Oh boo-hoo.

First, there is no evidence that Obama sanctioned these comments.

Second, I'm sick to death of the right-wing rule book that says you can never question a vet's military service when he's seeking office...unless it's John Kerry, right?

Third, McCain does have a sketchy military career. Google it. Yes he was a P.O.W., that doesn't give him a free pass.

And last but certainly not least...I'm sick of the Monday through Friday, nine to five anti-Obama threads. It smacks of agenda. A professionally paid one.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
First, there is no evidence that Obama sanctioned these comments.

There is also no evidence that he distanced himself from them. Surely he is aware of these comments and about what his people are saying. Or, would you rather argue that he can't keep his own supporters under tight control?

Second, I'm sick to death of the right-wing rule book that says you can never question a vet's military service when he's seeking office...unless it's John Kerry, right?

If there was something to question in this case, I would agree with you.

Third, McCain does have a sketchy military career. Google it. Yes he was a P.O.W., that doesn't give him a free pass.

Whatever. The folks who have analyzed his career do not know what they are looking at. What they see as "sketchy" a trained eye would see as normal.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
First, there is no evidence that Obama sanctioned these comments.

True. But this is the world of politics; candidates will often employ surrogates to make comments that may beyond-the-pale, offering them a layer of insulation if the comment is met with public disapproval. It is a political reality, and there is no denying it.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
Second, I'm sick to death of the right-wing rule book that says you can never question a vet's military service when he's seeking office...unless it's John Kerry, right?

I am sick-to-death of the left-wingers who screamed up and down that it was wrong to attack Kerry over his record, but now think it is okay to do it to McCain. If it was wrong to question and attack Kerry's, it is still wrong now. The ethics do not change just because someone has a (D) or (R) beside his name.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
Third, McCain does have a sketchy military career. Google it. Yes he was a P.O.W., that doesn't give him a free pass.

Completely right, his service does not give him a free-pass, nor did it give Kerry. However, Clark is not attacking McCain using his military-career as a shield, he is attacking his very service, as you are now. He dismisses his time as a POW as something less-than-trivial.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
And last but certainly not least...I'm sick of the Monday through Friday, nine to five anti-Obama threads. It smacks of agenda. A professionally paid one.

And now the "paid disinformant" whine has migrated from the UFO and Conspiracy forums to the Decision 2008 forum. What absolute idiocy and arrogance to think no one could possibly disagree or criticize Obama or his supporters without being paid-off by the other side.

Originally posted by kosmicjack
And last but certainly not least...I'm sick of the Monday through Friday, nine to five anti-Obama threads. It smacks of agenda. A professionally paid one.

That's the way it seems, isn't it?

I think the truth is something far more horrifying though.

Originally posted by Anti-Tyrant
That's the way it seems, isn't it?

I think the truth is something far more horrifying though.

That truth being that people are doing it on their own, that people could (GASP!) actually not like Obama or not vote for him? I know...it's horrifying!

The day people begin to realise that the easiest and most undetectable way of making sure you get what you want is to simply get someone else to do it (without being aware of your intentions) will be the day people start voting in the way they should rather than the way they want.

“I don’t think getting in a fighter plane and getting shot down is a qualification to become president.”

WOW lol, Hell Yeah Clark Get'em!!!! The General does have a good point though lol...wow never laughed from a political article before







Best Regards,

Richie

Originally posted by COOL HAND
There is also no evidence that he distanced himself from them. Surely he is aware of these comments and about what his people are saying. Or, would you rather argue that he can't keep his own supporters under tight control?

Are you saying that because Obama has not denounced these comments that it is proof they originated from his camp?

Clearly, there is no agenda behind this hit piece.

[edit on 6/30/2008 by Hal9000]

It was right when Kerry's service was questioned. It's also right that McCains is questioned. Many people will vote based on what they know about a candidates service to their country. When said service is a mainstay of your campaign, I say it's open season.

In my opinion, McCain was a coddled little kid playing soldier because of his family's military affiliations. I also question the time he spent as a POW. By many accounts, it was more of a vacation from duty than the typical POW experience. I think he should address these in better form than he addressed questions about 9/11 (ignore and it'll go away).

Originally posted by Anti-Tyrant
You mean, that people can take it upon themselves to make a political crusade against someone?

Yes, they do. I know it's hard for some people to believe that there are people out there, you're average everyday Joes and Janes, who don't like Barack Obama. No one is debating there are a lot of Anti-Obama posts; but that isn't due to conspiracy, but the fact the people posting them feel passionate in their like/dislike of certain candidates and take the initiative to create the threads.

If you don't like the fact there is a deluge of Anti-Obama threads lately, you could take matters into your own hands. Start creating Pro-Obama or Anti-McCain threads.

Or take the lazy and immature approach, and attempt to shut down and derail any criticism of Obama by accusing those doing if of being part of a conspiracy against him.

Originally posted by Hal9000
Are you saying that because Obama has not denounced these comments that it is proof they originated from his camp?

Gen Clark is part of his camp, or did you fail to notice that he is one of the top pics for Obama's VP (which I hope he just flushed down the toliet)?

If Obama did not agree with Clark's statements, then he would have (like all other good politicians) issued a retraction. Did he do that and I just missed it?



[edit on 30/6/08 by COOL HAND]

Originally posted by Hal9000
Clearly, there is no agenda behind this hit piece.

Of course there is an agenda! There is an agenda behind every single post in these threads. The agenda here is that the OP does not like Obama and does not like Clark's attack.

Unless you are suggesting that it's part of a conspiracy against Obama; cause we all know *no one* could possibly dislike Obama unless they were paid off by the Republicans.

Originally posted by COOL HAND
Why doesn't Obama have the guts to make these kinds of accusations himself? Why does he have to get one of his paid hacks to take the flak?

This is nothing new for Barack Obama. He's never the one to make the accusation directly, he lets his flunkies do it.

When it blows up in his face, he'll deny any responsibility, and kick'em to the curb.

If serving in the military, being shot down over enemy territory, and held for five years in a POW camp doesn't qualify you to be Commander-in-Chief, What credentials does an unseasoned, half-term Senator like Obama have?

Originally posted by Unit541
I also question the time he spent as a POW. By many accounts, it was more of a vacation from duty than the typical POW experience.

You're so right. It was a great vacation for him:

After he regained consciousness, a crowd attacked him, crushed his shoulder with a rifle butt, and bayoneted him;[33] he was then transported to Hanoi's main Hoa Lo Prison, nicknamed the "Hanoi Hilton".

Although McCain was badly wounded, his captors refused to treat his injuries, instead beating and interrogating him to get information. Only when the North Vietnamese discovered that his father was a top admiral did they give him medical care. and announce his capture. His status as a prisoner of war (POW) made the front pages of The New York Times and The Washington Post.

McCain spent six weeks in the hospital while receiving marginal care. Now having lost 50 pounds (23 kg), in a chest cast, and with his hair turned white, McCain was sent to a different camp on the outskirts of Hanoi[39] in December 1967, into a cell with two other Americans who did not expect him to live a week. In March 1968, McCain was put into solitary confinement, where he would remain for two years.

In August of 1968, a program of severe torture began on McCain. McCain was subjected to repeated beatings and rope bindings, at the same time as he was suffering from dysentery. After four days, McCain made an anti-American propaganda "confession". He has always felt that his statement was dishonorable, but as he would later write, "I had learned what we all learned over there: Every man has his breaking point. I had reached mine." His injuries left him permanently incapable of raising his arms above his head. He subsequently received two to three beatings per week because of his continued refusal to sign additional statements. Other American POWs were similarly tortured and maltreated in order to extract "confessions" and propaganda statements, with many enduring even worse treatment than McCain.

I know you don't like the man, but stop huffing the idiocy-gas for a few minutes before you make such ignorant statements.

Originally posted by LLoyd45
and kick'em to the curb.

Not quite.

If he did that, he'd end up with remarkably little political power.

At worst, he'd probably ask them to do him a favour.