Name Any "Inconsistency" Of The Bible, And I'll Explain How It's NOT Inconsistent

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posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 10:54 AM
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Hi All,

I think this will be a fun and provocative thread. Skeptics, critics of the bible, or anyone; this is the place to state an inconsistency that you feel the bible contains. I've been studying the bible a lot lately and I feel that many inconsistencies that people see within the text are just misunderstood. I feel that I can explain how each of them are NOT in fact inconsistent. All I ask is that the dialogue be respective as we debate the different "inconsistencies." So, bring them on!


[Edited on 6-3-2004 by SimpleTruth]




posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 10:58 AM
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How about the part were it gives two defferent accounts of how many animals went into the ark one says 2 and the other says 7

I have just had 3 teeth pulled or I would look up the passage for you.

Thanks



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:08 AM
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Haha, that's too bad about your teeth.
Well, the 2 is referring to the fact that each kind of animal was put in the ark as pairs. One male and female, obviously so they could reproduce. However, I'm not sure what you're referring to about the 7. Just give me the verses, and it's ok if you want to do it later cuz of your teeth. In the meantime, I'll keep looking.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:09 AM
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"Thou Shalt not commit adultery"

Inconsistency: Hagar.

Explain, please.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:17 AM
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The 7 referes to another passage where it says that he took 7 of the clean and 2 of the unclean but later I will look it up for you.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:19 AM
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I used to consider myself a good christian, until I found this.

I hope your faith is strong.

GE 1:31 God was pleased with his creation.
GE 6:5-6 God was not pleased with his creation.
(Note: That God should be displeased is inconsistent with the concept of omniscience.)



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:21 AM
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My bible days are a long time in the past but maybe the additional 5 of the clean animals were for food purposes.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:22 AM
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If you can explain all three of my little problems, I'll pick up my bible again.

GE 11:7-9 God sows discord.
PR 6:16-19 God hates anyone who sows discord.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:24 AM
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My bible days are a long time in the past but maybe the additional 5 of the clean animals were for food purposes.



But the point is two different passages have two different numbers



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by Amuk
The 7 referes to another passage where it says that he took 7 of the clean and 2 of the unclean but later I will look it up for you.


Amuk, I thought I would help you out because of the teeth. Use lots of ice.


Genesis 7:1-4

The LORD then said to Noah, "Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and two of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, and also seven of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth. Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living creature I have made."



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:28 AM
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Originally posted by Loki
"Thou Shalt not commit adultery"

Inconsistency: Hagar.

Explain, please.


Sure, that's a good one. Used to wonder that myself. However, let's look at how Genesis is written. Genesis is simply narrative, just relating what happened and what the certain people that it focuses on did. So, yes Abraham had sex with Hagar, but the bible isn't condoning or endorsing that. True, it doesn't condemn it either, but again, it's simply narrative. Genesis is meant for explaining the origin of humans and the early parts of our existence. It doesn't focus on telling us what is right or wrong but is like a third party observation. So, because of this, it's not inconsistent.

However, as the story goes on, there are negative effects because of the fact that Abraham and Sarah didn't trust God would give them their own son, so Sarah had Abraham sleep with Hagar to produce a child. As it continues, things end up complicated and unfortunate. Sarah and Hagar have tensions between them from then on, Ishmael and Hagar are kicked out and struggle through the desert. So, in effect, the consequences of the adultery were shown to be negative. In THAT way, you can conclude that it was not smart and wrong. And you'll notice that ANY time in the bible that adultery is committed, something always results in a way that brings pain to the people involved. I hope that helps.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:28 AM
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kinglizard

Thanks

That is not to even mention how you can pair up 7 animals



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:32 AM
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Originally posted by SimpleTruth

Originally posted by Loki
"Thou Shalt not commit adultery"

Inconsistency: Hagar.

Explain, please.


Sure, that's a good one. Used to wonder that myself. However, let's look at how Genesis is written. Genesis is simply narrative, just relating what happened and what the certain people that it focuses on did. So, yes Abraham had sex with Hagar, but the bible isn't condoning or endorsing that. True, it doesn't condemn it either, but again, it's simply narrative. Genesis is meant for explaining the origin of humans and the early parts of our existence. It doesn't focus on telling us what is right or wrong but is like a third party observation. So, because of this, it's not inconsistent.

However, as the story goes on, there are negative effects because of the fact that Abraham and Sarah didn't trust God would give them their own son, so Sarah had Abraham sleep with Hagar to produce a child. As it continues, things end up complicated and unfortunate. Sarah and Hagar have tensions between them from then on, Ishmael and Hagar are kicked out and struggle through the desert. So, in effect, the consequences of the adultery were shown to be negative. In THAT way, you can conclude that it was not smart and wrong. And you'll notice that ANY time in the bible that adultery is committed, something always results in a way that brings pain to the people involved. I hope that helps.


I have heard this argument before, but I've been told over and over that the bible is sacred because it is the word/work of god through men.

If it's just a narrative history, isn't that just another inconsistency?



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:33 AM
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This is from the begining:

Genesis 1 :: 26 New International Version (NIV)

"Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness .. "

Why the plurality?



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:34 AM
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What about Cain adn Abel? Cain did all he could to please God, but God just kept giving him the short end of the stick. Smacks him upside the head and whatnot.

here's the beef:

1.Omniscient folk generally don't ask where people are.
2. Benevolent people generally don't condemn peopel who did their best.

The second issue I can think of outside my personal fondness of Cain (everyoen shoudl actually go out and pour out a forty for the World of Darkness, by the way- they're killing it) is the parable of Jesus and the fig tree.

So, the Jesus and his homeboys are walkign along, adn they get hungry. So, they spies them a fig tree, but they can't find any figs on it. So jesus lays the smackdown on it and withers in and whatnot. Where's the compassion? Where's 'do unto others'?

[EDIT]- Bible-loving midwife foudn teh passage- Mathew 21:18

DE

[Edited on 6-3-2004 by DeusEx]



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by Amuk



My bible days are a long time in the past but maybe the additional 5 of the clean animals were for food purposes.



But the point is two different passages have two different numbers


Ok, I know what you're talking about. Thanks for clarifying. Yes, this might be misunderstood. Here we go:

"Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate"

This simply means that of the clean animals, God wanted Noah to bring 7 PAIRS rather than just one pair. The unclean animals were taken aboard in just 1 pair each. "Clean" animals were used for sacrifices for God, because they were more pure, for whatever reason. So, because some of them were to be sacrificed, they brought extra I guess you could say, so after using some of them for sacrifice, there would still be some left alive to reproduce. Hope that's clear. Let me know if it's still not.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:38 AM
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Originally posted by Loki
I used to consider myself a good christian, until I found this.

I hope your faith is strong.

GE 1:31 God was pleased with his creation.
GE 6:5-6 God was not pleased with his creation.
(Note: That God should be displeased is inconsistent with the concept of omniscience.)


ERRR...wrong, it is NOT inconsistent with the concept of omniscience. And this is one topic I don't mind discussing at length because I struggled with Genesis 6 myself.

Let's first look at the translations and we'll take them from both KJV and the Torah:

Genesis 6:6 KJV:

And it repented the Lord that He had made man n the earth, and it grieved him at His heart.

Genesis 6:6 Torah:

And the Lord regretted that He had made man on earth, and His heart was saddened.

Okay, taking this in context - which always must be done, this is during Noah's time and humanity had gone to hell in a handbasket so to speak.

Let's review why God made us in the first place. He made us as a unique creature (as far as we know) in that He gave us free moral agency. He empowered us with the ability to love Him, to believe Him at WILL, not be force, or by "knowledge" of His existence...but as an act of choice and belief. This results in a gift back to God in the form of free-will LOVE to Him.

One can look at this creation and the hopeful result and see that God obviously wants the result coming back to Him. One must also take into account that the free moral agency we are endowed with is that "image" in which we are created...hence, God is a free-moral agent as well. He has the power of choice. That He CAN know all does not equate to Him knowing all. He can choose not to know something.

If you view the timeline of humanity or, let's say the blueprint laid out within the confines of the Bible, as a ruler that one can move along (if you had the power of omniscience) and view every point, one merely chooses not to move to see a particular point.

God has allowed a matrix of outcomes for each of us individually, as well as for humanity as whole. That He knows the "big picture" outcome (primarily because He'll play a grand part in bringing it about) does not equate to him busy-bodying through the ages with His omniscience wand to see "what's going to happen next".

In summary, that God took the time to create us with the ability to willingly provide Him love and obesiance shows that He wants to be surprised. There was no point in it in the first place if this is not true.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:40 AM
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Hope that's clear. Let me know if it's still not.



No its not.....LOL

In the oter passage it clearly states 2 of EVERY animal not just the unclean and doesnt mention anything about 7 pairs.



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:41 AM
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Some references to unclean animals in the bible are listed in the following verses.

Leviticus 11:26
" 'Every animal that has a split hoof not completely divided or that does not chew the cud is unclean for you; whoever touches the carcass of any of them will be unclean.

Leviticus 11:27
Of all the animals that walk on all fours, those that walk on their paws are unclean for you; whoever touches their carcasses will be unclean till evening.

Leviticus 11:29
'Of the animals that move about on the ground, these are unclean for you: the weasel, the rat, any kind of great lizard,

Leviticus 20:25
" 'You must therefore make a distinction between clean and unclean animals and between unclean and clean birds. Do not defile yourselves by any animal or bird or anything that moves along the ground-those which I have set apart as unclean for you.

I think the Jews only eat kosher (clean) foods because of this reference.

Ezekiel 4:14
Then I said, "Not so, Sovereign LORD ! I have never defiled myself. From my youth until now I have never eaten anything found dead or torn by wild animals. No unclean meat has ever entered my mouth."



posted on Mar, 6 2004 @ 11:47 AM
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Originally posted by Valhall

Originally posted by Loki
I used to consider myself a good christian, until I found this.

I hope your faith is strong.

GE 1:31 God was pleased with his creation.
GE 6:5-6 God was not pleased with his creation.
(Note: That God should be displeased is inconsistent with the concept of omniscience.)


ERRR...wrong, it is NOT inconsistent with the concept of omniscience. And this is one topic I don't mind discussing at length because I struggled with Genesis 6 myself.

Let's first look at the translations and we'll take them from both KJV and the Torah:

Genesis 6:6 KJV:

And it repented the Lord that He had made man n the earth, and it grieved him at His heart.

Genesis 6:6 Torah:

And the Lord regretted that He had made man on earth, and His heart was saddened.

Okay, taking this in context - which always must be done, this is during Noah's time and humanity had gone to hell in a handbasket so to speak.

Let's review why God made us in the first place. He made us as a unique creature (as far as we know) in that He gave us free moral agency. He empowered us with the ability to love Him, to believe Him at WILL, not be force, or by "knowledge" of His existence...but as an act of choice and belief. This results in a gift back to God in the form of free-will LOVE to Him.

One can look at this creation and the hopeful result and see that God obviously wants the result coming back to Him. One must also take into account that the free moral agency we are endowed with is that "image" in which we are created...hence, God is a free-moral agent as well. He has the power of choice. That He CAN know all does not equate to Him knowing all. He can choose not to know something.

If you view the timeline of humanity or, let's say the blueprint laid out within the confines of the Bible, as a ruler that one can move along (if you had the power of omniscience) and view every point, one merely chooses not to move to see a particular point.

God has allowed a matrix of outcomes for each of us individually, as well as for humanity as whole. That He knows the "big picture" outcome (primarily because He'll play a grand part in bringing it about) does not equate to him busy-bodying through the ages with His omniscience wand to see "what's going to happen next".

In summary, that God took the time to create us with the ability to willingly provide Him love and obesiance shows that He wants to be surprised. There was no point in it in the first place if this is not true.


Thanks Valhall.

I guess that I'm just not of the opinion that Omnisciense is something that can just be turned on and off.

But you do have a valid point there.






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