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Freemasons and Power

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posted on Jun, 12 2008 @ 09:44 PM
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Originally posted by laiguana
I haven't read much on freemasons, but aren't they like a homosexual group of powerful lobbyists, who worship Satan? Or is that the Bohemian grove? Either way..I wouldn't trust any of them! They are most def pure evil!

And you sir, are ignorant. Take offense fromm it, I would.
No, that's not FreeMasonry, I think that's supposed to be Bohemian Grove, but to be honest with you, there are so many things the leaders at large are supposedly doing on a daily or so basis I can't keep track.
Do yourself a favor and learn about something before you call it evil or bash it. At the very least, it makes you look less like a fool or a kneejerker.

[edit on 12-6-2008 by RuneSpider]




posted on Jun, 12 2008 @ 11:18 PM
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First of all.. The Grove is just as "secret" as Freemasonry; however, like anyone who has private property..or private golf course.. you will get kicked out if you are either not invited or not a member. Any homosexual acts that go on there, may fall under the same % of how many homosexual acts are going on in your town, if not less. There are homosexuals everywhere in the world ( excpet Iran). People who are looking to take your money ascribe all of these false and outstanding claims to the most simple and also.. one of the most uncomfortable places one can stay at... mostly because the cots are lumpy, flushing toilets is asked to be done only if there is solid waste.. and its just very damp... Long story short.. it isn't a big deal at all! It is a place to promote leadership.. share ideas.. and to boost moral. Its much like reading the book "who moved my cheese" or the "fish philosophy" and yes.. much like freemasonry.. stories and dramas are used to bring forth a message.

In a perfect world.. people would actually go and see if they can join something... become apart of it.. see what it is like.. and if you still didn't like it.. then you can come back on here and spread your message. Sadly for both topics.. you would have to make things up to make it sound the least bit interesting. Otherwise this board would be nothing more than CGI UFO vids, Bush bashing, and freaking out about a "movie clip" that may or may not show an alien head in some guys window. But hey.. thats why we like it here! lol


PS. Rune this post has nothing to do with what you said... just responding to the lizard man and a number of other things i read when i came back on

[edit on 12-6-2008 by ThirtySecond]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:23 AM
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reply to post by RuneSpider
 


actually I've read enough that allows me to conclude that freemasons worship Lucifer. I mean, there's thousands worth of articles out there clearly tying Luciferian worship with freemasonary...my guess is that the freemasons are hoping to build up the anti-christ's power world wide. There's no doubt in my mind this group is extremely evil and possibly behind a lot of murders and child sacrifice.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:26 AM
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What articles are you referring to. Could you please support your theories.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:29 AM
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reply to post by laiguana
 


I seriously hope thats sarcasm I detect. If not...my, my....I'm speechless - and thats rare on ATS.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 01:41 AM
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From what i understand you guys seem to be talking about the power inside all human beings and how we use our power.

The shamans say that awareness wasnt the correct word for the human experience, so they started more accurately calling it Attention.

Our attention is a force emminating from us. We creaate our reality based on our attention as well. remove your attention from the world you cling to with your attention and the world collapses.

So you seem to be talking about the importance of what humans identify with and their attention. Words can be manipulated and used to decieve people. Symbols is more of our root language. Some symbols are like the pentagram are universal.

Attention, or projection of energy is tied into ritualism. These symbols have been focused on and used in rituals throughtout millenia and thru out the universe as well.

So these churches are using sorcery by getting you to focus on their symbols. Somehow this transfers your power unto them.

Of course people have to seek for themselves. So masons or secret societies cant just cram this stuff down your throat. But those who selfishly keep the highest secrets for their own gain....well thats a huge mistake also.

I dont understand the complications of all these various societies. But i do know that greedy fools are taking over the world. So what are these benevolent secret societies going to do about it. THey condone slavery of the masses as long as they are buddies with these other fraternities?

Doesnt make sense. Most of them are selfish fools making excuses for being righteous. Ive got secrets too. THey are exploiting humans to empower them, to control us, since we are so incapable and need to be sheep herded. do u see the stupidity in their attitude?? Blaming us for our stupidity when they are stepping on us as well to gain control to so called help us? Its better to live in chaos freely than controlled slavery peace.

Do any of you want to trade secrets?

I think metatrons cube would be a very important symbol and geometry. It can be looked at in so many ways.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 02:04 AM
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So each and every secret society guy ...went within and channeled all this knowedge from the inner realm of their being?

Lol...No they raped and pillaged ancient societies of this knowledge. Babylon and egypt being the big two that i know of. THey are now hiding all these scriptures and whatever they found in jerusalem or the egyptian burned libraries or pyramids, etc.

What a bunch of caring giving guys. Im sure some of u masons are doing some good. But could someone explain the power strucutres between all these groups. whos winning? Who can we cheer for? Please tell us something that matters.

If these societies are so wise , im sure they have buddhas at the top. Not some power hungry egomaniac. Theres almost no chance the pope or other figureheads are enlightened. They are too submersed with their self identity and title or entitlement. lol

Shamans dont have time or reason to care about power structures. U guys should go find some shamans to come lead your unenlightened societies to higher levels.

Thier power and money aphrodesiacs are peanuts compared to a empowered awakened society. It would be like everyone free of stupid selfishness and fear with massive amounts of energy to spend on incredible creativity, orgies, cities filled with wonder, mind boggling technology, all while we are experiencing life in a sort of psychedelic society, where everyone wins and has enormous love and help for others.

So secret societies should read Dosteovskys's "The Idiot"....for who really is the idiot here? ay

Freedom!!



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 07:51 AM
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reply to post by laiguana
 


Look man, I'm not going to guess how many sites you probably pulled those articles form, but have you actually looked at any of the supporting evidence, or any of the people involved?
Most of the time the sole reason people are tied to Masonry is the variety of ways they place their hands, about 90% of which are normal hand placings everyone uses. Five percent or so of the left overs are just unique to themselves, favoring a sore arm or joint and basically just products of where they grew up. The rest is a medley of hand signs people just throw around.

Most of the info that gets brought up is from hoaxes, either directly or indirectly, false quotes, or, and this one is a bit difficult, quotes taken out of context.
The problem with quotes taken out of context is that the context could require a fair amount of previous reading, or just that same page.

I've been making a sort of personal study of Masonry for a few months now, and my personal observation of Masonry is of a mostly good organization, with a bunch of bad apples that make it look bad for everyone else. On top of that, you have groups that get together and call themselves Masonry, like you have groups that call themselves the Illuminati, that actually have no ties with the group and help add to the confusion.

Also: Work computers with no site blocking are awesome.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 08:42 AM
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I agree with runespider, yes, things get taken out of context and with so much e-information out there it is hard to weed through it in a timely matter.
As far as Freemasons and Power as the forum title states I want to give a more direct example of what I think these threads are getting at:
A judge in a court of law is a mason and one of his fellow lodge members happens to come before him in court out of sheer coincidence. The accused will surely have a lesser sentence than one who would not be a mason. That is the conflict of interest so to speak of masonic power in public office.
The INTENTION to do good deeds in our society does not outweigh the right of blind justice.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 09:20 AM
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reply to post by daemonicsoul
 

Very simplely both. My father was a mason,but he passed before I thought of becoming one. I have always been a seeker thourgh. So I have to say both ways in my case



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 09:33 AM
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reply to post by liamoohay
 

I can't give you an example of a court case, but I seen times when a mason worked for another mason. In these cases I have found that the standard of work set for the mason was harder than for the nonmasons on the crew. The boss expected more out of his mason worker or didn't want anyone to think he was showing favoritism



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 10:36 AM
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Originally posted by liamoohay
A judge in a court of law is a mason and one of his fellow lodge members happens to come before him in court out of sheer coincidence. The accused will surely have a lesser sentence than one who would not be a mason.
Can you cite just one case where that has actually happened, or are you just assuming that is has?

[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 10:52 AM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by liamoohay
A judge in a court of law is a mason and one of his fellow lodge members happens to come before him in court out of sheer coincidence. The accused will surely have a lesser sentence than one who would not be a mason.
Can you cite just one case where that has actually happened, or are you just assuming that is has?

[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]

No I can not. How could I? I would pose the opposite question to you: Could you prove in the same circumstance that, that would not happen?
The reason I used that particular example was that a co-worker of mine recently joined the Freemasons and is very excited about it, he relayed to me that he was introduced to a judge at a dinner that was being held for new members or something like that. Now you have got to be joking or live in a cave (not literally ok) if you think that there would be no favoritism if these two met in a courtroom as per my example.
It's the American way: It's who you know. So please don't patronize me.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 11:01 AM
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Originally posted by lost in the midwest
reply to post by liamoohay
 

I can't give you an example of a court case, but I seen times when a mason worked for another mason. In these cases I have found that the standard of work set for the mason was harder than for the nonmasons on the crew. The boss expected more out of his mason worker or didn't want anyone to think he was showing favoritism


I see your point. Apples and oranges though.
To me what your talking about is a quality of work issue as opposed to favoritism in a court of law.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 11:26 AM
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Originally posted by liamoohay

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by liamoohay
A judge in a court of law is a mason and one of his fellow lodge members happens to come before him in court out of sheer coincidence. The accused will surely have a lesser sentence than one who would not be a mason.
Can you cite just one case where that has actually happened, or are you just assuming that is has?

[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]

No I can not. How could I?
How could you show that it had taken place? Just once in the entire history of jurisprudence?

  1. Show that the judge in a case was a Mason.
  2. Show that the defendant in the case was a Mason.
  3. Show the judge's history of sentencing on similar charges
  4. Verify that the sentence applied to the Masonic defendant was considerably less than any the judge had made against non-Masonic defendants in his courtroom.

Each of those steps should be possible. Let us know what you find.

I would pose the opposite question to you: Could you prove in the same circumstance that, that would not happen?
You are asking hypotheticals which can't be proven. I am asking for historical precedence which you assume exists. Hypothetically the judge and the defendant could both be Lectroids from Planet 10, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over wondering if that's true.


The reason I used that particular example was that a co-worker of mine recently joined the Freemasons and is very excited about it, he relayed to me that he was introduced to a judge at a dinner that was being held for new members or something like that. Now you have got to be joking or live in a cave (not literally ok) if you think that there would be no favoritism if these two met in a courtroom as per my example.
It's the American way: It's who you know. So please don't patronize me.
No. Patronizing is treating with kindness while feeling superiority. I'm being neither kind nor superior. I'm asking for facts and you're making assumptions. If you want me to answer your unfounded assumptions with some of my own, then I would assume in a case such as you describe, were the charges significant enough to warrant it, the judge would inform the lodge that the defendant was unworthy to remain a Mason, and he'd be barred from ever returning to the lodge or joining another lodge. Simultaneously, the judge would rule based on the merits of the case as he has sworn to do. (For in his Masonic obligation, he's also sworn to uphold the law and government of his country before all else.)



[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:22 PM
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Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by liamoohay

Originally posted by JoshNorton

Originally posted by liamoohay
A judge in a court of law is a mason and one of his fellow lodge members happens to come before him in court out of sheer coincidence. The accused will surely have a lesser sentence than one who would not be a mason.
Can you cite just one case where that has actually happened, or are you just assuming that is has?

[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]

No I can not. How could I?
How could you show that it had taken place? Just once in the entire history of jurisprudence?

Each of those steps should be possible. Let us know what you find.

I would pose the opposite question to you: Could you prove in the same circumstance that, that would not happen?
You are asking hypotheticals which can't be proven. I am asking for historical precedence which you assume exists. Hypothetically the judge and the defendant could both be Lectroids from Planet 10, but I'm not going to lose any sleep over wondering if that's true.


The reason I used that particular example was that a co-worker of mine recently joined the Freemasons and is very excited about it, he relayed to me that he was introduced to a judge at a dinner that was being held for new members or something like that. Now you have got to be joking or live in a cave (not literally ok) if you think that there would be no favoritism if these two met in a courtroom as per my example.
It's the American way: It's who you know. So please don't patronize me.
No. Patronizing is treating with kindness while feeling superiority. I'm being neither kind nor superior. I'm asking for facts and you're making assumptions. If you want me to answer your unfounded assumptions with some of my own, then I would assume in a case such as you describe, were the charges significant enough to warrant it, the judge would inform the lodge that the defendant was unworthy to remain a Mason, and he'd be barred from ever returning to the lodge or joining another lodge. Simultaneously, the judge would rule based on the merits of the case as he has sworn to do. (For in his Masonic obligation, he's also sworn to uphold the law and government of his country before all else.)
[edit on 6/13/2008 by JoshNorton]


Ok, first of all I apologize for the remark about patronizing me, my short fuse went off.
I was giving an example/hypothesis, whatever you care to call it. I don't have the capacity nor the lifespan to go through countless court documents to actually demonstrate that something like this has ever taken place but I am sure it can be done. There are a lot of what ifs, I know, like what relationship these two might have with each other. As well, any Judge being a member of any fraternal group should be open to constructive criticism for obvious reasons.
I was trying to show a broader picture in that any outside organization should have no effect whatsoever in government and, as you have stated "the judge would inform the lodge that the defendant was unworthy to remain a Mason" that in of itself crosses the line of church and state (for lack of a better analogy) not to mention any privacy laws that might be broken, in my eyes.
Am I correct in thinking that your opinion is that what I gave as an example does not happen?
I cannot prove that George Bush is our president. I have never seen him personally. I cannot prove someone somewhere is suffering but I am sure of it. Your right in my example I am assuming, but that is not to say it does not happen
So......Lectroids from planet 10 aye, so thats the big secret.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:31 PM
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Originally posted by liamoohay
Am I correct in thinking that your opinion is that what I gave as an example does not happen?
Could it happen? Certainly. Is it a foregone conclusion that it will happen? In my opinion, no. It brings up the whole actions-of-the-individual vs reflection-of-the-group issue. It is common (although lazy) for people to use such broad strokes. Ultimately I can only hope that reason prevails.

Now, you touched on the idea of a judge overstepping his bounds by calling for a Masonic trial based on his insider knowledge of the case. Of course, I was only offering one possible approach to such a situation. But unlike churches & confession, the law is a matter of public record. Even if it weren't the judge, if any other member of the lodge discovered that a brother had been convicted of a felony, actions would have to be taken at the Masonic level.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:32 PM
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Look, a good lawyer would find out about the judge being a Freemason and the defendant being a Freemason, and therefore be able to declare mistrial.
Heck, I be a crud laywer could and would as well. As for taking a lifetime... I'm pretty sure there is a resource of some kind to provide a list of the Judge's ruling.
Take that, and you'll be able to find a common thread with his rulings.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by liamoohay

No I can not. How could I? I would pose the opposite question to you: Could you prove in the same circumstance that, that would not happen?


In such a case, the judge who was a Freemason would probably excuse himself from presiding. If not, he would likely be harsh toward the defendant if guilty, instead of lenient. Freemasons do not take kindly to other Masons giving us a bad name by committing crimes.



posted on Jun, 13 2008 @ 12:47 PM
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I'll save the broad and lazy strokes for a Chinese calligraphy class, thank you.
I think my point is being entirely overlooked and obfuscated.
My opinion is that any public official be it by popular vote or as an appointed position should not have ties with any entity that has the capacity of potential abuse or conflict of interest.
Your mood being anarchic as your avatar shows I would think you would agree.
Questioning authority is a good thing.

[edit on 6/13/2008 by liamoohay]



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