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L.A. gas station gets California's first retail hydrogen fuel pump

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posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 02:54 PM
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L.A. gas station gets California's first retail hydrogen fuel pump


www.semissourian.com

LOS ANGELES — City Councilman Bill Rosendahl drove into a corner gas station with a big grin on his face. He stepped out of a sport utility vehicle, pumped fuel into the tank and declared it "the most joyous moment I've had since being elected to office."

That's because Rosendahl was marking the opening of California's first retail hydrogen station Thursday, and the Chevrolet Equinox he was riding in emits nothing but water vapor.

"This is the car of the future," he said. "Let's get rid of gasoline."
(visit the link for the full news article)


Related News Links:
abclocal.go.com
www.msnbc.msn.com




posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 02:54 PM
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This is great news! A big step toward weaning our nation off of oil, and an alternative fuel with current in-line costs and zero emissions.

Milestones that need to be addressed include building a national network of refueling stations, and bringing the cost of hydrogen powered vehicles in line with current vehicles.

The ABC link has a video on the topic.

www.semissourian.com
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 04:04 PM
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This is terrible news. Hydrogen comes from water. The tecnology to produce hydrogen needs to democratize itself, not be centralized in stupid stations to serve 19th century economic paradigms. Station? No, solar panel and roof mount with a domestic fueling system, and only a few stations for longer trips.

What the economic cartels are trying to do is convince the populace they should not have energy independence, which makes no sense with a hydrogen economy.

F'em.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 04:33 PM
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Let's take the problem, and make things even worse.

Seriously, who ever thought hydrogen cars were a better idea?


Water vapor is a naturally occurring greenhouse gas and accounts for the largest percentage of the greenhouse effect, between 36% and 66%.[20] Water vapor concentrations fluctuate regionally, but human activity does not directly affect water vapor concentrations except at local scales (for example, near irrigated fields).


I'd say switching our cars over to hydrogen would constitute "directly effecting" the water vapor concentration.

en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 04:49 PM
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reply to post by Zepherian
 



Originally posted by Zepherian
This is terrible news. Hydrogen comes from water. The tecnology to produce hydrogen needs to democratize itself, not be centralized in stupid stations to serve 19th century economic paradigms. Station? No, solar panel and roof mount with a domestic fueling system, and only a few stations for longer trips.

What the economic cartels are trying to do is convince the populace they should not have energy independence, which makes no sense with a hydrogen economy.

F'em.


So who's stopping you from developing your own roof top fueling station?

Maybe you don't have a clue where to start?


If you don't make efforts to solve the "problem", as you see it, you have no right to complain about someone else's efforts.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 04:57 PM
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reply to post by forsakenwayfarer
 


What problem are we making worse?

And how do hydrogen cars enter into the picture?



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 04:58 PM
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This is so exciting to tell you the truth. In 15-30 years time all cars will be running on this and oil will not be a issue anymore. This is a GREAT milestone for our country.
But may I ask, does this Hydrogen fuel work for all cars or just cars made for Hydrogen fuel.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 05:56 PM
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With hydrogen cars you don't have to emit anything. If the source is water and you're emissions are water... well, you do the math.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 06:01 PM
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reply to post by jsobecky
 


Of course my ignorance on how to make such a system is preventing me from doing so. Also my lack of a hydrogen car


The point is this technology should be at the pump but the actual fueling stations should be sold seperately as a roofmounted kit. We all have water and we all have some energy, it makes no sense to centralize hydrogen delivery systems. If this is done we have a very stable economy as energy costs become negligible, although I admit the transition from fossil to water sources could be a bit bumpy.

If anything this is more of a crysis for the state, that heavily taxes oil, than it is for the people. The problem is more fiscal than actually economical or technological. But even that would be short term, as a prosperous economy can sustain tax income, even if at lower rates, allowing the state to maintain spending. They spend too much anyway, would do them some good to be strapped for cash.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 11:13 PM
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reply to post by Zepherian
 


OK, you have a point. But baby steps, Zepherian, baby steps. Rome wasn't built in a day. Given time, however, I believe that we can one day make energy cheap and renewable.



posted on Jun, 28 2008 @ 11:32 PM
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This is all nice and dandy till you stop and think about how the hydrogen is made in the first place…whoops were still polluting the environment….



Best Regards,

Richie



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 12:03 AM
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reply to post by Seaman_Richie
 


If you run electrical generators on hydrogen, then you won't have to worry.

Also, if you have satellites that point sunlight down on these solar panel hydrogen stations, you could probably run them 24/7.

Problem solved, close the borders, bring the troops home.



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 12:10 AM
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Originally posted by ALLis0NE
reply to post by Seaman_Richie
 


If you run electrical generators on hydrogen, then you won't have to worry.

Also, if you have satellites that point sunlight down on these solar panel hydrogen stations, you could probably run them 24/7.

Problem solved, close the borders, bring the troops home.




How would you have gotten the sattelite up to space in the first place?....A polluting rocket.....


My point is.....its hard to avoid polluting every bloody thing we do ends up polluting in the most insignificant way





Best Regards,

Richie



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 12:15 AM
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Originally posted by Seaman_Richie
How would you have gotten the sattelite up to space in the first place?....A polluting rocket.....






You are aware that NASA's space shuttle uses liquid hydrogen right?? And the "smoke" from the shuttle is water!

I think you are uneducated and you are relying on your lack of education to make judgements which is not smart.


Originally posted by Seaman_Richie
My point is.....its hard to avoid polluting every bloody thing we do ends up polluting in the most insignificant way



I don't think you have a point. We can clean up after ourselves if we use our brains.



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 05:24 PM
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Hydrogen fuel initiative was announced by GWBush in a State Of The Union speech.
Grants went often to oil companies and auto makers who proceeded to make hydrogen fuel from petroleum.
Google it

(not quoted/excerpts from my files)

Currently, most hydrogen is produced by the conversion of natural gas, using steam. This process also produces carbon dioxide, one of the main greenhouse gases, which is unwanted.

The electrolysis of water, powered by RES would produce only hydrogen and oxygen, avoiding the emission of CO2. When hydrogen is produced from the sun or others renewable energy sources it is called "solar" hydrogen. Wind, photovoltaics (PV), solar thermal and hydropower are all efficient sources of the electricity required for the electrolysis of water. The overall potential for hydrogen production from wind and solar resources is huge and we have established that a wind turbine may be a feasible source of electricity on an offshore platform, although the irregular power output from a wind turbine would have to be matched with the input requirements of the electrolyser.
Electrolysis of water
Technology for the electrolysis of water already exists and is currently on the market. It is being developed for use with intermittent power sources such as wind and solar. When DC electricity is passed between 2 electrodes (anodes and cathode) immersed in water, hydrogen collects at the negatively charged cathode and oxygen collects at the positively charged anode. The electrolysers which are commercially available are based on alkaline water electrolysis. They have a bipolar or unipolar configuration and the main chemical reactions occurring at the two electrodes are:
Anode : 2 H2O ---> O2 + 4 H+ + 4 e-
Cathode : 2 H+ + 2 e- ---> H2
Global reaction : 2 H2O ---> 2 H2 + O2


The usual argument against producing hydrogen from seawater is that chlorine is also produced.
That argument is outdated and no longer relevant:

Electrolysis of seawater:
The use of conventional electrodes, under normal conditions, for seawater electrolysis will result in the formation of chlorine in the form of sodium hypochlorite.
Chlorine is a green, highly reactive gas with a strong and irritating odour. Chlorine is used in water treatment and in the manufacture of PVC. It can be harmful and very dangerous for people and the environment and in this project we were interesting in processes which were environmentally benign.
It has been demonstrated that manganese dioxide coated electrodes are capable of producing oxygen with 99% efficiency therefore the direct electrolysis of seawater in this way to produce hydrogen and oxygen is advantageous.

Many people have installed water tanks and electrolysis kits in their cars and trucks.



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 05:25 PM
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I love the idea of home fueling stations vs mass fueling stations.

Honda Home Fueling Station

I can't wait till I have enough money to buy a house, Electric Car, and fueling station... That might take a LONG time though.



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 05:28 PM
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Originally posted by ALLis0NE

Originally posted by Seaman_Richie
How would you have gotten the sattelite up to space in the first place?....A polluting rocket.....






You are aware that NASA's space shuttle uses liquid hydrogen right?? And the "smoke" from the shuttle is water!

I think you are uneducated and you are relying on your lack of education to make judgements which is not smart.


Originally posted by Seaman_Richie
My point is.....its hard to avoid polluting every bloody thing we do ends up polluting in the most insignificant way



I don't think you have a point. We can clean up after ourselves if we use our brains.



I think you missed my point completely from my first post.....



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 05:34 PM
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reply to post by Seaman_Richie
 


He is saying that they use liquid hydrogen to send up satellites. This isn't polluting the earth as you say it would.

Even if it did use a fuel that polluted the earth, it would be a one time event per satellite. I believe the number of commercial airplane flights around the world is something you should be more worried about.

Don't fight the steps we take into a cleaner future

[edit on 29-6-2008 by SFXBrandon]



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 06:26 PM
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I do not see what the cost is to fuel the car. What is the price for example to fill it up and how many miles do you get on it. It looks to me that it would still be the same price as regular gas.



posted on Jun, 29 2008 @ 08:15 PM
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Hydogen rockets don't produce enough thrust by themselves to launch any payload of consequence as a single fuel source. Look it up if that'll float your boat. That filling station in LA? Hydrogenics Corporation out of Mississauga Ontario CANADA. Where does Ahhhnold buy his Cuban cigars? CANADA. Montreal, actually.Link 1, Link 2. American sources say CANADA supplies the most oil, gas and uranium to the US of A. Link 3. Who sat on pole at Loudon this weekend? Any questions?




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