What do you consider as the best martial art in the world?

reply to post by SKUNK2


For me learn a mix of martial arts...and always fight dirty and if it goes to the ground...fight realy dirty..I have seen a number of fight end quickly because someone has bitten a peice out fo the other...spitting, gouging are other weapons...I once saw a guy have his nose bitten off..he couldn't get away fast enough!!...

Even though I studied different matrial arts for many years..they are sanitized and have rules...when comes to a survival you do whatever needs to be done...no rules and never be squeemish...your life can depend on wether you can give yourself that chance to win or the break to run like hell..personally I prefer the bite then run like hell !!lol

At the end of the day any system is only as good as the user!!

Martial arts & techniques aside, the best way to beat someone is psychologically aka mentally. Believe me, if your fighting with someone and you get that person on the floor, if you start screaming about what your going to do to them then you've won half the battle. Fear stops people dead in their tracks, capitalise on this fact people, scare someone that much before you attack then their putty in your hands. Mind games people, might sound sad but they work !!!

I’m replying anonymously because I wanted to tap out a quick response and have only lurked on this site and never registered. However, after reading this post and its subsequent threads, I’m compelled to put my ten electronic cents down and put to you guys a contender for a recommended martial art that will give you a fighting chance. In fact, no one here has talked about Wing Chun and having dedicated the last five years to it, I can safely say that it’s definitely up there with the world’s most practical fighting forms. Krav Magra has been talked about a lot and even this system deploys concepts derived from Wing Chun. I’m not a street fighter so don’t get regular real world experience, but we put great emphasis on sparring against all shapes, speeds and sizes in order to attain clarity in that ‘fight or flight’ state of mind. Wing Chun teaches you about several key elements to fighting. Namely ranges and the fact that you use whatever it takes to bring an opponent or opponents down. The system also educates you about your body, its limitations and subsequent abilities derived through lots and lots and lots of free-sparring that will deliver calmness in the mental storm of a fight.
Wing Chun is not an answer and as posters have already pointed out, there isn’t one. Too many physical and mental variables exist in real, no rules fighting that no one martial art could ever cater for them all. We aren’t invincible and by no means are we superhuman. If we have to fight, then we fight with everything we’ve got and if that kills us, then maybe we should have run!

A neat dirty trick that will give you a couple of seconds of 'fight-or-flight' time is to carry a handful of mugger's coins in a pocket.

When confronted, even by an opponent who is proficient in a martial arts/street fighting and you're not, it's a move most will not expect, throw the coins in the opponents face and they will instinctively take cover-action allowing a split-second window to either close in and follow through with a blow to the chakra-points to debilitate, or turn your heels and run like the wind (this gives the advantage of being able to find a battle-ground to your liking and suddenly stop-turn-and-fight if they follow in hot pursuit)...its worked a treat on the last two occaisions I've been 'attempted-mugged'

I teach MA professionally, I've studied many styles to various degrees and have taught several different styles. The bottom line is there are no great martial arts only great martial artist. This is of course if you are judging only from a self defence angle.

Some styles are better suited to different body types and some better suited to different personality types.

Actually, many traditional arts are restrictive, I've seen martial artist fail in real fight situations even ones who have trained for several years simply because they are fighting within a framework, trying to be the karate guy or the kung fu guy or fighting like they are in the ring or cage. When you fight for real you have to forget everything you've learnt and just fight with your subconscious mind.

As one poster mentioned the overlooked techniques of gouging eyes, pulling hair, pinching flesh, biting, using your environment and even spitting are the most effective natural tools in the arsenal. A natural martial artist is someone who is in touch with their dark side and can turn it on at will.

You need to be familiar with all aspects and all areas of fighting to be successful, stand up, grappling, ground, weapons, multiple attackers and of course strategy which is most important as your deadliest weapon is your mind, an unfettered mind.

no matter how you slice it real fighting is ugly and can leave psychological scars. Martial arts should be a vehicle for self development overall, physically, spiritually and mentally.
As one of the greatest martial artist once said "In the end a punch is just a punch and kick is just a kick."

True masters know/understand that the purest form of "martial arts" is the way of the self.

Yes there are many styles out there, and many can be studied, and many are studied in learning the way of the self, but when you have learned all you can learn externally, you inner teacher is the one that will mislead you or lead you into the light.

Bruce Lee studied several styles, but he's best know for devlopment of his own finer style.

Please see "The Last Dragon" (movie).

Originally posted by Badge01

It might interest you to know that Ryabko's Systema was originally based on Russian Sambo. But current students are often unaware of this, and have not trained in Sambo. Thus their expression of Systema is usually ineffective, lacking this essential core training.

I actually did study sambo and systema at the same time.

The teacher I had said that it is best to study them both at the same time, and he thought both classes. So I just signed up for both.

And I disagree when you say all of it is scipted, the way I learned it we mostly sparred.

And I have also studyed boxing, and kick boxing, so I know other martial arts. I just found that they suplemented systema very well.
Also I know how to take a punch and have faught a few people.
I found that the situtational awerness that I learned in systema helped me beat a few of the people I fought. Even though that meant resorting to dirty tricks. But a win is a win.

[edit on 17-6-2008 by 5ealchris]

Best Martial Art is taught by someone like your honerable Brother.

For me, it is the school of Kali. Dan Inosanto.

There are a great many martial arts that are very good.
To put one against the other is pretty pointless because they all have their strengths and weaknesses.

Though if there was a best martial arts out there it would need to combine the following.

A soft style that incorporated using the enemies power against them or stopping an attack. like an aikido or chin na.

A hard striking style. boxing, mu thai, karate of some flavor. You need to know when to throw a punch when warranted.

A grappling technique. Shuai jiao, judo, Jiu-Jitsu.

And some form of weapons training would also be good.

In short a good style incorporates all these techniques because it's what is effective in a fight. Flexibility is key.

Originally posted by squiz
I teach MA professionally, I've studied many styles to various degrees and have taught several different styles.

Let me guess. You teach Tae Kwon Do. Are you American? What is the name of your school, if you don't mind my asking?

Some styles are better suited to different body types and some better suited to different personality types.

Can you be more specific? Do you mean styles which use leverage, like Judo and Jiu-jitsu are better for smaller persons? Which styles of self-defense are best suited to which personality types? Sounds like an interesting theory. Tell us more.

Actually, many traditional arts are restrictive, I've seen martial artist fail in real fight situations When you fight for real you have to forget everything you've learnt and just fight with your subconscious mind.

I seriously doubt that you've seen any traditional martial artists in actual fights. It's a very rare phenomenon, almost like a car crash. It happens, but it's rare to witness it, and even rarer for an instructor to witness it. Did you step in and help, or are you just talking 'theoretically'?

In addition, I doubt any martial artist ever fought with the subconscious mind. If so, how would you know? Maybe you mean something else?

As one poster mentioned the overlooked techniques of gouging eyes, pulling hair, pinching flesh, biting, using your environment and even spitting are the most effective natural tools in the arsenal. A natural martial artist is someone who is in touch with their dark side and can turn it on at will.

This is completely erroneous. In order to use foul tactics, pinching, or gouging you have to be have Positional Dominance and you have to have a delivery system. This means be in control of your opponent so that you can apply such a move. In addition unless you have a reliable way to deliver a pinch or bite, it won't work. You can't just run up and bite someone. You have to have control of the area you'd bite or pinch. If the opponent rips away reflexively or punches you, you're more likely to lose teeth.

Here's a video outlining Positional Dominance using Kesa Gatame (scarf hold)



Explain how you would counter this hold using biting, hair pulling and pinching before the fighter disabled you with a choke or a submission? (You might think you can bite, but you can not; your head is held immobile by his forehead pressure.)

You need to be familiar with all aspects and all areas of fighting to be successful, stand up, grappling, ground, weapons, multiple attackers

So how do you explain UFC 1, where Royce Gracie was able to defeat all his opponents knowing only Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu?

and of course strategy which is most important

Can you give an example of a martial 'strategy'? Many people talk about it, but few can actually explain it. Even fewer can do it.

Just curious. Thanks for your post.


[edit on 17-6-2008 by Badge01]

As someone whos done a lot of full contact martial arts, centering on self defense, no flowery movements. I say the question posed by this thread is rediculous. It's like comparing apples and oranges!

Someone doing Karate could come very unstuck when up against a grappler, a boxer would have his arse handed to him by a kick boxer. In the end there is no one great martial art. You should learn a few, hopefully a striking art, a grappling art and if you really want to, add in an acrobatic art for extra fitness and flexibilty.

The big thing is getting the right teacher, don't go to a club that treats it like a sport, many of them do that because they teach kids. Find a club that's for over 18's only, that's full contact, all out, dangerous to practice. Look up your teacher online and see what his/her reputation is.

No one art will ever teach you enough, just my thoughts on it.

badge01

Gracie is i admit formidable and a special case among grapplers. Amazing man, i stopped watching the UFC fights after it became commerical but in the early days, when it was full on, gracie was incredible. The way he always looked for the opening, there for only a split second was incredible.

[edit on 17-6-2008 by ImaginaryReality1984]

Though I've never practiced a martial art, I think Krav Maga and Systema would be at the top of the list for sheer practicality. Both were developed for special forces units to be used in the heat of battle in nearly any situation that could be thrown at a soldier, and both are simple enough to use on the streets if need be by any John or Jane Smith.

I've heard that other martial arts arn't quite as applicable when it comes to protecting yourself on the streets.

reply to post by Marius Blackwood


Depends how they're practiced. As i mentioned if they're treated as sports then no they're useless and even krav maga that's taught to kids is kind of rubbish because they remove all the brutal movements. Any art practiced with self defense in mind as it's focus, will be a practical thing.

Originally posted by Jazzyguy
Or.. what martial art do you most prefer (for yourself I mean)?

I personally have no idea or any experience about martial arts, but those shaolin monks sure look pretty darn strong and fast.

A gun....

*Shaolin monks jumping and crouching*

"Blam!"

Shaolin monk : 0 Guy with a gun : 1



[edit on 17-6-2008 by Macrotus]

To the OP, you can see that the "best form" of self defense is that which compliments you best. There are dozens of martial arts and self defense forms to choose from that have been perfected around the world and many are taught in most major cities.

Now, that said, I have to agree with so many that say mixing forms is always a good idea. Just dont forget to pay attention to each form individually.
My personal experience is with Kickboxing and Judo. I am fairly large (6'4", 245 lbs) and find that kickboxing compliments my reach for striking and judo has a host of submission and evasion techniques that I have learned to use to my advantage as well. I have experienced some other forms, but not to a point that I would take them into battle.
No matter the open hand form you choose, it is also a good idea to get some weapons training. To be able to grab an item and use it constructively to defend yourself is always a plus. Given the optimal circumstances, you can even outwit a gunman with the right defense tools.

What I'm seeing is a lot people posting pure fantasy.

Krav Magra? Systema? Exotic Chinese systems?

You'd think that these non-competitive martial arts would have been exposed by the UFC in 1992.

They do not have effective training methods.

They are taught to make money from gullible patrons in shopping center strip malls.

They do not spar with uncooperative opponents.

Judo, BJJ, Muay Thai, Boxing, Wrestling, Sambo, and Kyokushinkai. Forget about the fantastical elements. Learning a martial art requires effective training, unrehearsed sparring or rolling and only the above offer this.

If you are just starting out, Judo is the best. It's cheap, offered almost free in various YMCAs and clubs. Next is probably wrestling. Start in Jr High and Highschool. Equally good is Boxing. AAU, golden gloves. Get in a program with a good coach early and train hard.

If you're lucky and can find a gym that offers true MMA (and not some TKD school who is jumping on the UFC bandwagon and offering fake BJJ), then you're ahead of the game.

For the rest that want flashy uniforms and belt ranks, pick a traditional martial art that is non-contact and you'll be happy, but you won't be self-defense capable.

2 cents.

reply to post by Badge01


Badge, don't lump all teachers in the same bunch. My Sifu was a full contact guy. I had cracked ribs, I learned breakfalls on concrete not matts.
I had sprained ankles and fingers. Punched 300 lb bags of wet sand working up to small gravel. Went home with scuffed shins and limped for days,LOL. At most we had 12 students that stayed over 6 months. Not all folks are in it for the money.

Zindo

I would say Jujutsu with a little good old fashioned Irish head butting thrown in.

literally meaning the "art of softness", is a Japanese martial art consisting of grappling and striking techniques. Jujutsu evolved among the samurai of feudal Japan as a method for dispatching an armed and armored opponent in situations where the use of weapons was impractical or forbidden. Due to the difficulty of dispatching an armored opponent with striking techniques, the most efficient methods for neutralizing an enemy took the form of pins, joint locks, and throws. These techniques were developed around the principle of using an attacker's energy against him, rather than directly opposing it, and came to be known as jujutsu.[1]

This great for defending against attackers with weapons as that is what most street thugs would use.

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Badge01
Let me guess. You teach Tae Kwon Do. Are you American? What is the name of your school, if you don't mind my asking?

No and no, I did do Tae kwon do from the age of seven to ten though. The current school I am associated with teaches Jujutsu and WingChun Do Gung Fu, I'd rather not be to specific.

"Some styles are better suited to different body types and some better suited to different personality types."


Can you be more specific? Do you mean styles which use leverage, like Judo and Jiu-jitsu are better for smaller persons? Which styles of self-defense are best suited to which personality types? Sounds like an interesting theory. Tell us more.

Yes shorter stockier people are better suited to throwing arts, it's just a generalization and not a rule, as for personality traits, It's quite simple, an aggressive personality will adapt well to aggressive arts while he may be frustrated with more defense oriented systems and vice versa, however this can be good for personal growth in the long term a passive person can be brought out of their shell so to speak from practicing aggressive techniques and an aggressive person can learn patience from defensive arts. Again just a generalization, I'm using broad strokes here.

"Actually, many traditional arts are restrictive, I've seen martial artist fail in real fight situations When you fight for real you have to forget everything you've learnt and just fight with your subconscious mind. "


I seriously doubt that you've seen any traditional martial artists in actual fights. It's a very rare phenomenon, almost like a car crash. It happens, but it's rare to witness it, and even rarer for an instructor to witness it. Did you step in and help, or are you just talking 'theoretically'?

If you've ever worked in the security buis then it's not so rare, especially if your in the ass end of town in the right clubs, pubs. Working at the time of course you step in.

In addition, I doubt any martial artist ever fought with the subconscious mind. If so, how would you know? Maybe you mean something else?

I'm referring to the concept of Mushin or "no mind" it's not magic, people do this all the time, eg.. Driving your car and not remembering the details of the journey, someone throws something at you and you surprise yourself by catching it with lightning reflexes. Athletes and martial artist do it naturally even if they aren't aware of it. In fact I doubt that many martial artists/boxers/athletes don't do it, conscious thought is too slow for real fights or some sports that involve fast reaction timing.

"As one poster mentioned the overlooked techniques of gouging eyes, pulling hair, pinching flesh, biting, using your environment and even spitting are the most effective natural tools in the arsenal. A natural martial artist is someone who is in touch with their dark side and can turn it on at will."

This is completely erroneous. In order to use foul tactics, pinching, or gouging you have to be have Positional Dominance and you have to have a delivery system. This means be in control of your opponent so that you can apply such a move. In addition unless you have a reliable way to deliver a pinch or bite, it won't work. You can't just run up and bite someone. You have to have control of the area you'd bite or pinch. If the opponent rips away reflexively or punches you, you're more likely to lose teeth.

Yes of course. It depends on the situation. You are assuming to know how these might be applied without a description. I respectfully disagree, you don't always have to be in a position of dominance to apply them, I know from experience.

Here's a video outlining Positional Dominance using Kesa Gatame (scarf hold)

Explain how you would counter this hold using biting, hair pulling and pinching before the fighter disabled you with a choke or a submission? (You might think you can bite, but you can not; your head is held immobile by his forehead pressure.)

There are some holds you may never get out of, but not that one it's actually pretty easy. Best defense is not to get in them. It takes several moves to get to a constraint, if you find yourself in one you've failed several times. Training with a grandmaster once a student ask how he would get out of a particular armlock, he replied that he would let him break it and counter with the other. Extreme yes but that is budo.

"You need to be familiar with all aspects and all areas of fighting to be successful, stand up, grappling, ground, weapons, multiple attackers "


So how do you explain UFC 1, where Royce Gracie was able to defeat all his opponents knowing only Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu?

Brazillian Jujutsu is possibly the best ground system IMO, In a real fight there may be multiple attackers, hidden weapons etc.. finding yourself in a clinch on the ground is not the most strategical for real fights on the street or the battlefield and could be potentially fatal.
Much respect to the Gracie's.

"and of course strategy which is most important"


Can you give an example of a martial 'strategy'? Many people talk about it, but few can actually explain it. Even fewer can do it.

Just curious. Thanks for your post.

Fighting is the art of deception, deception on all levels, this really is a broad subject, but much of it is simply common sense eg the classic "beat the grass to startle the snakes" quite simply is to fake a move to force your opponent to reveal his intentions, used on the battlegrounds the ring and even the boardroom. Fighters know these things even if they don't study strategy. I disagree that few people can do it because I see it all the time.

Thanks for your questions.


[edit on 17-6-2008 by squiz]

reply to post by Badge01


You do realize that the UFC, at it's current form is not some idyllic haven for martial arts masters? It's commercial entertainment.

Systema and Krav Magna as example have not been brought into the UFC because the fights would not be half as interesting. MMA is about fighting...I would say its a means not an ends. From what I can tell about Krav Magna/Systema and other non-competitive MA it is an ends. They don't train to fight better while fighting, they train to effectively end situations fast and efficient.

Many of Krav Magna techniques revolve around using your surrounding, what surrounding are available to a UFC fighter in a ring? This alone is an extreme disadvantage to any martial artist not trained in the one on one fighting styles made popular by entertainment.

Your also coming off as sort of a MA elitist. What are you credentials sensei?