Man killed after grabbing officer\

reply to post by toasted


Well said... Like you say, when these cops take jobs dealing with the public... they gotta know when to PULL BACK!

DO THEY ASK THESE QUESTIONS OF THEMSELVE'S??

"Why do I and three of my 250 pound badge-buddies have a strangle hold on a blind 90 year old woman who opened her door swinging her cane??"

HUH??

There was a famous case, ironically from GA, about a 90 year old black woman who did just this... and the trigger happy GOON's with GUN's blasted her with 100 rounds of ammo... Their excuse was... a bad batch of Krispy Kreme donuts...

reply to post by titorite



"" Personaly, I am not so concerned with the cops reasons for tazzing and then killing the perp as much as I am concerned with the other facts of this report. ""


DUDE ...!!!!!!! wtf?

you have a vaild reason to question the report on the multishot taser....

but this lack of concern for WHY they FEEL the NEED to ASSAULT someone who is NOT A THREAT to their SAFETY...

THAT, you don't even care about!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!.........



You got some serious issues...

Poor, guy, guess this is what happens when you give these punk a-hole cops a taste of there own medicine, ya get killed. Honestly, I kinda sympothize for cops though, I think they are being brainwashed, maybe they are given crazy pills or somethin' or of course it could be all the illegal drugs about over half of all the nation's popo's are coked up on.

-Jimmy

Originally posted by ybab hsur
reply to post by jackinthebox

 

Okay, i think i see what you're trying to say, so that poses a new question for me, and please do correct me if im wrong in my assumption of your mentality

Q.)
If a police officer tells you to do something, and you feel as though what that officer is telling you to do is violating your rights, what makes you feel compelled to "fight the power" if you have done nothing wrong?
By how i interpret your mentality on the issue, i would have to say "wouldnt it be better to just do what they say, and be on your way" than to fight the power and make things worse for you?


Fact:
A police officer cannot be spittin rays of sunshine out of his hindquarters. Police officers are trained to be firm and direct, this is to shy away those more cowardly criminals. So the next time an officer says

'would you please step out of the vehicle and put your hands on your head'
you should do it - especially if you've done nothing wrong.

Uhh, no. If you're caught breaking the law and the officer has seen you do it, then yes, you should get out of the car and do as he says, but if you're just being pulled over you can simply turn off your engine, roll down the driver window a tad to give the LEO your license and insurance papers, but thats about it. You don't have to consent to a search unless you are being arrested, so simply ask "am I being detained?" And if the answer isn't yes, you are free to leave. If an officer threatens to bring backup unless you cooperate, simply repeat "am I being detained?" And unless he says yes, you're free to leave.

And on the subject of officers demanding to see an ID, in most states and cities this is illegal unless you have been identified as a suspect, but even then you can refuse to show ID. You'll likely be arrested as a john doe if you 're the suspect of a crime though.

reply to post by toasted


I do have issues toasted. I have an issue with homicidal cops. I have an issue the a lying news media that covers up police brutality. I have an issue with them reporting falsehoods. I have an issue with the majority of America not questioning any of it or asking for justice.

Yes I have issues.

Originally posted by titorite
reply to post by toasted

 

I have an issue the a lying news media that covers up police brutality. I have an issue with them reporting falsehoods.

Sorry that was the most hilarious thing I've ever read. You do realize the media HATES police and do everything in their power to make them look bad, right?

Most recent example I can cite is a local police brutality story locally, a video got leaked of an officer punching a criminal. Of course, the media only showed on the news the part where the officer was punching him, and left out the part where the criminal was attacking him with a knife and trying to cut his neck. They made the officer out to be some suicidal maniac that had a vendetta against the world.


[edit on 8-6-2008 by AgentScmidt]

A lot of the narrow minded comments here bashing on cops and incorporating unrelated stories to support it just ticks me off in threads like these.
What would your first reaction be to seeing someone rip out the taser and come at you? Personally, my very next move would be for my gun.
The same mentality applies to a 3 on 1 fight. This guy was obviously too much for them to handle because of his size, mentality and whatever he was on. The only thing that was going to work would be shooting him.

Tasers, when used properly, are designed to incapacitate the target in 3 seconds. However, doing some research shows that they CAN kill. It has become less of an occurance as the technology has gotten better, but it can still happen and it is instantaneous.
The between of incapicitance and death is serious injury and hospitalization.

As a police officer knowing this, staring at some madman wielding this weapon on a fellow officer, I hold no grudge against his decision to use his sidearm.
As to killing him, without the entire story, there is no proof of intent to kill by the officer. Bullets riccochet off bone and take really weird paths through the soft tissue inside the body. A bullet fired into your thigh can end up in your heart or lungs killing you, just like one fired into your face can come out the side of your jaw or below you mouth, doing minimal damage (an instance I have seen happen).

So, roll up the "Jump to Conclussions" mat and do a little research before you scream at the cops for cold blooded killing. They are not all Gestapo SS Militia raiders looking to suppress personal free right to life.

There was another fatal shooting in AZ today. This time the suspect refused to drop his handgun and pointed it at the officer and he was shot dead. Sounds like the police did everything they could to prevent this one, it just ended bad cause the perp made a dumb mistake. But at the end of the article it says there has been 6 officer involved shootings this year in Mesa, not AZ, but the city of Mesa. And 5 of these cases have been fatal.

Im not insinuiating (sp?) anything but is that a lot of officer involved fatalities for one year? I have no idea this is an honest question directed towards the police officers here with us at ATS with no disrespect intended.

reply to post by ybab hsur


To be corrupt or not and take ones life either way is equally unjust, maybe looked like he was armed from the description and that's the reason but i don't know how they calculate the situation before freeing a person the instructiono to gun a man dead.

they should ban permits on guns and only have special police forces carry them in my opinion, would prevent accidents like this.

reply to post by wheresthetruth


And yet you have nothing to say about the perp fireing the tazer multiple times when it is only a single shot weapon. Why?

The story has a hole in the plot.

Did you even read it?

As it was reported, the perp took the tazer from the cop that fired it at him and then began to shoot the tazer at the cops..... HOW!?!??

What did the perp throw the probes at the cops again and again?

I know the AZPD are not useing any kind of special tazer that can fire round after round of tazer probes.

The story stinks. we are not getting the whole story. and the news media are failing to do thier job by questioning the cops story because You can not fire a tazer like a revolver.

reply to post by thegdfather


To you who says that 3 against 1 isn't a fair fight. I am a police officer and with all the restrictions on us and all the rights given to criminals, you have NO IDEA what it is like to be involved in a fight while on patrol. Especially when you have to follow a stupid specific protocol when you get attacked and leave yourself open to get seriously hurt or killed. You have NO IDEA when it will be your last day on earth on this job. We go through that stress everyday for a minimal amount of money to protect and serve the community and of course, YOU! Don't even pass a little judgement on us until you go spend a night in the inner city on patrol. I guarantee you the first scuffle or scare you get, you would shoot to kill and try to save your life, protect someone else's life and to get back to your children, wife and family. You would piss your pants. Too many good officers have lost their life in this similar situation because of the criminal's rights. Maybe this person was freaked out on Meth (which I see on a nightly basis). These people feel no pain and have enormous amounts of strength and sometime it takes 4 or 5 officers to subdue this person!! All it would take is for this person to get a hold of one of the officer's guns and shoot him or her. Then what? Forget that, he chose (like 99% of the people who resist and break the law) his behavior and that criminal behavior produces consequences HE brought on himself. Go spend a night in the inner city first, then pass judgement. That person deserve to get shot. God Bless those officers for taking the proper directon and action. I am glad they weren't hurt. Furthermore, yes there are some corrupt officers (as you will get in any organization), but it is NEVER corrupt when you are in fear for your life. Again, you have no idea the crap we see and deal with on a nightly basis.

reply to post by jimmyjackblack


Hey Jimmy, You think 3 against 1 isn't a fair fight and you call us a punk A hole cops. I am a police officer and with all the restrictions on us and all the rights given to criminals, you have NO IDEA what it is like to be involved in a fight while on patrol. Especially when you have to follow a stupid specific protocol when you get attacked and leave yourself open to get seriously hurt or killed. You have NO IDEA when it will be your last day on earth on this job. We go through that stress everyday for a minimal amount of money to protect and serve the community and of course, YOU! Don't even pass a little judgement on us until you go spend a night in the inner city on patrol. I guarantee you the first scuffle or scare you get, you would shoot to kill and try to save your life, protect someone else's life and to get back to your children, wife and family. You would piss your pants. Too many good officers have lost their life in this similar situation because of the criminal's rights. Maybe this person was freaked out on Meth (which I see on a nightly basis). These people feel no pain and have enormous amounts of strength and sometime it takes 4 or 5 officers to subdue this person!! All it would take is for this person to get a hold of one of the officer's guns and shoot him or her. Then what? Forget that, he chose (like 99% of the people who resist and break the law) his behavior and that criminal behavior produces consequences HE brought on himself. Go spend a night in the inner city first, then pass judgement. That person deserve to get shot. God Bless those officers for taking the proper directon and action. I am glad they weren't hurt. Furthermore, yes there are some corrupt officers (as you will get in any organization), but it is NEVER corrupt when you are in fear for your life. Again, you have no idea the crap we see and deal with on a nightly basis. Also Jimmy, if you ever get mugged, robbed or need the cops in any way shape or form, back up your words and DONT EVER CALL FOR HELP FROM US Please do us a favor. We don't want to endanger our lives to save a punk like you. Maybe you should die and make this world a better place you jack ass

reply to post by trs10


Starred your post trs10, well said. And thank you for bravely serving.

reply to post by trs10


I actually felt for you and understood the cops perspective a lot more with your post, thank you for your service. That was until the last two lines of your post. Good to know this is the type of person who walks around with a weapon and is supposed to protect us.

Your a police officer, your supposed to be the gleaming model in our society. Not athletes, rappers, and celebrities. Don't stoop so low by wishing someone death, it takes away your credibility and im sure tarnishes the perception and reception to the good cops that do exist.

reply to post by trs10


Whilst i agree with what these officers did and th majority of your post it's the bottom few lines that worried me. To think someone with such a low patience level is allowed to carry a pistol. Many of the british police i've encountered are patient souls who can diffuse a situation, i wonder if you could do the same or would you shout someone down as so many of the american police tend to do.

the cops werent in danger of the taser. i mean its not a lethal weapon, right? how are they gunna justify using lethal force when the deceased didnt present lethal force?

reply to post by C0le


Actually that is incorrect Most Tasers these days such as the X26 and J models are able to fire a set of prongs but also have a touch pad, so that they will be able to be used if a suspect pulls the prongs from his/her person before the electrical delivery

reply to post by birchtree


You know I mention that earlier when I was questioning this story.

Perp gets shot. Perp pulls out probes. Perp manages to get the tazer somehow???

At this point he can run upto the officers and stun them by jabbing the gun into but still he can only get one person at a time leaving plenty of time and opportunity for the other officer to beat him, mace him, or shoot him dead..

BUT FOR SURE the perp could not fire the discharged tazer multiple times...

That said why was the story reported otherwise? Why didn't the news reporter question that aspect of the officers story?

God knows, not you nor I but I think we can agree that we are not getting the whole story....and that certain aspects of the story are at the very least "questionable".

reply to post by ImaginaryReality1984


That is the biggest problem with law-enforcement in America today. Too many officers are too impatient to resolve a matter with their brains. Instead, the slightest percieved challenge to their authority almost always leads to a tactical response.

Take the cop who tasered the kid in front of his family over a stupid speeding ticket. The cop just didn't want to be bothered. He should have just taken the few extra minutes to humor the idiot, and maybe actually explain how the law worked in that case. That he could argue it out in court, that the signature was not an admission of guilt, etc.

One of the things that really pisses me off about this video is how the cop actually seems like he probably isn't really a bad guy. Just did his job wrong.



All he had to do was warn the kid that he would be arrested if he didn't sign.

[edit on 6/8/0808 by jackinthebox]

reply to post by kidney thief


Because they were being attacked. You can't allow a perp to disarm you, or you're the one who winds up dead.

If you are carrying as a civilian, and you are physically attacked by someone, even if they don't have a weapon, you have the right to shoot them.