Choice of Aircraft

Originally posted by thedman
Have to remember before 9/11 was no system to determine if
plane hijacked - thats assuming hijackers did make their presence
known.

Well actually there was. Before 9/11 when a plane was hijacked the pilot either made a call over the radio or changed the code on the transponder to the hijacked setting. (Both of which only take seconds to do).

Something which was not done on any of the 9/11 planes.

Well actually there was. Before 9/11 when a plane was hijacked the pilot either made a call over the radio or changed the code on the transponder to the hijacked setting. (Both of which only take seconds to do).

Thats assuming pilots are still in control and able to access controls -
on 9/11 first thing hijackers did was storm cockpit and kill the pilots.
Then turn off transponders to conceal planes. Pretty tough to dial in
hijacker code when someone grabs you from behind and begins
stabbing you. Only reason ATC was able to determine that Flight 11/
Flight 93 were being hijacked is when the terrorists screwed up and
used radio not PA system to talk to passengers

reply to post by ULTIMA1

The last normal transmission from the Stewart flight was at 9:27:10 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time.The Southeast Air Defense Sector was notified of the event at 9:55, 28 minutes later.

Stewart's pilot didn't respond at 9:34 a.m. the military was notified at 9:55 a.m., 21 minutes later.

I was wrong about the notification time.

It was 34 minutes before the interceptors were airborne after the first sign of trouble. The military had fighters airborne 15 minutes after notification, the same time it took with Flight 11.

www.911myths.com...

Originally posted by Boone 870
reply to post by ULTIMA1

 

The last normal transmission from the Stewart flight was at 9:27:10 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time.The Southeast Air Defense Sector was notified of the event at 9:55, 28 minutes later.

Stewart's pilot didn't respond at 9:34 a.m. the military was notified at 9:55 a.m., 21 minutes later.

I was wrong about the notification time.

It was 34 minutes before the interceptors were airborne after the first sign of trouble. The military had fighters airborne 15 minutes after notification, the same time it took with Flight 11.

www.911myths.com...

Gee i would hope so considering the airforce had many jets practicing for hijacked airliners targeting the pentagon and Wtc on 911.

I guess many honest pilots thought it was just part of the exercise untill they were debriefed.

Originally posted by thedman


Then turn off transponders to conceal planes. Pretty tough to dial in
hijacker code when someone grabs you from behind and begins
stabbing you. Only reason ATC was able to determine that Flight 11/
Flight 93 were being hijacked is when the terrorists screwed up and
used radio not PA system to talk to passengers

That would make sense in fairy tail land but in reality there was no struggle or evidence of struggle in Flight 93's cockpit. Heck, the cockpit warning bells and messages were never activated during the flight. No "WOOP WOOP! " "Pull up, pull up!" or " Sync rate, sync rate"... nothing.

There is no evidence of a struggle in the cockpit. Besides it is a little impossible to 'storm' the cockpit when the plane was 'inverted' at almost 'mach 1' . Try to stand on a city bus while it turns. Silly story to assume there was a struggle in the cockpit.


[edit on 23-7-2008 by IvanZana]

Originally posted by thedman
Thats assuming pilots are still in control and able to access controls -
on 9/11 first thing hijackers did was storm cockpit and kill the pilots.

1. It only takse 4 seconds to change the code on the transponder. That would mean the hijackers got into the cockpit and subdued the pilots in less then 4 seconds, ON ALL 4 PLANES.

2. The phone call from the Flight Attendent on flight 77 stated that the pilots were taken to the back of the plane, so they were not killed.

Originally posted by Boone 870
I was wrong about the notification time.

It was 34 minutes before the interceptors were airborne after the first sign of trouble. The military had fighters airborne 15 minutes after notification, the same time it took with Flight 11.

Here is some more information on NORAD interceptions on 9/11.

www.globalsecurity.org...

MR. LEHMAN: If they had gone into burner, could they have gotten there in time to get 77?

GEN. ARNOLD: I think if those aircraft had gotten airborne immediately, if we were operating under something other than peacetime rules, where they could have turned immediately toward Washington, D.C., and gone into burner, it is physically possible that they could have gotten over Washington, D.C.

MR. LEHMAN: The armament on the F-15s and the F-16s was?

GEN. ARNOLD: The armament, as I recall, and General McKinley can correct me on that, we had full-up armament on all those aircraft with both radar and heat-seeking missiles as well as guns.

GEN. MCKINLEY: AIM -7,-8,-9.

MR. LEHMAN: Now, had 93 not crashed, would it not have been possible for the F-16s to have intercepted 93, and do you think they would have?

GEN. ARNOLD: It was our intent to intercept United Flight 93. And in fact my own staff, we were orbiting now over Washington, D.C. by this time, and I was personally anxious to see what 93 was going to do, and our intent was to intercept it.

reply to post by ULTIMA1

2. The phone call from the Flight Attendent on flight 77 stated that the pilots were taken to the back of the plane, so they were not killed.

It wasn't a flight attendant, it was Barbara Olson.

She didn't say ''pilots'', she asked, "What shall I tell the pilot? What can I tell the pilot to do?"

Also, Chick Burlingame, the pilot of Flight 77, was dead before the plane hit the Pentagon.

Senator John Warner, who fought to allow Burlingame to be buried at Arlington, said evidence shows the pilot died before the crash, fighting off the terrorists.

Source

Originally posted by Boone 870
Also, Chick Burlingame, the pilot of Flight 77, was dead before the plane hit the Pentagon.

Any evidence of this or just opinoins?

reply to post by ULTIMA1
I would suggest that you contact Senator John Warner and ask him. Here is his contact info:

Washington Office
225 Senate Russell Building
Washington, DC 20510
Main: (202) 224-2023

or

E-mail

1. It only takse 4 seconds to change the code on the transponder. That would mean the hijackers got into the cockpit and subdued the pilots in less then 4 seconds, ON ALL 4 PLANES

Good - so lets engage in a little experiment. You will be seated in a chair
back to me, I come up, grab you and start slashing your neck with a
knife/box cutter. You can then see if can dial a phone while I am
stabbing you...

At this point most people are more concerned about fighting off the
attacker, especially if taken by surprise.

Like I said before...
in reality there was no struggle or evidence of struggle in Flight 93's cockpit. Heck, the cockpit warning bells and messages were never activated during the flight. No "WOOP WOOP! " "Pull up, pull up!" or " Sync rate, sync rate"... nothing.

There is no evidence of a struggle in the cockpit. Besides it is a little impossible to 'storm' the cockpit when the plane was 'inverted' at almost 'mach 1' . Try to stand on a city bus while it turns. Silly story to assume there was a struggle in the cockpit.

Originally posted by Boone 870
I would suggest that you contact Senator John Warner and ask him. Here is his contact info

So it is just your opinion that the pilot was dead before hitting the Pentagon?

Originally posted by thedman
Good - so lets engage in a little experiment.

Sems you forgot that the had to get through the cockpit door first. Are you stating that it took lees then 4 seconds to get through the cokkpit door and subdue the pilots ON ALL 4 PLANES?

So lets do this experiment. Someone is breaking in your door do you just sit there and do nothing and let them come in and attack you or do you try to call for help?