MODS – if I screw up the quoting .. please fix. I’m still not sure how to do it all.
So, BH, you are calling me out PERSONALLY?
I’m sure certain folks have already given you an ‘atta girl’ for that!
Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I challenge anyone to find anything in it that holds true to the chain email that made it out to be a racist rant.
I can't speak to that chain email. I don't think I've gotten it.
As for the thesis that Obama released -
Do you think it’s the real thesis – a full and uncorrupted version?
(we are dealing with politicians … I don’t trust any of them!
To go over that thesis page by page - that would be a long discussion.
Flyer's Fan, care to have a go? I would like to know exactly what part of this thesis is racist.
Honestly, It's 105 freak'n degrees today with a RED level pollution alert - and we are dealing with asthma issues .... I'm not in the mood. BUT
.. for you 'sweetie' ... I'll make some brief comments. (see how you are loved?
) I’m sure you’ll disagree with what I say .. but what
Screw any (allegedly) doctored email.
The original thesis has plenty of psychological and sociological issues to discuss.
What I see on that thesis (because you asked) – lots of grammatical errors. I see spelling and syntax errors as well. Also, a whole lotta’ self
esteem problems. Overall, I see a woman obsessed with her own skin color and deeply resentful that other people with black skin are happy being
Americans instead of identifying themselves as Africans Diaspora. (IMHO) She seems judgmental in this regard as well. I see a woman who is
self-segregating and who expects others with the same skin color to do the same. She is disappointed when other people with black skin don’t have
the same self-segregating attitude that she does. She sees integration as a PROBLEM instead of a positive natural progression.
From the thesis -
Just under 90 alums responded to the questionnaires (for a response rate of approximately 22 percent) and the conclusions were not what she
expected. "I hoped that these findings would help me conclude that despite the high degree of identification with whites as a result of the
educational and occupational path that black Princeton alumni follow, the alumni would still maintain a certain level of identification with the black
community. However, these findings do not support this possibility."
She ‘hoped’ that people with black skin would be self-segregating as she was. She was obviously disappointed to find that they are getting along
just fine in America without bitterly clinging (
) to where their ancestors were from hundreds of years ago.
Only 22 percent of the black population bothered to respond to the questionnaire? That’s rather low.
I have to wonder what the rest of the student population with black skin thought of the questionnaire. I’d like to see what was on that
questionnaire that had people not bothering to answer it. I can’t find any copies of the questionnaire on the internet.
describes the questionnaire as having – these type of questions
requesting the respondents define the amount of time and "comfort" level spent interacting with blacks and whites before they attended the
school, as well as during and after their University years. Other questions dealt with their individual religious beliefs, living arrangements,
careers, role models, economic status, and thoughts about lower class blacks. In addition, those surveyed were asked to choose whether they were more
in line with a "separationist and/or pluralist" viewpoint or an "integrationist and/or assimilationist" ideology.
In her thesis, Michelle Obama states that she’s much influenced by the definition of black "separationism" as offered by Stokely Carmichael and
Charles Hamilton in their 1967 Black Power: The Politics of Liberation in America.
Her quote – (she mentions Carmichael on page 7, then again on page 8)
“ Stokely Carmichael and Charles Hamilton’s (1967) developed the definition of separationism in their discussion of Black Power which
guided me in the formulation and use of this concept in the study.
Stokely Carmichael eventually went to Africa and renamed himself Kwame Toure. He hung with two of West Africa's failed dictators before coming back
to American and becoming a warm-up speaker for Louis Farrakhan in Madison Square Garden in 1985. I don’t know if she was already caught up in the
so-called ‘black liberation theology’ cult at this time … (kinda sounds like it)
She said that Princeton was majority white and that everything was based upon white people. The white population now is ~ 62%. I don’t know what
it was when she went in 1985. Somewhere in that thesis (I don’t remember where) she claims that blacks only started to be allowed to go there in
the 1960’s. This is wrong. Blacks were at Princeton in 1942.
From the thesis -
“By actually working with the Black lower class or within their communities as a result of their ideologies, a separationist may better
understand the desperation of their situation and feel more hopeless about a resolution as opposed to an integrationist who is ignorant to their
She’s slamming those who aren’t obsessed with their skin color. Those who understand that they are Americans instead of Africans Diaspora-ists
are now supposedly ignorant and/or uncaring. Guess white people must be uncaring or at least ignorant because they are not black? This is bigotry
and ignorance on her part. She’s lumping people all together based upon their life choices and their skin color. Anyways, that’s what I see.
From the thesis (page 2, I think)
Earlier in my college career, there was no doubt in my mind that as a member of the Black community I was somehow obligated to this community
and would use all of my present and future resources to benefit this community first and foremost. My experiences at Princeton have made me more aware
of my “Blackness” than ever before.
You asked what part of this is racist – well, there ya’ go. Black people come first. If I ran around saying I’d help white people first and
foremost, then I’d be called a bigot and a racist for using my position/color to help whites first and foremost. For her to use her
position/degree/color to help blacks ‘first and foremost’ … that’s bigotry and racism. As far as I’m concerned, she’s welcome to
‘help’ whoever she wants, whatever color skin they happen to have. I don’t care. But call it what it is … racism.
Thesis quote from page 54 –
Elements of Black culture which make it unique from White culture such as its music, its language, the struggles and a “consciousness”
shared by its people may be attributed to the injustices and oppression suffered by this race of people which are not comparable to the experiences of
any other race of people through this country’s history. However, with the increasing integration of Blacks into the mainstream society, many
“integrated Blacks” have lost touch with the Black culture in their attempts to become adjusted and comfortable in their new culture–the White
culture. Some of these Blacks are no longer able to enjoy the qualities which make Black culture so unique or are unable to share their culture openly
with other Blacks because they have become so far removed from these experiences and, in some instances, ashamed of them because of their integration.
Yikes. This is so full of *cough* that it’s hard to know where to begin.
1 – AOL blog
about this paragraph and more. Rather
2 – White culture is somehow a lesser culture then black culture? She makes that insinuation.
3 – Blacks suffered more than any other group in this country? Go ask a Native American Indian and I think he/she will tell a different story. Go
ask a Japanese prison camp survivor (if you can find any) and I think he/she will tell a different story.
4 – She calls the American melting pot – the “white culture”. That is wrong. There is no ‘dominant white culture’.
5 – She bemoans that black people have ‘lost touch’ with their black culture in an attempt to become adjusted to a ‘white culture’. So
she’s whining that they aren’t ‘black enough’?? That’s just being b****y black. Newsflash to Michelle – the melting pot culture is a
perfectly fine culture. If those people want to be part of it, that’s their right.
6 – She bemoans that those blacks who have successfully integrated. Frankly, IMHO, she just sounds like sour grapes. She self-segregated and now
she feels like the kid who isn’t invited to the neighbors birthday party, through no fault but her own.
ALL IN ALL – what you have in that college thesis is a person who has self esteem issues. Self segregation. Obsessed with her own skin color. A
chip on her shoulder and anger towards those who have her same skin color but who don’t think like she does. She’s got a very good life and two
FREE Ivy League college degrees (paid for by ‘the man’ - US Tax Payers). Sour grapes.
BTW – my 12 year old daughter wants to know why Obama keeps capitalizing the ‘b’ and the ‘w’ in her thesis. Good question. Are they proper
nouns? I don’t’ think so. Could be … but I don’t think so. She says they are adjectives. The dictionary is unclear on this.
You are welcome.
[edit on 6/10/2008 by FlyersFan]