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The Usa should go Isolationist

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posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 02:44 PM
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Something struck me after allowing myself to get drawn into endless, literally endless threads on Iran and War and the Nwo and war and Islam and listening to my country be bashed to pieces night and day and day and night. China will get us, Russia will get us, we are evil, we are monsters...

I can't find anything that seems to be a true reference to either the Usa being involved in Armageddon or any of it really, Nostradamus refers to an"Asian" invasion of the mideast, and... hardly any prophecy concerns us in anyway...

Then as I listend to more Europeans bash our being at War and listened to more posts about more threats... It dawned on me that, I don't really give a damn about the rest of the world I like my life and i'm Jewish and don't care about Zionist Isreal very much and the mess they are being drawn into...

Why don't we go isolationist, unify with our continent, I honestly like Mexicans alot, they work hard and are mostly very nice... why are we involved over all at all?

I hear so much bad words, no matter whos side we take, we never win, we always come out the bad guys somewhere somehow... and we honestly have everything we need...

Someone in some post said "go ride a tractor" to an American like that's a bad thing...

I look at it like this, we have not had a break since being in ww2, we aren't heroes, we ended up in this ridiculous cold war...

1: Pull back all our defenses to protecting the Usa, including missile shields, we'd be absolutely impreganable and no one would have a reason if we declared neutrality

2: Stop buying all oil, in fact stop all imports, get our factory jobs back, build our own dvd players and cars, we can, continent wide we have everything we need, we need to be imperialistic, it's for greenland or the panama canal, we have what we need...

3: to be able to stop the Oil issue, we have about 20 yrs of crude and we fix prices at the 5-6.00 a gallon range and switch to bio diesel...

4: This means we stop selling food abroad, and stop giving it away, 30% of the worlds food just from us not including Canada and Mexico...

We get threatened with oil every year for 30 years, we never or virtually never use food for much leverage, 8.00 a bushel vs 140.00 a barrel, we are utterly extorted

We don't need the oil we have nuclear and hydro and solar for electric, the continent has most of the worlds shale oil and 1/3 the food...

we'd get back manufacturing, we'd be fine, really... no one could or would invade us

and nothing we do gets us anything but sh^7 back... none of it but dead American troops and grief

Without us Europe would have to build a real Army, Europeans seem to do nothing but hate us for being involved in all this, I say, lets get out of Nato, lets stop selling our food away, the mideast and Africa would starve and immigraton to Europe would be massive and... deal with it yourselves, kill them at your door step...

because # 5 change America end off continent immigration, don't take the refugeees they can't walk over, Mexico we would absorb that's fine... and end it, no immigration unlees it's bringing serious high tech skills and willing to know English prior to arrival

and, honestly, I think maybe that's why we don't see America in prophecy, not because we are destroyed, but because after all this grief and trying ...we get ragged and financially devestated... we fight for oil, we don't actually Have to have...

What happens to the mideast that hates us all... if we stop selling food, stop letting them immigrate and stop buying oil...

It explodes... and honestly let asia and Europe do it again, leave Europe to it's own devices, lets see what Russia and China do with out our counter balance...

I hear so much of what we consume, but Asia and Europe could barely maybe feed themselves let alone Africa and the Middle East... and those people will seek to immigrate and... then lets see who butchers who or what kind of war is fought...

Because these really aren't our problems, it's impossible to fight us without Mad.. and impossible to invade by land, we are safe, we have food, we have water, we can grow oil... I can ride my bike, Our Power and heating can come via Nuclear...

I named myself mopusvindictus (vindictive mope) playing the role of "ugly American" here or there... have fun and argue on our behalf...

and why?

"go ride your tractor" it was an insult to someone... but really, why not? It's a nice life, swimming in the lake, being on a farm of which there is plenty of farm land and water. what do we really need so bad from the rest of the world? Oil? i don't believe this is so...not as crude soars past bio diesel and shale.. which it inevitably will no matter what... 2 trillion barrels of shale... abit dirty, but ours, and bio diesel is all around fine...

the Nation would have less money but small business and American products would thrive. life would be easier.

So is this why we aren't mentioned in prophecy... I can see it, it sounds good to go back to pre ww2...

Everyone world wide says we should "wake up" what if we do? What if withdraw from treaties and declare neutrality... with troop costs cut all over the world and brought home we'd still be spending what we do on development but have 500 Billion dollars more for purposes of internal investment... we can build the products to buy, our trade deficits which are out of control would be gone... I don't believe globalism benefits our economy... I think we'd match the money building our own goods again for ourslelves that we loose selling them in one sided trade...

Why not go isolationist? Why not just withdraw.. why am I involved in other peoples problems? We didn't have 1 Billion plus babies like China or India or the mideast or Africa, we make fine American condoms right here... We eat alot but we have alot of food, why are we here to make sure the world eats, why are we fighting for oil supplies that mostly will benefit china when we have alternatives that won't rise above 5.50 a gallon? Why fight Islamic wars for the Saudis and defend Europe?

Why when all we get is called monsters?

Is this why we aren't in prophecy, because we let Asia and Europe do it again... maybe we get smart soon, maybe we are forced to go bankrupt and withdraw...

I want to ride a tractor, let Europe and asia fight over food, water and oil... we don't have to, it's not appreciated either.



[edit on 10-7-2008 by mopusvindictus]




posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 03:02 PM
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Seriously, what does the world have that we need? We give away jobs, we give away our lives, we give away our businesses, we throw away our food which could grow the oil we need...

And we are hated,

Is Africas food supply our issue? Is the Middle Easts food our issue?

Do we have to have foreign oil, 20 years is plenty of time to go biodiesel... expensive electric cars are okay... if you buy them all from America making American jobs...

Would anyone even lets say China absorbs half of Asia and the Middle East... if our forces and technology was defending this continent and we keep the right to bear arms and just keep MAD active who would ever invade us?

Everyone keeps saying get lost... then we get called in, I say drop of the UN Security council too... why even have our decision be an excuse for hatred directed at us, an ocean away from everyone elses problems...

It's beautiful outside, we have no natural enemies.. tons of food and water, plenty of fuel and Nuclear...

and I'm sick of being called names, my country at least... I don't want this to be our job... We have no innate problems if we tie up proper with Canada and mexico, none, not in any resource, not in defense, not in over population if we drop immigration...

we are fine, why get into WW3, why defend Europe or Isreal or feed the world rather than grow oil...

Jihad, Cuktural revolution... How, unless we invite you, no border to cross all we'd need to do is coperate with mexico...and Mexicos a mostly Catholic nation...

none of this is our problem, Europeans want to bag us, then, become Islamic, who cares? I don't if they don't...

Isreal... smart Jews like me moved decades ago, why live there it sucks... why am I arguing in defense of this stupidity for them... we didn't cause that problem, I'm an American not an Israeli Zionist...

I mean, am I wrong? Why even play a bad guy in posts? Why be involved in any of it anymore?



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 05:45 PM
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So little response lol, does that show agreement or is the concept just so far away from where we are headed no one can fathom it anymore?

Just curious if I am alone in wanting an isolationist stance? pre ww2 standing, non interference... anything along those lines, just non involvement with the politics of the rest of the world

I think I hit a major point here... we get threatened daily over oil... no one will support our war...

so, we stop sending food and grow oil instead... what would the world do? This si the trump card no one wants to mention, we are so evil but we make mock threats to use our nukes when Iran really would block the gulf... what if we stopped the food





[edit on 10-7-2008 by mopusvindictus]



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 06:10 PM
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The People of the USA have every reason to be isolationist. Your Founders were very clear that the new nation should not be involved in foreign entanglements.

In order to turn the USA toward an isolationist direction, I suspect you would need to change laws so that multi-national corporations could not operate in the USA. Non-compliant multi-nationals would need to have their USA assets nationalised.

Also, you would need to arrest and imprison almost all of the neo-cons and much of the Democratic leadership.

Your real issue isn't isolationism however as much as it is recovering the freedom and liberties your revolution won for you and are found in the clear word of the Constitution.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by mopusvindictus
 


I totally agree with what you are saying, the US should go isolationist again - it has experimented with globalism and has not been very successful. While we are at it, how about breaking up the EU at the same time ........ it gets my vote.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 06:38 PM
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Nah, we tried isolationism once before and it didn't work. We're a big country that relies way too much on cheap goods being imported from other countries. So we have strong economic and political interests in those countries. We're big, but we're not big enough so that we can do it all on our own.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 07:11 PM
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Originally posted by Nohup
Nah, we tried isolationism once before and it didn't work. .

So perhaps it wasn't done right. LETS TRY AGAIN!!!
Maybe we can get it right this time!



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 07:17 PM
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reply to post by mopusvindictus
 


Absolutely.....I was thinking these same exact thoughts on the way to work this morning.....Let's call it the Obama doctrine.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 07:17 PM
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i prefer as St. Ron Paul says "non-interventionism"

but yeah your on the right track. now if only we had more politicians that cared about our country!



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by andolin
Let's call it the Obama doctrine.

The 'Obama doctrine' as you call it ... is actually now being called 'Obamunism'. But as he flips and flops that could change ...



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 07:20 PM
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Originally posted by mopusvindictus
I can't find anything that seems to be a true reference to either the Usa being involved in Armageddon or any of it really, Nostradamus refers to an"Asian" invasion of the mideast, and... hardly any prophecy concerns us in anyway...


I don't understand why people refuse to see exactly what is in front of them. The USA does appear clearly defined in both the book of revelation and in Nostradamus texts. Not only that, but other places.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 10:37 PM
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It's not the country's problem. The government that runs the country is the problem. Banish the bad people and let the good people run the show. There would be some sacrifices to be made, a lot of bills and debt to be paid off. No more building weapons, let the troops return home. Let there be no more blood shed, nor anybody be drowned in tears. There would finally be hope for peace.



posted on Jul, 10 2008 @ 11:27 PM
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America WILL go isolationist. The time is coming. It is prophesied in the bible America will lose its 'gates' (points of control in the world).

Once it has returned to godly government, it will withdraw its forces from overseas, & once again take a defensive stance only, trusting in god.



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 04:56 AM
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If i was the US President, this is what I would do ......

1. Return the US to an Isolationist/Non-interventionist state.

2. Recall the Military from overseas, except from its own territory, ie Guam.

3. Reduce the Military manpower and scrap/mothball most of the Carriers.

4. Reduce and redirect some of the Military Budget to Nation Building/Protection projects - ie, give NASA more funding for 'big' projects.

5. Build a ''Great Wall of America'' across the southern border with Mexico from coast to coast - at least 50ft high - a bit like Hadrians Wall across Scotland.

6. Create a welfare state - where ALL Americans would benefit from FREE healthcare.

7. Make Lobbying from private industry illegal. Reduce political funding (capped) for campaigns to encourage smaller political parties to take part in the process - to make it truly democratic.

8. Repatriate illegal aliens to their own country.

There, you have a start.



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 05:06 AM
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"Isolationist" has too many negative connotations and political bagage.

I prefer to say "Self-Contained and Non-Interventionist" borrowing the later bit from Rep. Dr. Ron Paul.

"Self-Contained and Non-Interventionst" : if a political party offered that vision for America, I would vote for them in a heartbeat.



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 06:32 AM
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I will submit that I believe that isolationism is the exact opposite of the direction America needs to go in. I will, in fact, submit that America is an isolationistic nation. The isolation, however, rests mainly in America's sociological and political ideologies, which are derived, I would guess, from an isolated psychology based in America's geographical and historical isolation.

Think about it. America is a country that spans nearly an entire continent alone. To our north we have Canada, to the north of Canada is the Arctic, to our south we have a strip of land that connects us to a largely underdeveloped hodgepodge of nations; to our east and west we have vast expanses of ocean, separating us from the other, 140-150 other countries of the world. Geographically, I don’t think you get very much more isolated than that.

Historically speaking, we’ve held close to this isolationism since as far back as the Monroe Doctrine, when we basically told the rest of the world “none of you are allowed to interfere in the Western Hemisphere….its ours…” Of course, this didn’t mean that the US wouldn’t interfere with the Eastern Hemisphere, although for a long time, we did tend to be mostly isolationist, not getting involved if we didn’t feel it necessary. One of the major reasons it took us so long to get involved in WW2…(but from that time forward we took an offensive posture, since we were the only remaining, relatively, unharmed superpower left in the world.)

Socially, I would say that Americans are incredibly isolationist. When someone moves to America from a foreign country, they are expected to assimilate. This is why when groups or individuals retain cultural aspects of their nations of origin, they’re often frowned upon by society. Being an American, I mean, come on, we have a stereotype for everyone…as they do us…and there is the mentality that somehow, they’re not as good as we are…we’re somehow better, freer, more deserving than everyone else…and they shouldn’t want to be like themselves, they should want to be like US if they knew what was good for them. (Mind you this is merely something that I have observed in society, by no means what people actually think, I’m no mind reader.)

On top of that, I think that a lot of Americans have the attitude, and it is fed to us every day, that no one can make demands of us…we’re America, it is our place to tell other nations what to do, look at our veto power in the UN(which is a useless organisation that could have an airplane crash into the upper half of its headquarters and it wouldn’t make a difference (ala John Bolton, our UN Representative.)) We’re a country that rejects what the rest of the world is saying about global warming and oil dependency, we reject the international norms for various civil rights issues, and we even reject the Geneva Convention. It’s a mentality of “if it isn’t American, we don’t want it…”

This sort of social rejection of the rest of the world, isolationism, runs directly into the political, where these social norms, or perhaps compromises, should come into action to help shape our country. America is a democracy that runs in contrast to all the other democracies in the world where even thinking of thinking like any other democracy thinks, or acts, is treason against America itself.

Where America is not isolated, nor will or could it ever be, is in its economy…in that respect we are very dependant on the rest of the world…but we can’t create nationalistic consumerism, now can we…? That would be awfully socialist…and would never happen because our government runs the way it does because big business regulates it…so, if you want to change the way the American economy operates, the people to go after aren’t the government…it’s the businesses that payoff the government to remain unregulated…(mind you, I’m pro-mixed-economy…Economic liberalism, or our economic monopolist, will only lead us to collapse and slavery…)



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 06:37 AM
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Originally posted by Nohup
Nah, we tried isolationism once before and it didn't work. We're a big country that relies way too much on cheap goods being imported from other countries. So we have strong economic and political interests in those countries. We're big, but we're not big enough so that we can do it all on our own.


Why not... and why import cheep goods, I liked life alot better 20 years ago before walmart...

as a kid I would go to the corner and get a Milkshake from a nice family owned business, my shoes came from a family owned business, everything did...

Now we have mc Jobs... We don't need these "cheep goods" Chinese products are crap and mostly designed to break... Our stuff was once the best in the world...

Thats what the cheep goods give you an 8.00 an hr job in a shoe department or a 120,000 a year income as a shoe business on the corner...

The goverment makes money, but not us... and when the governemnt makes this much, that's where the power over us comes from...

foreign goods and products pump up the nation but devistate our people

and Seriously name the products we Need from over seas that we can't manufacture ourselves?



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 06:40 AM
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Originally posted by Incarnated

Originally posted by mopusvindictus
I can't find anything that seems to be a true reference to either the Usa being involved in Armageddon or any of it really, Nostradamus refers to an"Asian" invasion of the mideast, and... hardly any prophecy concerns us in anyway...


I don't understand why people refuse to see exactly what is in front of them. The USA does appear clearly defined in both the book of revelation and in Nostradamus texts. Not only that, but other places.



it's subjective... but show me where? The majority of interpreters really can't conclusively find us as part o the events anything I have seen is a real reach...



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 06:45 AM
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I don't know why, but the image the title of this thread conjured in my mind was that of an old western shoot-out.

You know, when everyone shuts their windows and doors and cowers inside their homes?



posted on Jul, 11 2008 @ 06:48 AM
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Be careful what you wish for.......


Imagine if every country did this.

Us Aussie's will do alright.....




Edit: (little spelling whoopsy)

[edit on 11-7-2008 by BladeGlint]



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