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I Was Wrong About the War on Drugs -- It's a Failure

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posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 05:32 AM
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I Was Wrong About the War on Drugs -- It's a Failure


www.alternet.org

That's right, Bob Barr, formerly the War on Drugs loving, Wiccan mocking, Clinton impeaching Republican is the presidential nominee for the Libertarian Party.

Now, you may be asking how this happened and my answer is simple: "The libertarians won."

For more than three decades, the Libertarian Party and small "l" libertarians have done their part to prove to America that liberty is the answer to most of the problems that we face today. Over the past several years, I was one of the many people influenced by this small party.
(visit the link for the full news article)

Mod Edit: Breaking News Forum Submission Guidelines – Please Review This Link.



[edit on 13/6/2008 by Mirthful Me]




posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 05:33 AM
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Now this really is a U-turn.

The so-called "war on drugs" has been a massive drain on the US economy, as well as criminalizing millions of people.

It costs billions every year to enforce and to incarcerate otherwise law abiding people, as well as hard core criminals: money that could be better spent elsewhere.

The libertarian party is getting a bigger and bigger following in many countries, as they see the explosion of PC and the nanny-state.

People are capable of making their own decisions - and it's about time governments recognised this.

www.alternet.org
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 05:37 AM
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yes but this also serves a function in society of waste, employing millions worldwide, imprisoning even more. all the while putting millions in the pockets of the corps.

I mean what would us poor stupid humble folk do with them millions of dollars?

not like wed make a technocracy and serve all the manual and biological needs of the planet all while sitting on our assess. thatd just be anarchy



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 05:41 AM
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I don't know much about this issue in particular but I can't agree with wars on drugs being a waste. People on ATS spend a lot of time talking about society rotting and all that, yet few seem to care about drugs no matter how serious that is.

I imagine this is due to a lot of ATS users... erm... 'using' themselves. I have a feeling a lot of posts I read have been written while under the influence of something..

Anyway I won't gain support becuase of the board bias, but I'm just throwing it out there. I don't think the war on drugs is neccessarily bad, even if in this case it may of been (and I'm not saying either way on this specific issue).



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 05:51 AM
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There needs to be a continued war on drugs, but leave Marijuana out of the equasion. Save all that wasted time, money and effort on that one product that is mislabelled to begin with, let folks grow their own like they want to, start using hemp products and make it to be the wonderful useful herb/weed that it was meant to be, and concentrate the war on drugs on Meth, Cocaine, Heroin, all the REAL drugs that are killing people and making their families suffer, hey maybe the gov can sell marijuana and use that money to get rid of Meth.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 06:11 AM
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How about a war on immoral behavior instead of a war on drugs? I have known all kinds of people under all kinds off influences both my own and them but the majority were good people... mostly because I alienate myself from the disreputable. Drugs do not make a good person do bad things. I don't care what soceity has taught you A person will act differntly under the influence of this or that substance (or lack there of) but a good person will still be good reguardless, just as an evil person will be evil without the need to use drugs.

Now humans come in shades of gray and nobody is absolute one way or the other but instead of PASSING THE BUCK off and blameing a persons behavior on a substance, why not forget about the substance and just hold humans responsible for their actions, whatever they might be?



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 06:11 AM
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The war on drugs is simply a war on the mind,plus MJ would never be legalised,I say regulate all drugs and allow people to make their own decisions.Especially psychedelicss,the main reason those are illegal is because they completely shift your outlook on life and are very thought provoking...not something the government wants! The government wants a large economy with lots of workers that fill their pockets.Oh and if you want to start talking about drugs that kill people..first on the list is Alcohol!


Oh and psychedelics are not addictive in anyway,completely safe,have been used for thousands of years and were probably one of the driving forces for developing ancient cultures,art,stories etc etc Shamanism was the first religion also...again everything is bad for you in excess,thats why moderation is the key like anything else!

[edit on 13-6-2008 by Lethil]

[edit on 13-6-2008 by Lethil]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 06:25 AM
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i agree with a war on drugs. drugs are bad. even marajuana. its a wasting of ones body and mind to lose themselves from reality. its not good for you.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 06:39 AM
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How about a War on Personal Choice? The government will tell you what to eat, what to drink, what to watch, what to say, what to seek, what to think, what to smoke, what to wear, what to drive, what to feel, and so on and so on.

Let the heroin/meth/coc aine addicts have their drug. Then they leave the rest of us alone. Let nature take it's course.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 07:38 AM
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Originally posted by titorite
Drugs do not make a good person do bad things. I don't care what soceity has taught you.


Sorry but I totally disagree with this. The entire thing with drugs, even alcohol I suppose is that they're "mind altering substances". Alcohol for example causes people to lose their inhibitions. I'll admit people's predispositions towards certain behaviour can be a big aspect of it, but drugs (the hard types in particular) can make a normal person batsh*t crazy, especially with prolonged use.

I think it's overly simplistic to assume that everyone who takes drugs and then strangles someone (for example) was 'just evil in the first place' or something. People just freak out when they're on them sometimes and in cases like that they effect others.

I'll step on toes by even saying that marijuana should stay illegal too. I'll give it credit that it doesn't tend to make people violent or anything, but it does make them lazy and half braindead (again getting worse with continued use). Why should I care? I guess because they're the people I live with in society, they're people cooking meals at hotels or whatever, fixing my car, doing up databases... Anything. I don't want to live in a society where most of the people have drug addled minds.

Yes, we all know there are stories of people who smoke pot X number of times over Y number of years in Z situation and they're fine, but overall this isn't the case, people get addicted to that stuff without realising way too easily.

I also think that it sets a bad precedent. It'll just start the argument of "well ONE of them is already legal, why not the rest???" and "marijuana isn't even worse than X, make that legal!!". Errrgh. Bad road to go down.

Anyway... Lastly, because I don't think it has been brought up and because I think it is extremely important to mention. Drugs are ridiculously addictive, expensive and as mentioned, mind altering. It's a bad combo. I don't know how people can ignore the number of break-ins etc in areas where drug use is high. It's a huge problem.

People want their 'fix' and end up going to extreme lengths to get it when all else has run out. They typically destroy their lives by burning all their money and assets on drugs, then go after other people's assets and money just to get by. Physical violence and murder get mixed into this too... yada, yada, yada.

Frankly, I never understood why people taking drugs complain about the illegality of them anyway. Just be careful and the odds are you will be able to get what you want anyway and won't be caught... Ergh.

It just seems to me like people using substances such as these always want to rope everyone else in on their way of life. I've had it happen with friends and so forth and I see it constantly. It usually goes in with claims that "you wouldn't understand because your mind isnt open" or whatnot, usually the assumption is then drawn that it's because you're not using drugs in the first place.


Well that's my $3.50.

In before "you're brainwashed" and so on.

[edit on 13/6/08 by Duality]

[edit on 13/6/08 by Duality]

[edit on 13/6/08 by Duality]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 08:02 AM
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The whole "war on drugs" thing, like the war on terror, is a complete scam.
Think about it, who are the people getting busted? It's not the big shifters, those making the real BIG money and putting it in offshore accounts, it's the small dealers, pushers and users. The big players have already made the huge amounts before the product hits the streets. Estimates I have seen put the amount from the drug trade flowing into the US as high as $250-$300Billion a year - that is serious money.
Now, does it all get stashed away in big offshore banks and do nothing? Very unlikely indeed. More likely it's being used as seed money for investing in legitimate business, thus laundering it into the system and making the big players even more money.
Now. who are the big players? No way could all this stuff be shifted without government involvement, both in the country producing, for instance, coc aine, and the biggest importer. Where there is so much money involved, the likelihood of high level political involvement, knowledge of what is going on and where the money ends up is worthy of investigation (body armour and bullet proof windows recommended :lol
.

Still, by prosecuting the small dealers and users, the privatised prison system gets to thrive.


[edit on 13-6-2008 by Britguy]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 10:52 AM
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There is a case for users of soft drugs to be left out of the war on drugs, and many reasons to keep being hard on users of hard drugs.

I think the UK had it right when they made certain substances "tolerated" - in other words, police were not actively going after users.
Then the PM re-classified the tolerated drug to a class B - which is largely a PR move designed to allay fears about "gateways"

The amount of money spent and the criminalisation of many people has done the US no favours.

The question is, is Bob Barr right in his thinking?

Or has he taken his new-found libertarian philosophy a step too far?



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 11:34 AM
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Originally posted by DaRAGE
i agree with a war on drugs. drugs are bad. even marajuana. its a wasting of ones body and mind to lose themselves from reality. its not good for you.


Neither is half the stuff that I am SURE you do day to day. Yet, I say that you are FREE to do them!

On what basis can you honestly tell me what I am and am not FREE to do?



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:13 PM
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The War on Drugs is a farce because it doesn’t work. Some estimates I have read are that over three-trillion dollars have been spent in the last thirty years (that’s if you add all costs such as direct enforcement, incarceration, etc).

I can tell you first hand that it is a total joke. My own personal experience as a Police Officer provided this revelation.

One hot August day, after a double shift, I headed home. All I wanted was a cold beer. Then it dawned on me – it’s too late to buy beer in PA, where I live. No beer for me!
Now if I had wanted to, I could have turned around and went back to the streets I had just patrolled (or a thousand others around the city) and bought ANY kind of drug I wanted. No ID, no age limit, no taxes, no questions asked. What a farce! Drugs are just as easy, if not easier to obtain than a legal substance?! So what has the War on Drugs accomplished? Answer: Absolutely NOTHING! (Unless you include wasted time and money). Here’s the bitter truth: Drugs are just and cheap and plentiful as they were when the War started – perhaps more so. So what justification do we have for it to continue?



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:15 PM
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Originally posted by Britguy
Now. who are the big players? No way could all this stuff be shifted without government involvement, both in the country producing, for instance, coc aine, and the biggest importer. Where there is so much money involved, the likelihood of high level political involvement, knowledge of what is going on and where the money ends up is worthy of investigation (body armour and bullet proof windows recommended :lol
.

Still, by prosecuting the small dealers and users, the privatised prison system gets to thrive.


[edit on 13-6-2008 by Britguy]


Afraid this is correct:

www.druggingamerica.com...

www.consortiumnews.com...

www.youtube.com...

www.csun.edu...

this last link is a good summary with links to source sites....and of course the U.S. government is not the only government involved - its a global problem with tentacles everywhere.....Drugs have long been consciously used to control segments of the population - look at the history of the Brits and the opium trade in China if you think I'm being too hard on the U.S....its an old established practice among the corrupt elite...



[edit on 13-6-2008 by realshanti]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:30 PM
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Originally posted by DaRAGE
i agree with a war on drugs. drugs are bad. even marajuana. its a wasting of ones body and mind to lose themselves from reality. its not good for you.


And yet millions of people still choose to do drugs despite the negative effects they have on their health.

Trying to stop that from happening is like trying to get people to stop using their cars (because of the health hazard caused by driving), or trying to stop people from choosing to use the train instead of the bus.

"War on drugs"?

More like "War on Society".



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:40 PM
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My Personal Opinion

I'm not a big fan of legislation or laws in the first place and think the whole idea of making stuff illegal is stupid.

But if people want to keep the stuff illegal it makes the so called "criminals" who sell drugs a little bit richer by driving the drug market forces up.

all this complaining about the harm drugs do, it's called personal responsibility people!!! if someone gets so messed up on junk that they screw up over and over why should anybody care.

thats my humble opinion



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:44 PM
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Originally posted by Duality
...Drugs are ridiculously addictive, expensive and as mentioned, mind altering. It's a bad combo. I don't know how people can ignore the number of break-ins etc in areas where drug use is high. It's a huge problem. ...

And yet, knowing that the same applies to drugs prescribed by physicians, you find no problem with that.


As far as I know, there hasn't been a SINGLE death attributed to an overdose of marijuana. Can the same be said of aspirin or Tylenol? (And I don't even USE pot!)



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by sir_chancealot

Originally posted by Duality
...Drugs are ridiculously addictive, expensive and as mentioned, mind altering. It's a bad combo. I don't know how people can ignore the number of break-ins etc in areas where drug use is high. It's a huge problem. ...

And yet, knowing that the same applies to drugs prescribed by physicians, you find no problem with that.


As far as I know, there hasn't been a SINGLE death attributed to an overdose of marijuana. Can the same be said of aspirin or Tylenol? (And I don't even USE pot!)



You can overdose on Marijuana...it just has to be about 40,000 joints in the space of 24 hours...That would be some night!
But really,drugs are not for everybody,but there is no denying that our plant allies can help humans expand their minds as they have done so in the past.I do think however they should be split up into plants and synthetics and different controls etc on both..as plants are usually far safer than their synthetic derivatives on the whole..although there are exceptions.Coca leaf for example compared to coc aine.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 01:21 PM
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Just think of the money saved if we didn't have the stupid war on drugs.

How many billions of dollars have we wasted building more prisons for this war?

What if we could have used that money to keep up with our infrastructure such as highways?

Instead of employing all the extra unneeded prison guards & cops with little or no education who put people down, we could of employed more health care workers, better educated persons who bring people up and can help people with their mental problems caused by drugs or ones that led to drug use in the first place.


Not to forget we could of used that money to pay for a large portion of the health care of U.S., instead companies and people are going broke trying to keep up with insurance costs.

The war on drugs is bankrupting our futures.

It's a vicious cycle - making drugs illegal has made drugs more expensive ,so more people will steel & rob or destroy their lives trying to obtain them.

Most street prostitutes became prostitutes because they were drug addicts and they couldn't make enough money to pay for drugs in a entry level job

Only the wealthy can get away with drug abuse because it doesn't lead them to do crime in order to get a fix except those busted for drugs themselves and when they see they're in trouble they often check themselves into the clinics and they get the proper heath care instead of being checked into jails where they get abused like the rest.

[edit on 13-6-2008 by verylowfrequency]



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