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negating air friction for flight

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posted on Jun, 21 2008 @ 11:11 PM
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This is my first post here so bear with me! I have had this idea rolling around in my head for a long time. The theory is that a plane could achieve unheard of speeds in air if the air in front of it were dispersed and created a vacuum to allow for the negation of air friction. At high speeds the force of friction from the air limits the speed of aircraft. By punching a hole prior to the aircraft, maybe with ions or something else, could lead to mind blowing speeds. Anyone else ever thought of this?




posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 01:59 AM
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Interesting idea. However due to the law of osmosis a "vacuum" wouldn't work. reason being is a low pressure environment draws in more atmosphere than expels. In effect you'd be creating a more dense patch of atmosphere and creating an even bigger problem. What you would need do is create an over pressurization a front the craft so that air would then create a streamlining effect around the craft. A similar concept has been applied to that of the Russian Shkval torpedo. Although a different atmosphere and different method the concept is similar by creating a different micro-atmosphere around the object in question. What we would really need is a method for creating virtually friction free material, but that is a good deal ways off. It is theoretically possible if you used some sort of a particle system to act as a "Star Trek'esque" "Deflector" to prep the atmosphere a front the object. It may increase the possibility, but doing so would in most likelihood use far more energy than one would conserve . Not to mention we are now successfully approaching turbosonic speeds, how much faster would one need go in an atmosphere? you are approaching speeds where turns are taken in radii of hundreds of miles.

No argument with you, just answering your question. There are some other methods which may prove... more "effective," but many of these would require the implementation of "theoretical "technologies.

- Maban

p.s. Nice first post! few here descend to the realms of reality, thus a limited number of posts. I posted a weapon system thread a day or so ago and have only seen one post; too much evidence I guess.

[edit on 22-6-2008 by Maban]



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 11:36 AM
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Thank you for the compliment. The idea started when I thought about the suspected sightings of UFOS. People have thought they said they glowed and changed colors and shape. To me it didn't seem like E.T yet more like a gas in an excited state and the visuals would be the refraction of light through a different gas. The zero friction material I believe is incorporated in the space shuttle with the creamic tiles(not zero, yet able to rapidly dispense heat) My idea would incorporate spraying a gas in front of the plane, igniting it causing an explosion evacuating the air in front of it. The explosion would have to be directional as to not exert a force back on the plane. The other way would be to have an electrical grid on the surface of the plane and a gas emited, the resulting charged gas would cushion the plane. As far as wanting to go faster, it would provide greater first strike potenial for military applications. I did a web search and there is some work/specualtion on plasma which is really cool.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 11:54 AM
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Its already being studied in the form of high energy beams 'splitting the air' in front of said vehicle creating an area of zero air resistance.

The vehicle just glides on through this created channel, with no or little friction heating at all. Good news is that this is all tied into plasma research and stealth, so if your looking about you'll find loads of stuff that'll get you interested.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 12:04 PM
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Research Aerodynamics; you will find that an aircraft cannot fly without the molecules of air in the atmosphere, however you could reduce the amount of friction by some of the theories you mentioned above but cant eliminate it 100%. It would be the same as trying to fly an airplane in space(vacuum), the only way to control the directions and flightpath would be the use of thrusters.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 12:28 PM
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Originally posted by Dan Tanna
Its already being studied in the form of high energy beams 'splitting the air' in front of said vehicle creating an area of zero air resistance.


That is pretty much how I "invented" an anti-nuclear missile space-based first-strike weapon. The idea was to put a railgun into space with a laser aimed down the barrel providing an ionization channel.

The projectile itself would have lenses to allow for the laser light to be projected into the air in front of the projectile. The projectile also contained a power source that would create a powerful magnetic field to push the air out of its way.

The combination would create a gun capable of firing a heavy round at several hundreds of miles per second straight down into an enemy missile silo. The projectile would impact with enough kinetic energy to vaporize the missile and the entire launch complex.

The ion channel that the projectile rides in would guarantee very little loss of speed as it entered the atmosphere at incredible speeds. The vertical nature means that from launch to impact there would only one to two minutes for the enemy to prepare countermeasures.

I envisioned placing several dozen of these space weapons into orbit. We could in theory neuter our enemies' offensive nuclear capability before we even begin an invasion.

Jon



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 03:07 PM
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Thats a great idea Voxel using magnetics. By ionizing the air then "pushing" it away with magnetics could work. There would be alot of problems with shielding the internal components from the fields but thats a great idea! Thats how I think this all ties in to "Above top secret" When people see this crazy stuff flying around the Nevada desert and then drop like a rock I believe its the cutting edge test vehicles going haywire. I looked into getting a job at"groom lake" working in the supply area so I could work with this type of stuff. I think it was Northrup G. that is the contractor there. I worked on nuclear reactors for 8 years in the Navy and have alot of experience with controlled materials/storage. I was even at the INEL in Idaho for 2 years which was a blast(pun intended!) I now work at an oil refinery in operations and love working with complex systems.
As far as the comment on "studying aerodynamics" give me a break! I realize loft is created by differential pressures of wing design. Its first year physics! Just like calculating the cross sectional area of an aircraft to estimate drag. I have trained students in nuclear theory and operation, so please, don't pass judgement so quickly. I failed English and writting, so pick at me for my sentence construction!!
P.S Is there a spell check on this site?



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by christopherledwards
Thats a great idea Voxel using magnetics. By ionizing the air then "pushing" it away with magnetics could work.

Yes, it's called magneto-hydrodynamics a.k.a. MHD. Flying in a bubble of controlled plasma is very UFO-esque (glowing craft, no supersonic boom, does not show on radar). The technology is kept secret and experimented by the military since the 1960's.



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 05:35 PM
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Ok guys, the OP was theorizing an "Aircraft" not a "Missle". However they are already designing aircraft to fly with minimum drag coeficent by the very nature of earths atmoshere at great altitudes. Scram jet or "Arora" come to mind? Athough possible fairytail names; Very real aircraft. Why make things more complicated when you can just fly at extreme speeds at extreme altitudes. Remember Mean Sea-level is equal to +-14 PSI, and it exponetialy decreases in pressure for every thousand feet up. One of the biggest complications is the propulsion system(engine).



posted on Jun, 22 2008 @ 11:31 PM
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reply to post by 38181
 


Yeah, I was going to say something like that. If you had a plane in pure vacuum, it would crash to the ground :p Theoretically, you could use this idea to make your plane faster, if it was done right. I'm not sure how you would manage to do this, though.

If you want to refine your theory, the Bernoulli Principle describes the physics behind how an airplane stays in the air. Hopefully you get some good ideas from that!



posted on Jun, 23 2008 @ 08:29 AM
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Actually this idea was discussed in this morning's Discovery Science channel's show 'Understanding Flight'.

They use a concept called laminar flow, using a vacuum to draw the air across small holes in the wing. The F16-XL was the test bed, using delta wings, in an attempt to break the sound barrier without afterburners.

Here's a link laminar flow and the F16-XL



posted on Jun, 23 2008 @ 08:49 AM
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reply to post by Badge01
 


30 friggen per cent.


I wonder why this hasn't been implemented, that article was published in 1991!!!



posted on Jun, 23 2008 @ 11:41 AM
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hate to break it to you, but this technology was researched and developed a fair way before going 'black' in the 1950s.

As for the steering mechanism, well they actually used highly directable plasma to act as 'thrusters AND lifting surface AND aerodynamic sheltering i.e. the craft for all intense and purposes was doing mach 25, BUT the airframes heating and stress was about mach 2.

Aerospike plasma shielding.

1950's. Then it vanished from the face of research in the white world.



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