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Mafia - Freemasonry Promenant Arrests

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posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 07:57 PM
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Why does everyone pick on those freemasons? Don't they do alot of charity work er sumthin??
Have a look at what they are up to now. This is just great. I am sure the Mafia doesn't need their image tarnished by the freemasons.
Freemasonry is evil to its core and needs to be shut down.
If you are a freemason, WAKE UP!!!
You are part of a very evil organization who gets itsef involved in things like this freemason arrests

[edit on 18-6-2008 by cbass]




posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 08:41 PM
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reply to post by cbass
 


Right. Someone is arrested for something, who is a freemason, and this is proof that all freemasons are involved in diabolical evil plots.

Please review the fallacy of hasty generalization, then get back to us.

Did you also know this guy was a man? Do you know what that means. All men are involved in diabolical evil plots. It must be true, given this sort of logic.

[edit on 18-6-2008 by ALightinDarkness]



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 08:53 PM
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reply to post by ALightinDarkness
 


If you will more carefully read my post you would find that nowhere did I say all freemasons are evil or involved in evil plots. I did say however, that if you are a freemason
wake up, you are part of a very evil organization.
In other words, it is possible to be a part of an evil entity and not actually BE evil. The organization of freemasonry IS evil. The majority of people involved may or may not be.
I hope this clarifys things for you a bit. I am sure that if you will more carefully read my posts in the future you will find that most of the time I say exactly what I mean and do not say things I DO NOT mean. I find this is a fair communication strategy that should be employed by all.

God Bless.

[edit on 18-6-2008 by cbass]

[edit on 18-6-2008 by cbass]



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:06 PM
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reply to post by cbass
 


Actually, I think the people who need to wake up are those who make up masonic conspiracies. They are part of a very evil organization, creating red herrings and distracting from the truth. They need to wake up.

Now, would you care to offer any evidence for why freemasonry is "evil," or did you just want to opine?

By the way, I'm not one to follow these "thats not what I really said" deflections. You said it, or implied it. There is no way to deflect once someone has shone the light of reason on it.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:20 PM
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reply to post by ALightinDarkness
 


I could shut this website down with all of the evidence that has accumulated in the past couple hundred years that would suggest that freemasonry is evil. But then you have the same access to info as I do.
Internet and public libraries. That will get you started on your search if you indeed are interested in investigating freemasonry.
The last time I checked everyone is entitled to an opinion, and mine is that freemasonry is evil.
Now I could present a hundred different links to a hundred differnt sites
that would make Albert Pike blush from his grave but then there would never be enough evidence for a person of your calibre to consider it proof.
Those who will not be convinced of a truth are not in my intrests.
I will only try to wake those who have had a good nights sleep.
I am well aware of your stance and your opinions have been duely noted.
I believe there might be other threads that are more to your liking.
God Bless.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:26 PM
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reply to post by cbass
 


I really don't have an opinion about the Masons one way or the other. But gynecologists and the police are definately evil!


Also arrested are a gynaecologist from Palermo, Renato De Gregorio, who would have been favoured through the delay of his case in Cassation, and a policewoman, Francesca Surdo, secretary of the director of the operational central Service of the State police.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:28 PM
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reply to post by jackinthebox
 


You too!!!
I have been saying that for years.
I don't feel so alone anymore.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:58 PM
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Originally posted by cbass
reply to post by ALightinDarkness
 


I could shut this website down with all of the evidence that has accumulated in the past couple hundred years that would suggest that freemasonry is evil.


To which I'd say "bring it!" BTW? Suggestions aren't evidence, aren't proof. Anybody can suggest all kinds of lurid things without a scintilla of proof to back it up. Are you one of those kind of people?


Originally posted by cbass
But then you have the same access to info as I do.
Internet and public libraries. That will get you started on your search if you indeed are interested in investigating freemasonry.


If you've already done the work, cite your evidence and let it be judged on its merits. With fair weather here, why should you expect anybody else to rehash your work?


Originally posted by cbass
The last time I checked everyone is entitled to an opinion, and mine is that freemasonry is evil.


Care to elaborate why?


Originally posted by cbass
Now I could present a hundred different links to a hundred differnt sites


How about some actual evidence of your own researched by yourself?


Originally posted by cbass
that would make Albert Pike blush from his grave but then there would never be enough evidence for a person of your calibre to consider it proof.


And you've come to this conclusion exactly how?


Originally posted by cbass
Those who will not be convinced of a truth are not in my intrests.


Does that translate as "I can't be bothered with anyone who doesn't agree"?


Originally posted by cbass
I will only try to wake those who have had a good nights sleep.


Masons and non-Masons alike I presume?


Originally posted by cbass
I am well aware of your stance and your opinions have been duely noted.
I believe there might be other threads that are more to your liking.
God Bless.


Likewise. However, I eagerly await your response



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 09:59 PM
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Okay, soone of eight people was a FreeMason. ANd so... FreeMasonry is an evil organsisation.
Or at least that's what I'm getting/ 'cause that's the only evidence you've posted. By that logic, everything's evil, because at some point, any member of anything has been arrested for something.
So please, impart upon us some of this library of information.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 10:03 PM
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Originally posted by cbass
I could shut this website down with all of the evidence that has accumulated in the past couple hundred years that would suggest that freemasonry is evil. But then you have the same access to info as I do.


Sure. You don't have any evidence because there is none. You have posted none because you have none. If you've got sooooooooo much evidence, humor us all and post just a few tidbits.


Originally posted by cbass
The last time I checked everyone is entitled to an opinion, and mine is that freemasonry is evil.


Your entitled to believe in whatever you want. That doesn't make it true. In fact, when you believe in things that are not true, it just hurts your credibility.


Originally posted by cbass
Now I could present a hundred different links to a hundred differnt sites
that would make Albert Pike blush from his grave but then there would never be enough evidence for a person of your calibre to consider it proof.


Actually, I have pretty easy standards of evidence. Provide evidence that there is some sort of institutional inclination for the fraternity of freemasonry to support or endorse anything that could be construed as evil, and you will have been the first person on ATS to ever have done so.

The problem is you have none. Oh sure, you've got websites. But I've got news for you. Websites do not always post the truth. I'm sure you've been reading up on your freemasonrywatch.org, but unfortunately for you, I've yet to see a single thing on there that can be construed as truth. Warning flags should go up when the only thing your reading to support your narrow worldview is found on radical websites and conspiracy blogs.

Lets see just one peer reviewed article or 1 academically edited book that supports this notion that freemasonry is evil. Just one. Since the evidence is overwhelming, this should be very easy for you to do.


Originally posted by cbass
Those who will not be convinced of a truth are not in my intrests.
I will only try to wake those who have had a good nights sleep.
I am well aware of your stance and your opinions have been duely noted.
I believe there might be other threads that are more to your liking.


In other words, anyone who does not believe what you say is the gospel truth without evidence, you don't care to talk to. I apologize - I don't take to well to propaganda, I'm used to examining the evidence.

I suggest you wake up. You are sleeping. Your to busy pointing fingers and trying to find evil that your completely blind to the real evil in this world.

ATS is not anyones personal soapbox to opine and shut out people who demand to see evidence. I'm glad my opinion is duly noted, but I'm sticking around this thread.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 10:05 PM
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Wouldn't it be funny if it turns out that the Freemasons were secretly really the ones all along who were fighting to save the world from the NWO, the Illuminati, Black Mass Catholics, whatever?



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 10:50 PM
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Take a look at this interview from Ex-freemason Leo Zagami and that will give you a start. Nothing he says will be accepted by those following this thread by the tone of the posts so far. Why waste my time? I suppose I can be suckered into a good debate now and then despite my best efforts.
He is a little hard to understand but stick with it as he has alot of interesting things to say. If still unmoved to at least consider altering your pro masonic stance then there is no point in waisting my time providing any other evidence of a possible masonic evil that may be rotting our country from the inside out.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 10:51 PM
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There are several interviews actually by this man that need to be heard. I will provide links to them when I can or you can easily find them on your own via youtube



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:08 PM
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Originally posted by cbass
Take a look at this interview from Ex-freemason Leo Zagami and that will give you a start. Nothing he says will be accepted by those following this thread by the tone of the posts so far.


Do you understand why anyone who is interested in the truth - mason or non-mason - would never accept what he says? Because he has been proven as a liar, and a hoaxer, someone who wants internet fame and is determined to get it by literally making things up.

Hes not very good with his stories. He claims to have been a member of the P2 lodge - the lodge which was closed in 1976. Leo claims he was born in 1970, which means he was a 6 year old mason in a fraternity that only admits people of 18 or 21 years of age.

Now, do you care to provide any actual evidence? What you've provided so far is a known hoaxer, who is struggling to remain relevant in order to get internet fame. It wouldn't have even taken you 2 minutes of research into the basic facts to find out hes never been a mason.


Originally posted by cbass
Why waste my time? I suppose I can be suckered into a good debate now and then despite my best efforts.


Why indeed. Unless you care to offer an actual evidence, I'm in agreement - offering known hoaxers as evidence really is a waste of your time. Next you'll be offering quotes from the Taxil hoax.


Originally posted by cbass
He is a little hard to understand but stick with it as he has alot of interesting things to say. If still unmoved to at least consider altering your pro masonic stance then there is no point in waisting my time providing any other evidence of a possible masonic evil that may be rotting our country from the inside out.


Its often hard to understand people who are making things up on the go. Tends to happen when you can't keep your story straight - and Leo isn't very good at it.

I'm actually not pro-masonic, even though I am a mason, I am pro-truth. Unfortunately, you have offered none so far to defend your stance. If I were to ever find anything to suggest any institution wide inclination to support or endorse evil, I would immediately quit the fraternity. I've looked long and hard, and have yet to find anything. Do you know why? Because there is nothing about masonry that makes it evil.

The only evil thing that is rotting our country from the inside out are anti-masons who are making things up and distracting people from the real conspiracies in this world.

[edit on 18-6-2008 by ALightinDarkness]



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by ALightinDarkness

Originally posted by cbass
I've looked long and hard, and have yet to find anything. Do you know why? edit on 18-6-2008 by ALightinDarkness]
Because your eyes are closed. You have just revealed that you have a vested intrest in the masons not being an evil organization. You are one of them. LOL! that's rich.
It is like a lawyer trying to tell me why lawers are not the scum of the earth. Give me a cop or a Dr. or garbage man, but not a lawer to tell me how good lawers are.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:18 PM
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Point of rule for me is i no longer check videos from youtube linked from ATS, except in cases of cryptids or a nifty video over on BTS.
Allow me to rephrase, what do you have aside from youtube videos, denounced hater sites, ect.
In other words, stuff that hasn't been talked about before and, if not unique, is attention worthy.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:23 PM
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Originally posted by cbass
Because your eyes are closed. You have just revealed that you have a vested intrest in the masons not being an evil organization. You are one of them. LOL! that's rich.


The irony is just too delicious - you are using a known hoaxer as proof for masonry being evil, and you have the audacity to tell me my eyes are closed.

My friend, your eyes aren't even closed. Your in a coma. Wake up, go find real evil. Stop chasing anti-masonic fantasies.

Again I ask, what actual evidence do you have?



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:26 PM
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reply to post by cbass
 


Ok, here's a non Mason who's been doing a independant study for about three or four months now. I'm a L1 Tech at a ISP Company, and I come from a blue collar background.
Based on the reading matierial, the actiions I've observed in comparing Masons and AntiMasons, I do not believe the Masonry Organization is a bad organization.
It's a good organizations that gets bad eggs, yeah. On the whole, for the most part it's a group for people to get together and feel a part of something. They all have their personal reasons for joining, and for the most part it is made up of good men, and, in the various version, good men and women.
That said, of course, my research is on going. So please, provide what research you have that is real, and reveals a truye conspiracy of FreeMasonry itself.



posted on Jun, 18 2008 @ 11:56 PM
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Originally posted by cbass
Take a look at this interview from Ex-freemason Leo Zagami and that will give you a start. Nothing he says will be accepted by those following this thread by the tone of the posts so far.


"Nothing he says will be accepted" .... nor should it be. Mr. Leo Young aka Zagami aka raving lunatic (aka who gives a rat's ass), is a megalomaniac and a wannabe. What's more he has mental problems - so it is not altogether his fault. EVERYTHING the guy says is contrary to common sense, but especially to history as it really happened. He's been debunked by his old occult buddies even - the ones in the OTO or Mizraim or whatever - in the forums at Con-Cen, soon after he launched himself into the internet spotlight right after a nervous breakdown.

To see what type of person he is, look for the torrent "Leo Zagami threatens Ctrls life.mp3" at ConCen.


Why waste my time? I suppose I can be suckered into a good debate now and then despite my best efforts.


I think you shot yourself in the foot with the way in which you brought the Mafia-Masonic arrests to the forum. I was thinking about starting a thread about the story myself - I have Google alert too! - but the way you had introduced the topic, promised nothing but attacks from the Masons themselves and a guarantee that the story would be lost in the onslaught of the ensuing Masonic defense (...very suspicious, indeed; a little too convenient for my taste).

I would have framed it in the proper context of the P2 masonic conspiracy, and the fact that the leading scholars in Italy on corruption, Donatella Della Porta, Alberto Vannucci, have already investigated the cozy relationship between the Mafia and Freemasonry; that in fact, it (Masonic-Mafia collusion) has been a common ingredient in the Masonic investigations since the '80s; that the Mafia has been using Freemasonry for its business connections and for a certain amount of legitimacy while conducting certain criminal activities.

Masonry and the Mafia are so intertwined in that country that the initiation rituals of the Craft have undergone a Mob-fication. In the Masonic Lodge in Trapani, Sicily, for example, the initiator and initiate cut their wrists, place them against each other, and kiss one another on the lips. Former Sicilian mobster, Leonardo Messina, has said: "Many uomini d'onore, in particular those who succeed in becoming Mafia bosses, belong to the freemasonry...because it is in the freemasonry that they can have total relationships with the entrepreneurs and with the Institutions." (See Donatella Della Porta, Alberto Vannucci, Corrupt Exchanges: Actors, Resources, and Mechanisms of Political Corruption, Aldine Transaction, 1999, p. 168.)

[edit on 19-6-2008 by Fire_In_The_Minds_of_Men]



posted on Jun, 19 2008 @ 12:25 AM
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Heh, CBass, Fire in the Minds is a excellent example of a GOOD antiMason. You, are a example of a poor one. Take lessons from him, and you won't be attacked by Maons, you'll debate them. Seems like the same, maybe, but people will actually believe you, instead of turn your posts back on you.



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