Are dreams real?

If they are would they be dependent on our mind or do they exist independently from us? The real world exists independently from us. Even though we are the observers the real world can exist without our input. Given that would it be conceivable that dreams could exist separate from our mind?

Interesting concept There are people that say they have shared the same dreams at the same time but in those cases it could be said that one person was the 'server' so to speak and the other just 'logged on'

On the other hand there are people that get death relative in their dreams and swear that it was really the person and not a figment of their imagination.

Bottomline, dreams are weirder and deeper than most people realise so why should it not just be a another level of experience?

Interesting thread.

What was that famous saying by the Chinese emperor...

"I dreamt I was a buttefly or was I a butterfly dreaming?" (something along those lines).

Dreams are interesting. I regularly have lucid dreams, which always lead me to question the dream concept. In my dreams, I have the ability to recall memories from previous dreams and in the real world too - I cannot explain it myself.

I've always believed that dreaming is your energy, soul, spirit, whatever you want to label it (it's energy) proceeding into it's dimension or dimensions while the body rests. Some of your energy (that electrical pulse) beating within yourself to keep your heart pumping blood to your brain.

Energy is everything and everywhere, time to time, dimension to dimension. You visualize what energy will create as you are a part of the grander scale of life. Lucid dreams are a step into realizing the "other" world aside from ours we see.

I could go on for hours, but I'll stop before I start rambling. Just my thoughts, glad someone started a thread like this.

reply to post by Tomis_Nexis

Hey Tomis - Your position is v. much in line with that of Seth -- the entity channled by Jane Roberts in the 60's-early 80's -- whom many consider the 'founder' of the whole New Age movement and the first to coin the term "You create your own reality". While it does not seem like that was either his/her intent the result remans the same.

Anyway, to paraprahse, his position was essentially that there is no reason to be afraid of death, because you do it every night when you go to sleep. Meaning that we leave our bodies and travel to various dimensional realms where we commune, learn and assist others. The way he states it is that -- as you said -- everything is energy and our cells have enough of their own reality and sense of purpose to function for a limited period of time w/o our focus on creating a coporeal being.

An intersting side note is that he says sleeping for more than six hours at a time actually causes the body to begin to deginerate -- which I thought was fascinating as studies recently came out (from some v. confounded researchers).

Although it’s a common belief that 8 hours of sleep is required for optimal health, a six-year study of more than one million adults ages 30 to 102 has shown that people who get only 6 to 7 hours a night have a lower death rate. Individuals who sleep 8 hours or more, or less than 4 hours a night, were shown to have a significantly increased death rate compared to those who averaged 6 to 7 hours.

health.ucsd.edu...

His assertion is that we need to learn our own personal symbology -- i.e. Jung cannot do it for you -- to translate what it is we are doing and learning in that multi-dimensional state. But he also says something akin to "there are also deep parts of the well we drink from that cannot ever be remebered in this waking reality".

I too could go on and on, but want to hear what others have to say on this fascinating topic. Cheers!



[edit on 19-6-2008 by TheWayISeeIt]

Some of my dreams have seemed so vivid that I feel as if it really happened in an alternate reality. Typically my dreams with women was a humiliating retreat for some reason such as hygiene. Not much different from reality. Typically though, most of my dreams are a jumbled mess that make little or no sense. Just like my posts.

If what you said was true for some, then they could be serial killers in their dreams somewhere else in time and reality. Dream about me winning the lottery.


I think it might also depend on the source of the dream or vision. Some abductees claim being abducted while sleeping. So, it may be possible they are also transferred to another body and location by some advanced technology or entity.

Some mention OBE's and being in a future event that is possibly a warning and preminition. I've had what I believed was vivid dreams and woke up remembering with great detail and even holding something in my hand as if I had brought it back. I'm pretty sure the event was staged, but, it was very interesting anyway.

A few years ago I heard a guy talking about dreams connect "us" in parallel universes. There are any number of "us" (yous) in different universes experiencing different lives or even same lives but things a little different. Your dreams connect this consciousness for shared events.

Never really had thought about it up to that time. I find this an interesting concept as I've gotten older.

I dream, at times, in color. I even fly or jump off cliffs and stay asleep, now. That stuff woke me up for years, but now I "control" it with a couple of things I learned.

You know, I just don't know. I don't even know how it can be proven what dreams really are. But it is a very interesting mind exercise.

reply to post by hinky

That person you vaguely remember is most definitely versed in the Seth sessions. If you are interested in learning/remembering more about what the speaker you heard said I suggest you check out "Seth Speaks: The Eternal Validity of the Soul" and "The Nature of Personal Reality". Both of these collections of transcribed sessions goes into the nature of dreaming and the point of particapating in multiple realities. I will link to Jane Roberts (Seth channeler) wikipedia entry: en.wikipedia.org... and quote from:

Each human individual exists in four universes or "planes" simultaneously: the physical universe, which is the result of coordinated mass mental projections on the part of its inhabitants; a dream universe, which is created in the same way but has less rigid natural laws; an adjacent electrical universe, where the inner self resides and all mental activity occurs; and an anti-matter universe of which Seth said very little. The various portions of the self, and the various universes, are all aspects of a single whole, though Seth referred to them separately for the sake of explication. Ultimately, there are no boundaries to the self just as there are no boundaries to any system of reality. All portions of the self contribute to dreams, which continue when the outer ego is awake.

Cheers!


[edit on 19-6-2008 by TheWayISeeIt]

I'll do some research and reading.

Thanx!!

All I have to add is a quote that happens to be from David Duchovney...I know X-Files is cliche at this point, but the quote is actually from an episode of Dr. Katz.

"Sometimes I wonder if dreams are the reality and life is the simulacrum."

Just some food for thought.

I just shared this link on another thread, and I thought that it'd be useful here.

en.wikipedia.org...

I think dreams are just as real as this world. Wake up all the way to the first existence and you'll think you're god, because at that point you would be.

I remember when I was younger sometimes my dad would try to wake me up, and I kept waking up in a dream instead of here. It could happen 5 or 6 times. It was quite frustrating because I'd get yelled at about it.

Interesting read it did on Jane Roberts, thanks for the info

But my position isn't "Seth", it's more the universe, which "houses" all of the energy. And yes, I believe that other energies contact other energies, Seth and Jane.

I believe people fear death due to a discomfort of how they will die in this life. And with human emotion, they cannot bare to leave or lose a loved one, which is a visual aspect.

And the section you put of the human body degenerating due to lack or too much sleep really caught my eye. It's as if the body didn't have enough time or too much time to re-energize itself. Your energy, keeps your heart pumping as you, your body, needs it's own energy to keep the body itself in shape...which comes to what you said of each molecule in the body having it's own "path" of function without the persons consent.

I don't know if anyone will understand that lol.