Originally posted by drevill
Tradition = against Christ words
1 Corinthians 11:2: “I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you.”
2 Thessalonians 2:15: “Stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or be letter.”
2 Thessalonians 3:6: “Keep away from any borther who is living in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.”
(Oral tradition being handed down) – 1 Corinthians 15:1-2: “I preached to you the gospel, which you received, in which you stand, by which you are
saved, if you hold it fast – unless you believed in vain”.
(Oral tradition being handed down) Galatians 1:9, 12: “If anyone is preaching to you a gospel contrary to that which your received, let him be
accursed .. For I did not receive it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through a revelation of Jesus Christ.”
(Oral tradition being handed down) 1 Thessalonians 2:13: “When you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the
word of men, but as what it really is, the word of God”.
So you have at least these -
1 Corinthians 11:2: “maintain the traditions .. even as I have delivered them to you.”
2 Thessalonians 2:15: “hold to the traditions .. taught .. by word of mouth or by letter.”
2 Thessalonians 3:6: “… the tradition that you received from us.”
1 Corinthians 15:1: “… the gospel .. which you received.” (oral tradition)
Etc etc etc .. and on and on about oral traditions being passed on … and about how to hold on to them …
i could go on and on and on with RCC doctrine but for those who wish to see, it is clearly visible that the RCC goes against God.
That’s your opinion. I highly suggest that you crack open the Catechism and take a look first.
I cant find anything in the bible that sets out a "church" as we know it today
Matthew 16:18 – (Christs words) You are Peter, the rock, and upon this rock I WILL BUILD BY CHURCH … ‘ etc etc
Originally posted by EricD
How do we define what a Christian is with any specificity?
Someone who tries to follow Christ’s teachings to the best of their understanding.
Originally posted by doctorex
The very head of their church takes a title that Christ himself said belongs to God only (Pope=papa=Holy father), even their priests take on the
title of "father"...
You had better take that up with the apostles, disciples and other scriptural ‘biggies’ like Abraham -
“For this cause have I sent unto you Timothy, who is my beloved son, and faithful in the Lord..." (1 Cor 4:15,17 KJV)
"...as a son [Timothy] with the father [Paul], he hath served with me in the gospel" (Phil 2:22 KJV)
"we exhorted and comforted and charged every one of you, as a father doth his children" (1 Thess 2:11 KJV)
"Look unto ABRAHAM YOUR FATHER, and unto Sarah that bare you: For I called him alone, and blessed him and increased him." (Isaiah 51:2 KJV)
MATTHEW 23:30 -- "And say, if we had been in the days of our fathers..."
LUKE 16:24,30 -- "And he cried and said, father Abraham.....And he said, nay, father Abraham...."
ACTS 7 : 2,11,12,15,32,38,39,44,45,51,52 -- "Men, brethren, and
FATHERS...unto our FATHER Abraham" (v. 2) "...and our FATHERS found no sustenance" (v. 11) "...he sent out our FATHERS first" (v. 12) "So Jacob
went down into Egypt, and died, he, and our FATHERS" (v. 15) "Saying, I am the God of thy FATHERS, the God of Abraham...." (v. 32) "spake to him
in the mount Sina, and with our FATHERS..." (v. 38) "To whom our FATHERS would not obey..." (v. 39) "Our FATHERS had the tabernacle..." (v. 44)
"...our FATHERS that came after...before the face of our FATHERS" (v. 45) "as your FATHERS did, so do ye" (v. 51) "Which of the prophets have not
your FATHERS persecuted?" (v. 52) "Men, brethren, and FATHERS...." (Acts 22:1) "...according to the perfect manner of the law of the FATHERS"
(v. 3) "And he said, the God of our FATHERS hath chosen thee" (v. 14)
"...so worship I the God of my fathers..." (Acts 24:14)
"...hope of the promise made of God unto our fathers..." (Acts 26:6)
"...nothing against the people, or customs of our father" (Acts 28:17)
"What shall we say then that Abraham our father..." (Rom 4:1) "...that he might be the father of all them that believe..." (v. 11) "...the father
of circumcision...faith of our father Abraham" (v. 12) "...the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all" (v. 16) "I have made thee a father
of many nations" (v. 17,18)
"yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you [or "become your father"] through the gospel" (1 Cor 4:15)
"...not that ye should be ignorant, how that all our fathers" (1 Cor 10:1)
"...exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers" (Gal 1:14)
"...as a son [Timothy] with the father [Paul], he hath served with me in the gospel" (Phil 2:22)
"we exhorted and comforted and charged every one of you, as a father doth his children" (1 Thess 2:11)
"Unto Timothy, my own son in the faith [that makes Paul his father in the faith]" (1 Tim 1:2,18)
"Rebuke not an elder, but entreat him as a father” (1 Tim 5:1)
"To Timothy, my dearly beloved son [again, that makes Paul his spiritual father in the faith]" (2 Tim 1:2; 2:1)
"To Titus, mine own son after the common faith [Paul is his spiritual father in the faith ]" (Titus 1:4)
"...received by tradition from your fathers” (1 Peter 1:18)
"...the fathers fell asleep, all things continue..." (2 Pet 3:4)
"I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him..." (1 Jn 2:13) "I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him..." (v. 14)
What has and still does the Catholic church have to say about that? They freely admit they have taken the authority upon themselves to change
the law of God...."Nowhere in the Bible is it stated that worship should be changed from Saturday to Sunday.
Matthew 16:18 – CHRIST tells Peter – whatever you hold bound on earth is bound in heaven. You don’t like it? Take it up with CHRIST.
Originally posted by Christian Voice
Yet Catholics pray to God through Mary
Catholics ask Mary to pray for them and to intercede to her Son for them. So what? The bible encourages everyone to pray for everyone else. People
ask other people to pray for them every day. This is no different.
and they teach about Purgatory which is not Biblical at all.
According to YOUR interpretation. However, these are interpreted differently by different people-
Purification necessary for heaven Heb 12:14, Rev 21:27
An intermediate state of purification – Mt 5:26, Luke 12:58-59
Degrees of expiation of sins – Luke 12:47-48.
Dead can be aided by prayer – 2 Mac 12:45
After expiation comes heaven – 1 Cor 3:15
They teach that when you die your soul goes to purgatory and that it has to be prayed out to go to Heaven.
Originally posted by EricD
The Catholic Church is wealthy
Some Catholic churches are well off. Some are very poor. Most are in between. So what? That has nothing to do with theology. It has everything
to do with the people who go to those churches and how much they donate.
Originally posted by josephine
and its pretty sick that they exhume the body of Padre Pio to worship it and put it on display.
1 – Catholics do NOT worship the saints.
2 – Catholics do NOT worship the remains of human bodies.
3 – Catholics VENERATE holy relics. This is found in scripture.
and then read about how the
bones of Elisha
brought a man back to life in scripture.
they prayed to him more than to Jesus or Mary.
DEAD WRONG. :shk:
what kind of a nut wants to worship a corpse on display.
1 – the corpse is not ‘worshipped’.
2 – ever been to a funeral or a wake with a loved one ‘on display’?
Originally posted by MikeboydUS
The Roman Church on the other hand does not recognize the existence of Jesus' siblings,
Because there is nothing in scripture that defines any. ‘The brothers’ of the Lord could be blood brothers … or cousins … or even those who
believe the same way as Christ.
There is no place in scripture that states Mary had children or that so-and-so is the son/daughter of Mary and Joseph. If there had been any, then
Christ wouldn’t have given Mary unto Johns care at the foot of the cross.
Originally posted by passenger
“Well, if He was claiming to be King of the Jews and the Romans killed him, why are worshipping Him? Aren’t we the ROMAN Catholic Church.
He sounds like the enemy!” .... , I never did get an answer.
Hello?? The ‘ROMAN Catholic Church’ is called that because it’s seat of power is in Rome (the Vatican actually).
[edit on 7/6/2008 by FlyersFan]