like an even punishment.

so women being respected and loved is a bad thing?

You completely skip over the first part about being submissive. Why should woman be ruled over by man? They are not equal? Well the answer to that is no per the bible.

Continued

even jesus' miracles of healing were temporary, they were a foreshadow of what will be done in the future. one must also be serving god with truth, john 15:[7] If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. in order to abide by jesus, one must study the bible and come to accurate understanding, close personal relationship with god is also needed. sometimes though, god chooses to refuse a request. 2 corinthians 12:[7] And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure. [8] For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me. [9] And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

The Bible specifically says ask and you shall receive. You shall be raised up from illness. It doesnt say it MAY happen, it says it WILL happen. But it doesnt. You cant say its Gods plan because he promises you in the bible he WILL heal you, not I MAY heal you if it is PART of my plan. My Aunt and Uncle were good Christians and my uncle died at the age of 53 from cancer after 2 years of torture. The whole church prayed for him often and nothing was done. The Bible lied. He was prayed for and not healed. The same happens to the VAST majority of Christians that get sick, even children. There may be a miraculous recovery at a rate of 1/1,000,000 but that hardly fulfills the words of the bible.

matt 12:[10] And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him. [11] And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? [12] How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days. jesus was showing that the pharisees were hypocrits and missed the spirit of the law. the sabbath is where people were suppose take a day, stop working for material gain and worship of god. the religious leaders turned it into this cruel and hard tradition. as for stoning, people who did not observe the sabbath were forsaking the covenant they and their forefathers made. think about it, that is what sin is, its rebellion from god.

Then you rebel from God just by owning a computer and your other riches that could help the poor. Again the punishment for working the Sabbath is death by stoning. There is NO IF AND OR BUT. So that means anyone who needs surgery or any form of help on the Sabbath is just out of luck... or they are damning their saviors to a death by stoning by asking them to work on the Sabbath. If you have ever worked on the Sabbath you should have been stoned to death, and since you werent you should cut off your hands due to the fact that they caused you to sin by working with them. You wont do that either and will spit in Gods face with your defiance.

duet 17:2-7 is not refering to the nations, it is referring to isrealites who are "transgressing his covenant", apostates.

Still sounds like another "radical" religion to stone people to death that dont agree with you. Not kind and loving at all.

again talking about apostates, not men of the nations.

A man is a man, no matter what title you give him. It is a disgusting act that you are defending.

again, people who promise to serve god, and then dont, and actually go against god.

You are misleading others as to what the bible says which will probably need a stoning for punishment. That is not true. It says any man who blasphemes the name of god. Besides, thats what STREET GANGS do. If you want out YOU GONNA DIE!!!

you mean to tell me that you cant understand the meaning behind this scripture? let me illustrate, a man is alcoholic, it ruins his life (make him stumble). he has to quit, but its really really difficult (like cutting off his arm). but he does that it doesnt ruin him.

No you are giving it your own meaning. The Bible SPECIFICALLY SAYS if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. Period. It doesnt say anything about alcoholism or the other stuff you go on about. IF IT CAUSES YOU TO SIN CUT IT OFF. I guess God knew people would not like this because he reinforces it by going on to say it again with your foot and eyes as an example and NEVER SIMPLIFIES IT. Makes you sin, cut it off. EVERY christian should have no eyes as EVERYONES eyes cause them to sin at least once in their life.

Miriam has stepped up and made some points. All of the things this soul has brung up comes from his lack of understanding.

I understand perfectly. God made his words VERY clear but yet you chose not to follow them as they are. You want to change them and twist them which the Bible says not to do. Every thing in my OP is pretty clear cut yet you dont want to face it. There is no lack of understanding, only denial from what I can see. The Bible IS THE WORD OF GOD AND IS PERFECT. It doesnt need YOU to change it or tell others the meaning of it as it is pretty easy to read. Just read it and do as it says which no Christian does (myself included, I refuse to stone anyone to death and if you do too then you spit in the face of God as that is what HE said should be done). They step around things they dont like, they change things and ignore others. You are not to interpret the Bible but to read and follow it. It seems you are the one who does not understand.


If God were a perfect being he could easily get his word to us EXACTLY AS HE WANTED IT. But then you change it and its meaning. Period.


[edit on 19-7-2008 by shug7272]

Originally posted by pureevil81
great posts

just thought i would throw in my 2 cents here, i recently came to the conclusion to just stay away from organized religion, completely. so many denominations and sects.....just make god your "religion" thats all you need.

Why even bother with a god then?

G