Freemasons and Power

reply to post by liamoohay


Why, may I ask, is that humorous?

It's the irony of the phrase pertaining to actual masons trade work i.e. mortar, concrete, stone, etc. "set in stone" get it?

But in writing this I have noticed ...and in no way am I presuming to know your ideologies-you are in fact being a bit hypocritical. "fueled by their hatred and bigotry"? (sorry if the quote is not exact, If I press the back button I will lose what I have written). The hypocrisy being that it seems your mind is "set in stone" about a generalization of a group of people. I am not trying to pick apart semantics here. I just thought it was funny.

"We all make our own reality."
-my ex-girlfriend



[edit on 6/12/2008 by liamoohay]

Originally posted by liamoohay

As an example let me point out an obvious symbol that everyone is aware of that has it's origins in freemasonry. Where I live, painted on either side of a police car is a star (a seven pointed one to be exact), now, when the tentacles of any organization regardless of any direct or indirect involvement, have spread as far as having a police force (not to mention one that has guns) it goes without saying that people are going to feel-to quote a post on this site "under duress". IMHO

How exactly does a police badge have "its origins in Freemasonry". I'd thought I'd heard them all, but that one's a new one.

reply to post by Rockpuck

I have been misinformed and stand corrected then.

Originally posted by applebiter
beyond our comprehension.

I stopped reading after seeing this. If there's one thing I've learned while being a part of this site, it's that one line right there that is a huge red flag for BS. It has got to be the #1 go to card to play out of the enlightenment playbook. "beyond comprehension" is just another way of saying, "it's impossible for you to understand, therefore I don't have to provide any evidence because you couldn't understand it as evidence."

Seriously, if you really want to NOT be part of the exclusive internet club of BSers I suggest you start coughing up some real evidence. Otherwise you will be regarded as yet another person looking for attention with the tired excuse of why one can't provide evidence, "it's beyond your comprehension."

I like to think that anyone who is for real will post on these boards for one reason and one reason alone: They're tired of holding the secrets in and will provide the evidence to back up their claims. Without the evidence it just makes claims nothing more than good what if stories for TV. Case in point: I just watched a show last night about Freemasons and the various conspiracies based around them. No evidence whatsoever to back up the conspiracy claims, but it makes for damn good what if TV.

You are correct. It does make for some very good TV drama. I too saw the show, i think it was on the History Chan. Personally i have been interviewed for these shows and at the end of the day, when all the editing is done, there absolutly nothing correct or in correct about it. The purpose is to want you to watch the next show they make.

Freemason's are the most open band of brothers that anyone will come across. It boggles my mind that so many people just wish to do nothing but create false and often misleading accounts on our history, our purpose and meaning. I do understand that many people have a need to feel that there is something greater than them spinning this thing we call society. Be it that it makes them sleep better at night, or the opposite, I will not begrudge a man who has thoughts and opinions.. even if those opinions or thoughts are held together with nothing but the bond of ignorance. I urge you all to go out, visit a lodge, talk to the brothers or.. don't talk to them.. just witness. If you feel a connection, ask to join, enjoy our degrees and if you can still hold your personal feelings to be true.. more power to you.

Thank you

Originally posted by liamoohay
It's the irony of the phrase pertaining to actual masons trade work i.e. mortar, concrete, stone, etc. "set in stone" get it?

But in writing this I have noticed ...and in no way am I presuming to know your ideologies-you are in fact being a bit hypocritical. "fueled by their hatred and bigotry"? (sorry if the quote is not exact, If I press the back button I will lose what I have written). The hypocrisy being that it seems your mind is "set in stone" about a generalization of a group of people. I am not trying to pick apart semantics here. I just thought it was funny.

HA, didn't notice my own pun.

Yes, you could very well say that I am in fact narrow minded in my viewings of Anti-Freemasons. The difference though, unlike Freemasonry, Anti Freemasons are "open books" to be read and examined. If the vast majority, nearly all stead fast anti masons, exhibit the traits I describe, then perhaps it is also possible to say that I am not in fact narrow minded but rather expressing a public demonstration that tends to carry across the spectrum of anti masons. They make judgements about what they do not understand, do not see, and have not experienced. I make judgements based on conversations that I am directly involved with.

I would say of course, I am very bias against antimasons and have a very short temper with them. In my defense to be ridiculed every day can cause of a thickening of distaste towards a specific genre of people.

But then again, I am also completely open to discussion. The OP made some valid points and questions to which I wrote a response.. there can be discussion and dialog, so long as both sides permit it. Notice I am not responding to anything else the OP'er has said, as it fits my description of antimasons to a T.

reply to post by Masonic Light

Sorry to be so vague, my ignorance is showing here but what I meant was, and from what my brain has collected over the years from various sources of information, the conclusion I came to was that a majority of the "foundations" of masonic identity, faith, belief, hierarchy(this ones important) and such comes from geometry.

I have seen a seven pointed star drawn in a continuous interconnecting line(not an outline drawing like the police star but still the same) in some artwork associated with the rosecrutions which. I admit I do not know the direct meaning of the symbol as it would be entirely subjective to the observer and to what they believe it would represent.

So, how does that relate to a police symbol? I cannot give a definitive answer but the fact alone that it is a very distinct shape which, now here is the tricky part folks, has been used in some form of organized ideology... freemasonry being one that uses symbolism more than any other than I have seen, Tibetan Buddhism being a close second, be it veiled in secrecy or not does not lead me to any other conclusion.

No offense but a compass and a square folks whaddya expect.

Expect. I expect those that have questions to ask and find out the true answers. I do not expect those who have questions to make up their own answers for the simple act of either easing or complicating their minds.

When i was younger I use to see a dead man's face in my bedroom closet door. It would look at me, it would laugh at me... when i was younger... today... that dead man is just a shape in cut of the wood.. nothing more.. nothing less.

reply to post by Rockpuck

"Saule Goode" as they say.

I'm surprised I still have a tongue after all the times I have had to bite it LOL

Originally posted by ThirtySecond
Expect. I expect those that have questions to ask and find out the true answers. I do not expect those who have questions to make up their own answers for the simple act of either easing or complicating their minds.

When i was younger I use to see a dead man's face in my bedroom closet door. It would look at me, it would laugh at me... when i was younger... today... that dead man is just a shape in cut of the wood.. nothing more.. nothing less.

Are you inferring that I typed my post to complicate or ease my mind? If so you are wrong It is simply an observation and a volleying of ideas through posts in a forum. I will ask a question to you: Is what I wrote the Truth?
Haha-Dead men don't laugh.

reply to post by liamoohay

Haha-Dead men don't laugh.

Are you so certain?

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by liamoohay

 

Haha-Dead men don't laugh.

Are you so certain?

No, but until I see one I will give you good odds on a bet that they don't.

reply to post by liamoohay



I don't cast judgements on that which I cannot see.




Ironically, anti Masons could imply the same philosophy.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by liamoohay

 

I don't cast judgements on that which I cannot see.

Ironically, anti Masons could imply the same philosophy.

I'm just razzin you along here, but would you walk into a fire if you could not see it?

The most symbols in Freemasonry are more complex than they look. As you know, We use geometry as a "text book" or even a "cheat sheet" of sorts to help us recall our lessons ( indiviual lessons or otherwise) You need to break down the shapes.. the angles and there you will find the reality of the symbol. No one symbol that is most common to a non-member is more important than another. Personally.. the seven point star you spoke of before is not linked to any branch of Masonry that I am apart of. I think you maybe confusing it with the eastern star which is a five pointed star.. the confusion is valid because the seven pointed star is often used in pagan sects and i have seen some even hold the similar colourings. With that being said, stars have long been used as a symbole of power, importance, or mystical meaning... why? Because for thousands upon thousands of years.. stars in the night sky have been all of those things to mankind. I would expect humans to use ( and yes i am a human) the same symbols to denote similar meaning even today.. be it personal, professional or government. Also know that I have not seen a seven pointed police badge.

( i hope that has anything to do with the question you asked)

Symbols you see are also basic things that are found in life. We just use them as stated above. My favourite symbol is the beehive and I see it every where I go in my day to day life. At the end of the day... our symbole.. or any symbol holds as much power as you allow it to. If you look at it and say.. hey.. thats pretty cool... then cool is the only power it has. If you look at it ( in the case the square and compass) you say.. yes that looks cool.. BUT... it really does help me remember how i should act, how i should conduct myself through out my day.. to my God, my family and to my craft.


EDIT: that thing laughed at me so much.. i would not want to go near my closet... if it was late at night I would get on my toy box and pee out my window so i didn't have to walk passed it.



[edit on 12-6-2008 by ThirtySecond]

[edit on 12-6-2008 by ThirtySecond]

reply to post by Rockpuck

BTW I have seen (for lack of any other explanation) a dead man's soul and he was not laughing.

Originally posted by ThirtySecond
The most symbols in Freemasonry are more complex than they look. As you know, We use geometry as a "text book" or even a "cheat sheet" of sorts to help us recall our lessons ( indiviual lessons or otherwise) You need to break down the shapes.. the angles and there you will find the reality of the symbole. No one symbole that is most common to a non-member is more important than another. Personally.. the seven point star you spoke of before is not linked to any branch of Masonry that I am apart of. I think you maybe confusing it with the eastern star which is a five pointed star.. the confusion is valid because the seven pointed star is often used in pagan sects and i have seen some even hold the similar colourings. With that being said, stars have long been used as a symbole of power, importance, or mystical meaning... why? Because for thousands upon thousands of years.. stars in the night sky have been all of those things to mankind. I would expect humans to use ( and yes i am a human) the same symboles to denote similar meaning even today.. be it personal, professional or government. Also know that I have not seen a seven pointed police badge.

( i hope that has anything to do with the question you asked)

Symbols you see are also basic things that are found in life. We just use them as stated above. My favourite symbole is the beehive and I see it every where I go in my day to day life. At the end of the day... our symbole.. or any symbole holds as much power as you allow it to. If you look at it and say.. hey.. thats pretty cool... then cool is the only power it has. If you look at it ( in the case the square and compass) you say.. yes that looks cool.. BUT... it really does help me remember how i should act, how i should conduct myself through out my day.. to my God, my family and to my craft.


EDIT: that thing laughed at me so much.. i would not want to go near my closet... if it was late at night I would get on my toy box and pee out my window so i didn't have to walk passed it.





[edit on 12-6-2008 by ThirtySecond]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. I completely understand you and don't get me wrong -just going by my previous posts.
I agree with a lot of what you are saying. And, going on what you wrote, you sound like a genuinely good person.
On the subject of the star/police reference I will try to elaborate on this when I have more time. This is not a cop out lol.
Also, why was it laughing at you?


[edit on 6/12/2008 by liamoohay]

reply to post by liamoohay

I'm just razzin you along here, but would you walk into a fire if you could not see it?

How would I avoid walking into fire if I cannot see it? Another little reference to Freemasonry, a member is to join with no awareness of what Freemasonry is to bring. Our initiates are to be "searching for the light" and are expected to go through three rituals without seeing anything around them, unaware of what is happening and putting trust into their guides without only sound to guide them. If more people in society trusted their fellow man, and searched for truth without fear of the unknown, and accepted the reconcibility to research for themselves the philosophies that guide our society, I do believe we, as a species, would be better off.

BTW I have seen (for lack of any other explanation) a dead man's soul and he was not laughing.

And I have looked into the eyes of a dead man and saw the last flicker of a laugh.