Europeans View America as a 'Force For Evil' Under Bush

Originally posted by Alethia
reply to post by alienstar

 

How would you feel having a French Army base in the US? Furthermore, how would you feel if you found out that French Army base was transporting prisoners through the US because it wanted to conduct torture techniques that were illegal in France?

I must say, as an American I don't think other Americans would like to have a permanent presence of another government's military here. It would be hypocritical to think people (in other countries) would be okay with us doing the same.





[edit on 7-6-2008 by mysterychicken]

reply to post by alienstar


I'm not French dude, I was making a point. How would you feel if another country was conducting military activity in the US?

Also, I really don't think, with the EU & NATO and all, that Europe needs American base's for their protection, they have nukes too, they can protect themselves.

Finally, if you really think the US people have no control over the government going to war, then you are saying the US people have no control over government whatsoever, and it is now controlled by a dictatorship, in direct contravention of the US constitution, and which is kind of funny, considering Bush has said he'd have it easier being a dictator.

Originally posted by Alethia

 

Finally, if you really think the US people have no control over the government going to war, then you are saying the US people have no control over government whatsoever, and it is now controlled by a dictatorship, in direct contravention of the US constitution, and which is kind of funny, considering Bush has said he'd have it easier being a dictator.

In all reality we don't have much power in those things. Our options? Start massive rioting so we can get gunned down or imprisoned?
Not saying that's not an option just that we better be darned sure we're ready for the consequences.



[edit on 7-6-2008 by mysterychicken]

I didnt vote for Bush...and protesting wars are not my thing.Other then that,we have no control over military options.

I can't think of many people here that would be cool with someone elses military base here, but then again, none of us were alive to ever know anything different. So not the best comparison people. The Brits and French did have bases here once upon a time, if I'm not mistaken.

Hey, who ever ripped on the BBC that was just wrong.

Also, isn't it kind of interesting that in this global shrinkage that we all have more in common than not? I mean the Brits and other Europeans here on the thread are effected by our President. The world is effected.
So this could be just as much a debate between Democrats and Republicans as between American's and anyone else.

If it didn't effect them, they would simply say "too bad for you chaps" or something like that. But they are as pissed off about Bush and this administration as we are?

Maybe we should hand out like 2 electoral votes per Country outside the U.S. Let them help decide which schmuck we "ALL" get stuck with.

We are all in this together.

[edit on 7-6-2008 by Res Ipsa]

People either dont know or just assume the us citizens have control over on which the military or government controls its affairs.SORRY WE DONT!The president gets voted in and we really dont have control over who gets voted in much either.

Just be glad europeans do not kill americans because some of the tommys think it is really cool to join the army and do some happy triggering.
what is the problem with some of you guys?

can't you understand that at least some people in europe and eurasia are angry about the NWO-puppies killing all around the world innocent people?

besides that, this president (or in this case his councellors) is not missing any situation in which he could try to ignite a third world war.
AND, what would you say if europe would arrest all of the militia coming from USA, before they can hop in their bomber or tank to make new enemies or raise the death toll in iraq and around?!

well, now you would say:
"dare to arrest some of our mighty peacekeeping/maker force! we instantly will bomb your country into the stoneage"

aha! again, there you see: if some of other states decide to do something against the brave gi joe, the whole population of this country has to starve or die.
how long did saddam rule over the iraqis? in the eyes of the bush administration, he did a hell of a good job, up to the day, he started to switch from dollar to euro.
THAT was his crime, NOT the killing of his own people.

also, very very nice to see how many death sentences are still spoken in this land of the good (USA). this shows me how superior USA is.

but i am not saying that i do not like american citicens.
but what i find very annoying is the thinking that they/you are the cure for everything. that just this place is gods country, you are the chosen one.
O GOD, this is not the first time a country thinks that, and i am not talking of the germans...
i would recommend the usa to take care about their own business, and do not interfere anymore.
because otherwise, this megalomaniac country will get a slap on the hands, a broken nose or eben a broken wing.


edit: spelling

please dont be offended, i just wnat to show how many of "us" see it.

[edit on 7/6/2008 by rxnnxs]

Originally posted by neformore

You don't get it. He didn't have to do anything with a budget.

No, I do get it. The entirety of the world's ills can all be boiled down to the fact that we went to war in Iraq five years ago. You don't find that as kind of a cop-out?

The biggest thing to go downhill because of the Iraq war is the world's opinion of the US, as apparent in the survey that this thread is about.

The problems with the US economy have existed for a very long time. I think the war is more of a distraction from that than anything. In other words the dollar would be collapsing without the invasion of Iraq. Which is result of bad monetary policy. Which is the real cause of the world wide "depression" (which isn't actually a depression).

But to suggest that one man and one nation is the cause of all of the world's problems economic or otherwise hides many of the underlying factors within the international community and global economy that have also existed for a very long time.

Hell, that takes a lot of world leaders off the hook.

The reality is the US federal government was NEVER supposed to have so much power. We were supposed to be a union of relatively sovereign states.
When a system is set up people will find ways to work the system.

I think Thomas Jefferson knew that :

God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion.
The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is
wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts
they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions,
it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ...
And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not
warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of
resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as
to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost
in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from
time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
It is its natural manure.

The trouble is that most Americans don't know or care what their government does around the world. They watch their own news, get spoon fed the propaganda and carry on because its easier to believe that they're a force of good. Finding out takes time, effort and a bit of brains. Most Americans I've met are so brainwashed its incredible. Spew out the standard government lines and get angry if you challenge it. Carry on believing their a force for good in the world, yet sew on a Canadian flag to their backpacks when they travel.

Originally posted by Retseh
By "Europeans" we really seem to be talking about the British here. As a nation, they are an easily influenced people in my experience, and with the BBC and other liberal news sources continually looking for new ways to attack the United States, they are now slaves to their own propaganda.

Yeah fox news too buddy...

It never ceases to amaze me that with all the genuine evil in the world, the British are still obsessed by every ill advised or questionable move the US makes, the cause of this mass stupidity is one of the few genuine conspiracies in this world..

This 'mass stupidity' flooded over here from the states... sorry but that's true.
As an 80's child I remember the fleeting differences between english culture and the American culture, how everything that came from over their seemed to be colourful, stylish, big and loud...

Oh, how our generation wanted to be like you lot, but you know what... We grew out of that childish phase, we changed... or at least most of us did, the problems that remain in our society come from several broad styles of americanism... but it all boils down to greed, capitalism, consumerism, ego's and attitude.

But to say that I must be anti-american right?
Our idiotic youth are becoming like you lot...

Since the UK along with France is steadily sliding from a condition of delusional socialism into that of a Muslim satellite state, these anti-American opinions are only going to harden over time and become increasingly scathing. Although it will be hilarious to watch the British try to deal with the concept of Barack Obama as US president, since criticism of minorities is simply unacceptable in their fevered PC directed minds..

Funny how it's you who's bringing up the racial issue here.
Maybe it's you with the problem?

Criticise who you want, colour is not the issue here buddy, although his political agenda is.

For all the British hatred of the US, it is perhaps interesting to count the ever increasing number of Brits trying (and regrettably succeeding) in emigrating to the US. I hear their emigration statistics are the highest on record for 2007, perhaps they are just trying to export their successful socialist policies to other nations

.

Yeah and Spain, france, Australia, India, Canada, etc etc... more people are being born, flights are cheaper, people wanna see the world, unlike certain people on this thread who believe America is the ONLY place on the planet.

Go cluster bomb a deer or something.

I think us Americans should chalk this up to um who cares what the world thinks?Cant change ones point of view once its set in stone.Each individual could find something to hate about someone,including Americans hating on other countries.I dont hate.So for you all reading this..dont let one pickle(our current president) ruin the dang jar.

reply to post by alienstar


One reason. Our increasing dependency on the world as a whole. We are (sadly) no longer a self-sufficient nation.
While I agree that "this too shall pass" we do have to concern ourselves with how we are viewed.

[edit on 7-6-2008 by mysterychicken]

Europeans need to clean up their own door steps before looking at ours. You have whole parts of your countries being taken over by Muslims and your governments are starting to bend to the Muslim rule of law. Have your hate America day while it lasts....

There may come a time when we get a President in the USA (Obama) who will not want to join in a conflict no matter how righteous the cause. I really hope that day comes. I hope entire cities burn over there.

This is not to say I want my fellow westerners to suffer. It’s so we can finally understand what left liberal leaning ideology really means to the world. It really means peace at all costs including loss of freedoms. It includes living under the banner of terror while the criminal is coddled.

Yes, continue to despise us and you will get exactly what you want as your cities burn. I really think that's why we are leaning left in the world of politics. With 2012 right around the corner I can see a time in the near future where once mighty countries sit idle while terror reigns until it’s too late to combat the threat.

Have your fun in your gunless Godless countries. Just don't expect us to sympathize while you die by the millions. Personally I say piss off to the lot of you europeans. That's why we left in the first place...

reply to post by Perplexed


Wow, bigotry in action. Yeah, we left Europe, but we did kill an entire population of people when we got to the US, called the native Americans. Hard to call the Europeans a-holes when we were prepared to kill others to get what we want.

And what have guns got to do with it? How does having a gun make society better? Did you forget Columbine and Virgina Tech? Hell, the right to bear arms was written into the constitution to make sure that we could defend ourselves, not only from each other, but from our own government if need be, you just need to read up on Thomas Jefferson to know that. Yet, even though we still have guns, as alienstar has said, it doesn't stop our government from taking things from others, even though TJ had given us the right to not have that happen.

Finally, Godless countries. Italy is Godless? Is the Vatican City just a dream? Or is just that it's not your God, and therefore no good?

Thanks man, you could've come on here and defended the US against these accusations, but you just added fuel to the fire. WAY TO GO!

I am pretty darn loyal when it comes to the U.S, even want us to become stronger allies post-Bush. I have to say I can't help but get my back up when I hear idotic comments against everyone else. Yes we have our differences but because some stupid report comes out Yanks get offended and it's you against the world yet again! I know many a person against the current U.S leadership but that has nothing to do with the people.

I think I need to stay away from this thread as it's turning into a petty catfight- back to discussion please!!

So were considered evil because of our bad government, and Iran is consiered evil because of there government, and they cant change it because there leaders cant be removed. So what the dif we cant remove these people when we want, why is our government not considered dictators. You say we get to elect every four years but basicly get the same type people. Can anyone explain it.

Originally posted by Alethia
reply to post by Perplexed

 

Wow, bigotry in action. Yeah, we left Europe, but we did kill an entire population of people when we got to the US, called the native Americans. Hard to call the Europeans a-holes when we were prepared to kill others to get what we want.

And what have guns got to do with it? How does having a gun make society better? Did you forget Columbine and Virgina Tech? Hell, the right to bear arms was written into the constitution to make sure that we could defend ourselves, not only from each other, but from our own government if need be, you just need to read up on Thomas Jefferson to know that. Yet, even though we still have guns, as alienstar has said, it doesn't stop our government from taking things from others, even though TJ had given us the right to not have that happen.

Finally, Godless countries. Italy is Godless? Is the Vatican City just a dream? Or is just that it's not your God, and therefore no good?

Thanks man, you could've come on here and defended the US against these accusations, but you just added fuel to the fire. WAY TO GO!

These anti-American, anti-Christian threads are a joke. They turn a blind eye while the whole of Europe is being taken over by Muslims but blame the US for everything thats wrong with the world and I'm adding fuel to the fire? Whatever... When Obama is elected that will be the signal for Mislims to go on a bloody rampage. Have fun in your Godless Gunless countires.

reply to post by Perplexed


You do realize that Islam is the 2nd most common religion in the world right? You also realize there are Muslim citizens of the United States right?
You also realize there are Muslim soliders fighting on behalf of their countries (European countries and the USA) right?
You realize that being a religion will not necessarily mean you will come to arms if a leader in your religion says so right?
Do you think all Christians would start attacking another group if one minister or even a bunch told them to?

The Aum Shinrikyo cult used Christian Revelation as a reason for their sarin attacks but that doesn't implicate Christians does it?



[edit on 7-6-2008 by mysterychicken]

As somebody mentioned earlier, Britain and the USA are in the same boat. The governments of both countries are resorting to shocking policies to keep the countries at the top of the pyramid, eg, Wars. With the growing influence of Russia, China and India do you really expect Britain and the USA just to sit back and watch them fall behind? These two great countries will do everything in their power to keep at the top.

It's inevitable though, it will all end in tears. Our governments actually think they're doing the correct thing for the people I fear for the future generations of our countries.

You reap what you sow.