Obama Calls For Mandatory Government Service

you know, this whole argument about semantics, as amusing as it is, is off point.

sugarcoat it all you want. leave all the wiggle room you need, obama.

in a nutshell and at its core, mandatory is the more appropriate word for this.

making other people enforce federal dictates (whether that's parents of college students leaning on them so they get that $4K credit or schools leaning on students so they get the funding) doesn't change a thing as far as the real meaning goes.

some people's brains can simply cut through the bull faster and see the real impact, meaning, and ramifications of programs such as this.

the federal government has NO business implementing this kind ofr action. what works at a state or even community level is one thing, but the point is, the federal government has limits and it's time to remind them of that.

in my view, obama's inexperience with and lack of knowledge about the role of the federal government is showing here.

[edit on 13-7-2008 by ~Lucidity]

reply to post by ~Lucidity

Again, you infer this. Not to many "I told you so" prophecy threads going on here, I'm calling BS.

As far as the federal government having the right, whatever. I'm glad they lent me the money for college.

It is very simple: If you can refuse to do something, then it is not mandatory. If you cannot opt out without penalty, then you are a slave. Simple. Slaves have no say about their future or life and what happens to them. They must obey the master or be puinished. That is a fact and cannot be debated. Done deal. Read a dictionary if you disagree. Only a free man can determine their own destiny, a slave has no say.

Now, Obama wants to make sure that the kids all line up and shovel crap for some rich corporate cat at slave wages and call it ' service"...? What a crock.It is just the SYSTEM lining the free men up for the same fate as the prisoners ion the prison industrial complex....a steady supply of warm and compliant bodies to work the line and make money for the power brokers....as they swill scotch and laugh at how stupid we are for falling for it all. Someday if things get as bad as I fear they will the rich had better keep it quiet lest they find themselves stripped of their excess by those desperate and not impressed by the rich men's howls of indignation..

Imagine second homes in the mountains being occupied by determined squatters during ahrd times..and local cops not willing to stage a shootout for every rich out of towner looking for time away from the city...it can get worse then that, my friends...and will.

And on the edge of all thios Obama wants some feel good public service corps to sweep the streets while the coke dealers and pimps are driving by flipping their butts for the others to pick up...how long will that take to get old? About one minute. Most kids will tell the government to go to hell long before they will pick up trash for nothing but a gold star and an attaboy from some politician.

reply to post by jerico65
I especially like this part of his speech..

He said he would make federal assistance conditional on school districts establishing service programs and set the goal of 50 hours of service a year for middle and high school students.

For college students, Obama would set the goal at 100 hours of service a year and create a $4,000 annual tax credit for college students that would be tied to that level of service.

Obama said he realizes there will be skeptics, but stressed that greater public service will make the nation safer.

Source

Still sound voluntary? "Federal Assistance Conditional" Sounds more like: Do this or else to me..

By The Way: Hilarious picture Jericho65!


[edit on 7/13/08 by LLoyd45]

Originally posted by jprophet420
Again, you infer this. Not to many "I told you so" prophecy threads going on here, I'm calling BS.

Call BS all you like. We're all entitled to our opinion, at least for the moment..

As far as the federal government having the right, whatever. I'm glad they lent me the money for college.

Yeah, you lucked out. Those who follow you though will get to mandatorily volunteer for the same opportunity.

reply to post by Hal9000


why didnt you quote the whole thing

"Require 100 Hours of Service in College: Barack Obama will make college affordable for all Americans by
creating a new American Opportunity Tax Credit. This fully refundable credit will ensure that the first $4,000
of a college education is completely free for most Americans, and will cover two-thirds the cost of tuition at the
average public college or university. Recipients of this credit will be required to conduct 100 hours of public
service a year, either during the school year or over the summer months."

Originally posted by ludaChris

Originally posted by Ruggeder
But how can you presume to tell someone else what they need? I agree with what you say about some people in this country and no doubt the world, who certainly live in egregious excess. But that is also within their rights if they have the means to do so. Then you make a blanket statement about Republicans, Christians, and hillbillies? I lived among those Republican, Christian, hillbillies for 5 years, and they were very hospitable to me in every capacity. Granted some were a little on the strange side from my perspective, being the city slicker I am, but they were good folk.

You seem to have misunderstood what I said, as did the no doubt angry republican who responded before you. his post first, yes those states are "red" states, however not everyone there is "red" they just voted more or fixed it, the state is, in fact most states, are 50-50.
On to what you said. I can presume to tell someone what they need based on common sense and humanity. I realize people, especially here in America, think everyone who isn't them can starve and die and they'll eat 10 pounds of steak throw 9 pounds out and say well I can afford it so its fine. It isn't fine, if you think that, your parents failed in raising you, period. There are people dying from lack of help, lack of food, disease, many things in this country that should never exist. Health care, Jobs, food, heat, and other things are just some of the items and basic human services that should be available to everyone regardless of race, color, political party,sex, or sexual orientation. Try not starting a couple wars and you'll see money there stealing from everyone in the form of income tax stack up, try giving some of YOUR money back to you i the form of health care, food, work, and so on. With the amount this country makes, we should never have been in debt, we should never have people dying from lack of food or health care considering how much we waste. There will be some groups who seek to take advantage of the system, there are simple laws you could make to fix that situation, and make it fair to everyone.

reply to post by Kingalbrect79


Don't we already pay enough taxes to "benefit our community"?


But then, 54% of all tax money goes to the military, military operations, CIA operations, and black-budget operations.

[edit on 13-7-2008 by thetruth777]

I didn't read all the post but this is just another "Peace Corps" kind of deal. He wants to be seen as a John F. Kennedy.

If it is a forced service, how is he going to enforce it? Do you know how much lying is going to go on?


Roper

Originally posted by LLoyd45
reply to post by jerico65

 

I especially like this part of his speech..

He said he would make federal assistance conditional on school districts establishing service programs and set the goal of 50 hours of service a year for middle and high school students.

For college students, Obama would set the goal at 100 hours of service a year and create a $4,000 annual tax credit for college students that would be tied to that level of service.

Obama said he realizes there will be skeptics, but stressed that greater public service will make the nation safer.

Source

Still sound voluntary? "Federal Assistance Conditional" Sounds more like: Do this or else to me..

By The Way: Hilarious picture Jericho65!


[edit on 7/13/08 by LLoyd45]

It's mandatory for the school district to "establish a program". It doesn't say it's mandatory for anyone to attend said program. It doesn't even say it's mandatory for the program to meet its "goals".

Relax. Obama is way to wishy-washy to do anything as decisive as making something mandatory.

I can't help but wonder what the reaction from the respective camps would have been if McCain had called for national service. My guess is that they would have been completely reversed, with the Dems saying McCain's a Nazi and the Reps saying it's exactly what American needs. As a foreigner looking in, there really doesn't seem to be any difference between either side at all.

Originally posted by Distractions4Nothing
It's mandatory for the school district to "establish a program". It doesn't say it's mandatory for anyone to attend said program. It doesn't even say it's mandatory for the program to meet its "goals".

What it's saying is: If they wish to receive federal funding, they'll will provide and implement these programs. The "No Child Left behind" program was the same kind of deal. They either provided access to the student to recruiters along with contact information, or they would not receive federal funding. Every school does so now.

Relax. Obama is way to wishy-washy to do anything as decisive as making something mandatory.

Actually I think he's a very devious man. When he said "words mean everything", he meant it! They may be weasel words, but they're still binding.

Originally posted by LLoyd45

Originally posted by jprophet420
Again, you infer this. Not to many "I told you so" prophecy threads going on here, I'm calling BS.

Call BS all you like. We're all entitled to our opinion, at least for the moment..

As far as the federal government having the right, whatever. I'm glad they lent me the money for college.

Yeah, you lucked out. Those who follow you though will get to mandatorily volunteer for the same opportunity.

Lucked out? They get the same deal as me + 4k tax credit. They only get the 4k tax credit for community service. Your inferences are kind of indicitive of why he wants to better education.

Originally posted by jprophet420
Lucked out? They get the same deal as me + 4k tax credit. They only get the 4k tax credit for community service. Your inferences are kind of indicitive of why he wants to better education.

This is rich.. A person that can't even spell the word indicative, is attempting to criticize me about my education? If I were you, I'd ask for a refund on my tuition fees..

I don't normally comment on spelling errors, but since you obviously feel that you're much smarter than I am, I thought I'd point your mistake out.

And for your information, a grant and a tax credit are not the same thing like you indicated in one of your previous posts.

Keep this in mind people...

It is NOT MANDATORY for each individual state to conform to Federal Mandates on Speed restrictions, Exit Sign Design and Road Construction; BUT ; If they do not, they lose millions in Federal Tax Dollars.

Obama can CALL a thing voluntary and it makes it all better huh?

Welcome to the upcoming...

United Soviet States of America

Semper

It is really really imperative that people act in a big way such as millions of letters to Mr. Obama, should he win the election, and/or huge demonstrations and complete non-compliance. The governments owns no one. We do not belong to them, nor are we children to be told what to do. We are sovereigns, and despite the treasonous activities and pseudo-laws (those that are not-constitutional, and not in full transparent knowing truth embraced by us) of the federal reserve hijack of the countries banking, shadow governments and stealing of lands, WE ARE THE JOINT OWNERS OF OUR COUNTRY AND ITS ASSETS, and all any politician is, is a hired manager of our children's estate. They are a mere employee. We are the employer group. We call the shots. What has been allowed to slide so far, must be taken back immediately. Obama is not hired to do his will, but the peoples will. If a individuals within a coorporation lies to and manipulates the board, and it is discovered and proved, they go to jail. Well the most important business is that of managing our joint property. I consider it treason to lie or manipulate the truth and make secret or falsify any documents. Its time to tell them that as employees they walk a thin line.

[edit on 14-7-2008 by mystiq]

trying to force community service on anyone is a joke..there is no way i would go along with that even if it comes about..if i ever decide to have kids(the way things are going i have real doubts that i will) i would never make them do it, even if its a law...i remember when my friend was on probation and had to do some hrs, u know what that tried to make his community service,washing cop cars! lol im sorry but that does not service the community in any way.. this is rediculous and infact in violation of the ammendment.. we have no good canidates to vote for.. write in Ron Paul!

reply to post by Anonymous ATS

I only quoted the line that had "required" in it because a previous poster considered that meaning "mandatory". It was one of the bullet items and I posted the whole line. I don't know where you are quoting from, it doesn't match what I was quoting.

It is always good to include the source and use external tags when quoting a different website. Thanks.

Originally posted by semperfortis
Keep this in mind people...

It is NOT MANDATORY for each individual state to conform to Federal Mandates on Speed restrictions, Exit Sign Design and Road Construction; BUT ; If they do not, they lose millions in Federal Tax Dollars.

See. I've been telling you all along and obviously Semper agrees with me that it is not mandatory. Thanks for clearing that up.

Obama can CALL a thing voluntary and it makes it all better huh?

Welcome to the upcoming...

United Soviet States of America

Semper

I could see complaining about it if they raised taxes to pay for it, which in that case you would only be getting your own money back, or if it causes tuition to go up which would in effect cost more for education. Some of you I'm sure would rather not pay taxes to begin with and not have any program, but I think you have to get beyond that and see that this may be an opportunity for some to gain experience that they otherwise would not get.

The same people that don't want to pay for taxes are the same ones that say everyone is responsible for themselves and their families. How is someone supposed to better themselves and take care of their families if they are poor and we don't give them tools like this to do it?

reply to post by Hal9000


Absolutely...

And for all those that want the Government to take care of us and make it so that personal initiative and free thinking are things of the past; this is definitely the way to go.

For those that support Socialism and/or Marxism, this you should support.

Semper