Central Bank Body Warns Of Great Depression

Why don't we just find the BILLIONS that the Pentagon....and other agencey's have..."lost".

My advise....check in the freezer..I leave my keys in there a lot

Just thinking out loud

The simple fact is this Nation of America is in debt to China for more than a Trillion Dollars. A debt squarely on the shoulders of every man, woman, and child in these United States. China has paid for our wars.
When do you think they are going to collect on that debt???? And how????
All your other calculations are bull #.

Originally posted by longgone
The simple fact is this Nation of America is in debt to China for more than a Trillion Dollars. A debt squarely on the shoulders of every man, woman, and child in these United States. China has paid for our wars.
When do you think they are going to collect on that debt???? And how????
All your other calculations are bull #.

That's a common misconception, most of our debt is held by the EU and by Japan...most of our oil...more than 60% comes from Mexico and Canada...and most of our trade deficit is due to oil. They can't "collect" all of that debt, they would be forced to dump the debt (Treasuries) on the open market and would take a substantial loss depending on what price they bought them at...otherwise they have to wait for the maturity dates. As they sold treasuries the Yields would rise and thus buyers would enter the market, simple market operations. We are in a lot of debt, but we aren't on the brink of disaster just yet. The biggest threat we face is how we are going to pay for social security and Medicaid...which pushes our debt well above anything you could imagine; that's not Bush's fault...it's everyone's fault starting with FDR. The only way would could possibly pay it, would be to monetize it...which would dilute the dollar so heavily it would probably be worth less than the paso.

Well there you go, we've got the Central Bank of Central Banks telling us to our faces that we're heading into Depression. Just like the last one they sent us into. Difference is this time there's alot more people and alot less work ethics and family values to help 'em through it. It's gonna get ugly.

Originally posted by yellowcard
The biggest threat we face is how we are going to pay for social security and Medicaid...

Yes this is absolutely true. In a few decades entitlement programs will encompass this current budget leaving no money to pay for anything else (defense, education, etc.) and the interest on the booming national debt will add the cherry on top.

People do not seem to understand that this is the main threat to the stability of the USA. We either need to raise taxes dramatically or cut the spending, I choose the latter. People need to save for their own retirements.

I don't think this is going to be a world wide depression for one reason, the emerging markets are going to bring the world economy through this. Nobody is talking about the Federal Reserve's role in creating this credit bubble that burst because of Greenspan's very low interest rates and then the sudden increase.

And nobody mentions that the dollar is perhaps more devalued than ever, which is why gas prices are so high. People just mention supply/demand, speculation and evil oil companies.

Originally posted by mybigunit
I recommend anyone who wants the real deal on the FED to read this
www.abovetopsecret.com...'
they are long paragraphs because it is probably one of the more intelligent debates on the issue but if you want the real deal then read up.

Well, not just there...Run an ATS Search with the keywords "Federal Reserve" & "Fed Res" to find a long list of threads.

In short, the Fed Res creates inflation & deflation by juggling the interest rates on loans, instead of the government actually regulating the value of the money (as demanded in the Constitution). Since the Fed Res "reserves" only 10% of whatever deposits they hold & loan out the other 90% (at interest, of course), & also considering that whatever money (a term I use loosely because it functions more like corporate scrip) is authorized to be in circulation never takes into account for those interest rates.

It means that the more money banks loan out, there's going to be somebody, somewhere that will be forced to default...Simply because the money to pay off the interest does not exist in circulation & that's money that nobody can earn to pay off the loan! By having gold & silver taken out of "legal tender" status, the juggled interest rates are what switched us to a "debt-based" economy (indexed to interest rates) from a "value-based" economy (indexed to production).

The Fed Res is Unconstitutional anyway...It's not Federal (ie: under Congress control as stated in Article 1, Section 8, Clause 5), it Reserves nothing of value (only 10% of "corporate scrip" instead of money with value), and is not truly a Bank but a privately owned & operated, mostly international, banking cartel.

Originally posted by yellowcard
You can pay down the debt without raising taxes...it's called spending cuts.

And the most economical way of doing this is to reduce the size of government...The less government you have, the less it costs to run it. The government is way too big & has it's fingers in too many pies already...A lot of those pies are supposed to be left completely untouched by government in the first place. Get rid of the committees & agencies that have nothing to do with "acting in pursuance of" the Constitution, enforce the Constitutional limitations on government & the excessive spending will decrease.

Originally posted by yellowcard
...the US has one of the highest corporate tax rates in the world.

BTW, were you aware that corporations actually have a legalized citizenship status? As far as Constitutional Law (& the intent of the Founding Forefathers) is concerned, US citizenship should be reserved for human beings only. This is merely an extension of one of the Founding Forefathers major problems with England...The English Charters (ie: corporations) economically stifling the colonists. Time for another Boston Tea Party, People!

Originally posted by mybigunit
In a perfect world we would live by the constitution...

Well, I wouldn't go so far as to claim "perfect world," per se, but at least our nation would be a helluva lot better than it turned out to be so far.

Originally posted by Maxmars
Eliminate fractional reserve banking, revoke the fed charter, restore 'true' currency.

Exactly...Cut out the root of the cancer instead of debating the symptoms.

reply to post by RetinoidReceptor


I got a kick out of what you said about entitlement programs taking money away from defense and education.

Aren't defense and education entitlement programs?

The defense program hasn't been anything but an underhanded, backdoor corporate subsidy for a very long time, and the education system in this country, despite costing more than the programs of many other countries combined, fails to educate children (which is why we have such a piss-poor literacy rate).

That, to me anyway, positively screams entitlement.

I look forward to the depression, it may actually succeed where everything else has failed: at teaching people how to rely on themselves instead of the government.

I would dearly love to elect a real conservative to slash and burn the bloated federal budget, but I'm not holding my breath.

I don't mind high taxes, as long as they pay for something other than corporate severance packages for the revolving door government we've installed...

reply to post by RetinoidReceptor

originally posted by RetinoidReceptor
And nobody mentions that the dollar is perhaps more devalued than ever, which is why gas prices are so high. People just mention supply/demand, speculation and evil oil companies.

It's no secret that the Dollar has been in a Bear Market since 2001, RR. Oil and commodity price increases have boldly reflected the Dollar' decline across this same period. More OP-Ed pieces and economist rants have been written on the topic of Fed malfeasance, and inflation over this past 7yrs than one could possibly begin cover.

Systemic Dollar weakness is the everpresent undercurrent...gradually, silently, eroding the economic power of the middle and underclassed. At issue, is the sudden oil shock...a direct market reaction to real-time production declines...and future production v demand projections

It took awhile, but awareness of the economic juggernaut looming in developing nations is finally shaking Wall St. and the energy complex. Predominately, the emerging BRIC economies, with a special hat-tip to China & India...burgeoning populations poised to jump directly from the 19th century...into the 21st.

reply to post by OBE1

At issue, is the sudden oil shock...a direct market reaction to real-time production declines

It's strange - that's what I thought at first, but OPEC is screaming its lungs out that there is no shortage, and it blames the spike entirely on prospectors trying to bet on the already inflated market.

Admittedly, the supply of gas in America has been stretched pretty thin since we stopped building refineries - maybe that's got more to do with it than any problem with crude oil?

Even then, the spike is global, and prices at the pump in the EU have also risen...

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


Credit crisis? That maybe like saying we have a brain crisis. Absolutely absurd, the only crisis we have maybe a crisis of imagination.

reply to post by WyrdeOne




(because I can't applaud fellow mods the same way I can applaud members)
.

edit: oh and BTW it's about time the BIS and the other supposed "bigwhigs" and "experts" of the world catch up to the rest of us: from 2004 when oil started it's inevitable climb.
.

[edit on 6/12/2008 by Gools]

Originally posted by OBE1
It took awhile, but awareness of the economic juggernaut looming in developing nations is finally shaking Wall St. and the energy complex. Predominately, the emerging BRIC economies, with a special hat-tip to China & India...burgeoning populations poised to jump directly from the 19th century...into the 21st.

Can you expand on what you are saying? Are you saying that the large populations coupled with their large demand are leading to this "economic juggernaut"? I would tend to agree with you. Billions of people want to live like middle class westerners and there just aren't enough resources.

reply to post by RetinoidReceptor


Those billions may soon be living just like middle class westerners, not because they will improve their standard of living, but because the middle class westerners standard will plummet under the economic shenanigans of the top 1% (the self-proclaimed elite, or whatever you want to call them). There are PLENTY of resources, the 1% want to control them as their personal property.

[edit on 12-6-2008 by Maxmars]

Originally posted by yellowcard
Except for the Great Depression was caused because the Federal Reserve kept the money supply too tight (Friedman attributes this to the gold standard...in fact many countries that abandoned the gold standard during the Great Depression, never suffered anything more than a recession...America and France which kept money tight suffered the worst) after they had made the market addicted to liquidity...if anyone goes into a Great Depression, it won't be America, it will be the European Union who has kept their rates high, and allowed their currency to ascend so quickly that it's beginning to hurt their exports...couple that with a credit crunch and you have a massive problem. Mark my words, America will suffer less than most countries...I don't fear a "Great Depression" at all here in the states, that is unless we get a sudden attack of tax hikes, tariffs or a protectionist attitude (and not the kind that Ron Paul has been accused of being, because he's the only sane person in Congress...I'm talking about us abandoning trade and free markets)

[edit on 11-6-2008 by yellowcard]

That's what you get for handing control to a PRIVATE entity (The Federal Reserve) and not have it state run.

Serves you right LOL.

Anyay we all know this SCENARIO is ENGINEERED just like the last one. I plan on profiting with them, do what they do.

2009 is going to be big for my shares

Vice stocks have lubly profits

I profit of US companies then remove my money from the US (tax free )

At YOUR expense



[edit on 12-6-2008 by mOOmOO]

reply to post by mOOmOO


Gee, thanks for giving me a reason to resent your participation in the 'free market.'

Originally posted by Maxmars
reply to post by mOOmOO

 

Gee, thanks for giving me a reason to resent your participation in the 'free market.'

Its not free, its manipulated.

Learn to keep up will ya and play along.

Originally posted by mOOmOO

Originally posted by Maxmars
reply to post by mOOmOO

 

Gee, thanks for giving me a reason to resent your participation in the 'free market.'

Its not free, its manipulated.

Learn to keep up will ya and play along.

It was in 'quotes' for just that reason. I'll try to keep up!

reply to post by mOOmOO


Ok what shares are you in? Why so confident? Please enlighten a fellow entrepreneur.

Originally posted by WyrdeOne
It's strange - that's what I thought at first, but OPEC is screaming its lungs out that there is no shortage, and it blames the spike entirely on prospectors trying to bet on the already inflated market.

Admittedly, the supply of gas in America has been stretched pretty thin since we stopped building refineries - maybe that's got more to do with it than any problem with crude oil?

Even then, the spike is global, and prices at the pump in the EU have also risen...

Hi WyrdeOne.

It's become a knee-jerk tradition for OPEC to blame rising oil prices on speculation...

2003
2004
2005
2006
2007
2008

I don't think US refinery capacity is the problem either. In April 08, existing refinery utilization fell to 82.2%, the lowest level since October 2005. Contrary to popular belief...refinery margins have been squeezed by high input costs ($120+ crude) e.g. approximately one fifth of Chevron' total revenue comes from their refinery wing.

Futures markets wouldn't function efficiently without the role of speculation. Specs not only provide market liquidity...as important...the spec premium enables price discovery for producers. If specs run the price of wheat based on anticipated drought in the Ukraine...a farmer in the US will know to alot more acreage to wheat production...which in-turn will restore supply/demand/price equilibrium...and allows the farmer to employ his resources efficiently. In the interim...higher wheat prices will reduce demand, consumption, and encourage conservation/substitution for a commodity in shortfall. Left alone, an unfettered market will ultimately correct itself on fundamentals.

Not since the 70's, has there been this much encouraging chatter with respect to alternative energy investment It takes what it takes...I guess.

Commodity speculation is a high-risk...high-reward game. The great majority of small specs lose. I have to wonder how many 'short-side' pension funds have lost their shirts in each successive pullback & rally recently? Successful specs don't run willy-nilly to the long-side without having done their 'fundamental' homework...and oil fundamentals seem to be pointing towards production v demand issues.

With regard to oil...any attempts by congress to artificially control prices will only abet continued over-consumption of our most precious...non-renewable resource.

Imposing a windfall profit tax on Big Oil would only discourage investment in future resource exploration...an expensive, not to mention high risk endeavor. I understand that this congressional proposal recently failed...a good thing imo.

Edit: Housekeeping





[edit on 12-6-2008 by OBE1]

reply to post by mybigunit


You two are part of the problem not the solution,You are also proof that the powers to be have achieved what they want,people that are all talk and ridacule and no walk.The fact that all we do is run our mouth and little else keeps from UNITY,DEMONSTRATION,BOYCOT.in otherwords the control back to the people.Just a thought but then again you guys seem to have what ever under control.RANT ON BOYS!!